240hoke

Hey Guys, I have been considering selling my car on and off for some time now. Now that the car is almost complete I have really been enjoying driving it. I have most of the kinks worked out and have been able to put some miles on her. However throughout the 4 year building process I have learned so many things, and there are many things that I would like to redo again to the best of my abilities...many items on my list are large and require tearing the car completely down, like a full repaint. I am a pretty particular person and doing things myself makes it even worse because I realise all the areas that I could have improved or done better. So what I'm trying to decide is, should I sell the car and start fresh with a new project (probably another 240z). Or keep re-doing everything that I have already done... essentially throwing away the money and labor that I have already spent on the car. A lot of the things that I want to re-do really don't need to be changed (like the paint). I'm sure that somebody would be extremely happy to have paint as good as mine. Ive always had the dream to fly out the California or the midwest and buy a really nice bone stock 240z and drive it back across the country. Then start modifying it from there. One of the main things that worries me about selling the car is the fact that I'm about to move on to another stage of my life and I worry that I wont have the time or money to do what I have done so far and I would end up with a 10 year project. Which brings me to another option, sometimes I feel like I spend too much time focusing on my car in the garage and it might be wise to buy a fun car (like a lotus) and play with it for a while until I can afford to build the true 240z of my dreams. Some of you may say just keep it and enjoy it, but thats hard for me!! If I have something sitting there I like messing with it and changing things. If I keep it Ill soon have a turbo to go with the header flanges that are sitting on the desk beside me right now! Anyway Im rambling now My baby:

Do not mount it abouve the floor. I think you will regret the decision for a long time (I have). I want my floor space back and if you stick it through the floor you will definitely have to make a sheet metal cover for it so you have a 'bulkhead' between you and the tank. I am going to redo my cell when money permits and run a fuel safe unit completely under the floor and hook it back to the factory filler location. I also will run a in tank pump. Whatever you do make sure you get a cell with an excellent baffle and sump setup. I have been running a Jeg's cell and it is the biggest piece of junk in the world.... I wish I would have never removed the factory tank.

Yea, Mine doesnt sit over winter...as long as there isnt ice on the roads I ride

Project -- My 1971 240z: Daily Drivers -- My 03 350z (Track Edition) & 07 Yamaha YZF-R6C, R6 Usually gets the DD task up at school year round: Gotta Represent!

Door clearance is great, but because if this the shoulders are too narrow for most. Great for small people or girls. I would definitly measure your shoulders and check with there deminsions before ordering. I am thinking about selling mine if you are interested.

As always beautiful work Monzter! What is the first arm for?

Agreed Jon, I have no plans for a double wish bone setup! I was suggesting somebody else come up with it Im about to get into Milliken, it happens to be sitting right beside me. I got the book and the companion workbook and have been trying to go through it. It is definitly a sweet reference. The more I think about the taco gussets they really wouldn't be bad to fabricate, especially if I am making a production run. Modeling them as sheetmetal and then getting them water jet would be easy enough. Might do double flat plates for the prototypes, like you suggest.

I like your idea Dave but several things come to mind right off hand. 1.) Extremely hard to make fine adjustments on car at the alignment rack 2.) Weight, Granted you can take ALOT out of what you have drawn 3.) All the solid machined components are going to be expensive especially at the tolerances you will need to make it rigid and not rattle around 4.) Wear, Kingpin and slot will take alot of wear quick more then likely and then the arm will be ruined 5.) Im not sure I see the advantage of where you have the pivot point, unless you can put it inline with the strut its still going to slightly miss align the strut like the toe link When you model tube assemblies like that are you building each tube as an assembly or merging several extrudes and then separating them? Ive swtich over to Pro-E and am am pretty noob with tube work....so this is giving me some practice. I am definitly going to move the front outboard rod end forward to allow the use of spacers to shim the strut forward and backward to ensure that it can be aligned properly. I am of the opinion that LCA was never ment to handle twist or moment loading, nor will it ever do a good job of it. I think to really get things "right" a entire new suspension design is in order. Bolt in double wishbone setup....anybody want to hop on this Also on the taco gussets, I obviously see the advantage from a stress standpoint. But I also think they came into being because of the use of lightweight thin wall tubing. Depending on the tubing thickness and the stresses in the structure, I would have to argue that flat gussets still have there place in some circumstances (purely from a functional and manufacturing standpoint, not from a best standpoint) Right now I need to determine whether I want to focus on a lightweight and expensive arm, or a slightly heavier easier arm which would be easier to produce and much more affordable. This will all be decided after stress calcs as 1020 may prove actually be more practical. I personally don't compete with my car and it is mainly driven on the street, so weight is not a huge issue for me. How much is to worth to you guys? My biggest goal is easy on car adjustment and easy installation and removal.

No I havent, thanks for the link looks like it will be a good read.

Nor will a solid rod end, the toe link also only needs to move when adjusting. I used a clevis to l help limit twisting, which hopefully there wont be much of regardless. Addressed in first post. Doubly note, and I completely agree. Will probably move to a solid rear heim, to help distribute lateral toe link loads and use taco guessets as Jon suggested. I was thinking purely from an ease of fabrication stand point , not my goal here. I might have to keep these a secret then...j/k. Hopefully ill have time this week to crunch some numbers. I was doing rough calcs for the rod ends with a 2500lb car 1g forward, 1.5g lateral. Keep the criticism's and suggestions coming!

Hey Jon, Thanks for your input, just the kinda of feedback i was looking for. I have looked at the 3/4 shank rod ends and actually the critical area seems to be in the metal around the rod ends. The 5/8" HD rod ends have a larger outer diameter and are rated exactly the same as the 3/4 shank ones. I originally drew it with 3/4 shank but when I found the HD 5/8" I switched back, less clutter, less weight, same price. I should note that the outboard rod ends are not solid as they are drawn, I have just drawn the critical dimensions for modeling purposes so they appear solid, maybe this lead to some confusion? If they were solid I agree it would be a terrible design. The Clevis acts exactly the same as a solid rod end would; it allows the toe link to swing side to side but not cock when adjusted like a standard rod end does. I have initially choosen to use the clevis because its is easier to fabricate the mounts for it, they will both be similar strength and place the bolt in double shear. The clevis is a 5/8" shank with a 1/2" thru holes, a 1/2" grade 8 bolt in double shear is rated much higher then the outboard rod ends. One advantage of using an inboard solid rod end is that it would spread the load out on the tube. Definitly something to think about. I definitely like the taco guessets, Ill switch over to that in the final design. Im just trying to move out of the 70's anyway 10 years is a good step forward

Hey Guys, I've really been wanting to get the rear end of my car adjustable and squared up. After weighing the options out there I wasn't to happy with what was available. Ive starting working on my own rear LCA design. Similiar to what Myron build for his car I plan to use a classic A-Arm design. One of the main benifits of the a-arms is the use of a toe link which prevents binding with toe adjustment. A large drawback however is that all the acceleration forces go through the single Rod end at the front, however with proper sized tubing and high quality rod ends this isn't a problem. Here is what I have come up with so far: - The arm itself will be JIG constructed with 4130 Chromo Tube (TIG'd and stress relieved) - Rod ends will be QA1 5/8" Heaby Duty Alloy (Radial UTS 40kips) - Custom double adjuster for easy on car adjustability I have done some rough load calculations and found that the Heavy duty alloy rod ends are mandatory for a A-arm design. Even with a H-arms standard rod ends would be borderline. I am still working on the load calculations to determine the exact wall thickness for the tubing. Youll notice the lack of endlink mount too, Right now Im looking at mounting the end link to an outboard gusset. I am hoping to make a rod end swaybar endlink with adapters to work with the horizontal sway bar holes. The end link location will be adjustable fore and aft to ensure the link is perpindicular with the ground no matter what setup you are running. More then likely Ill stick with Urethane inner bushing to keep some compliance in the setup. I wanted to throw this out there and see what tips and advice ya'll might have. I plan on making a few prototype sets and testing them out for a while and then I will more then likely start producing them since I will have a jig ready to roll.

I would run 2.5" with a baffled (Turbo) muffler in the back and then an additional straight thru "resonator" in the middle as most have said. You can get mufflers that are not glass packs, but SS and last a very long time. If you are N/A the only real way to keep it quiet is to have a baffled muffler. I have to ask though...why not just be easy on it when you are coming and going. I run straight thru mufflers on my 3.5 and she is really quiet at idle but screams when I put my foot down. Oh and you have one last option...put a turbo on it....they are great mufflers, especially the tiny stock t3's.

Looking good, she is gonna be pretty when you are finished. Just know that its a long project and dont rush it towards the end! And I have to ask why all the work and you still havent removed your brakes and mustache bar lol. Im envious of 280z owners btw...having a shell still that clean after 35 years or so is awesome.

Your Exactly right Savage, I should have noted my setup. I didn't have the issue as much when I was running 255 MT DR's but now that I am on 245 street rubber the chatter and pushing was much more pronounced.

Okay I finally got everything finished up a couple weekends ago. Heres what I did for shimming: I decided to shim the rotor since this to me was easier to do. I bought several different sizes of stainless steel shims from Mcmaster (.001,.002,.004,and .005). I then cut them down a bit so they didnt stick out from the hat. I then set up my dial indicator as close as I could to the hat. I found the place with the least run out and marked it as 0, then as I spun it I wrote the runout at each bolt. I then installed all the shims at once. It was really close on the first try and with a couple adjustments I got the rotor to about .0015in of runout. My measuring setup wasnt any more accurate then that so I was pretty happy. I ended up buying the Bear 1/4" wheel spacers. I had to have the center of the front turned out a bit to clear the hubs. I also went through my rear suspension "while I was at it" and put in long ARP studs in the back as well. I also replaced the hex head caliper mount bracket bolts with socket head ones....so they actually can be tightened and torqued properly. Anyway the brakes are very smooth. Im still working out a few kinks though...my Drivers front is locking up way before my passengers front. Im hoping this is just a bleeding issue as I bleed them real quick to make it to auofair. Next time I am home Ill rebleed thoroughly and then see how she does. hopefully then I can bed the pads in and see how these baby's are.

I recently finished taking my rear end apart and checking everything out. I ended up not liking the shimmed diff for the street. The diff had serious chatter, and caused the car to understeer. When going around tight corners I could feel the rear end just pushing me. I removed all the shims, dropping it back down to about 40ft/lbs of breakaway. I am now using Redline NS oil with additional friction modifier. I am very happy with the results. I honestly dont know how many miles I put on hte car since I added the clutches, I would guess around 5K or so. I didnt see any significant wear or galling at all, just the blue surface has worn a bit.

Id drive it, but I wouldnt ever buy one....that color combination and package in general looks terrible. I loved the last model with the black on orange.

I ran a good bit of timing advance and alot of fuel at idle. I believe I was at 20deg adv with 10.5:1 fuel idling at around 800 or so. Ran pretty smooth.

Just cut the spacers down in between the end links to change the over all height and it should clear. Mine clears fine, but I am using the 240z rear mounted bar....might can switch to that if the front bar doesn't work out.

Haha...I kinda agree. They are not the smartest choice of wheel by far for 'performance'. But for me as a owner of a set of Wat's I just love the look and I personally don't think there is a better wheel for the car..style wise. However In the future I will probably be replacing my Wats with something I can actually buy a decent set of tires for... 17's.

Anybody...pleaaaassseeee I guess Ill have to track down a manual or just put em back together. Going with position 1 makes them the shortest and I don't feel any binding so Ill prolly go with that.

Kuhmo Ectsa XS 265/45/r16 (168): http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Kumho&tireModel=Ecsta+XS&partnum=645WR6EXS&vehicleSearch=false&fromCompare1=yes BFG G-Force Sport 255/50/r16 ($118): http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=BFGoodrich&tireModel=g-Force+Sport&partnum=55WR6GFSP&vehicleSearch=false&fromCompare1=yes You can also get Victoracer V700's which might be okay for a non DD.

Yea looks really nice! I love how you molded the front air dam out to match.

Just thought I would through a link in here to my old splitter thread. Looks very similar to yours. http://forums.hybridz.org/showthread.php?t=110961&highlight=splitter If anything I thought it made the car more unstable....I need to bolt it back on and do some more testing though.