260z L28et Build (first build newb)

[Co0ke]

So i've had a 260z for about 2 years now. Have just been doing maintanance and keeping it running. I had originally planning on an NA build with my goal set around 200rwhp. But after alot of thought I decided the turbo build was way more cost effective. The other day I located a donor car and went to pick it up. The guy who sold it to me was able to start it, the turbo spooled and the only problem was getting it in gear, hopefully just needed to bleed the lines better as he had just replaced the master and slave cylinders. Some may be upset that this car is restorable but it's been sitting for several years with a broken window letting rain in and the unibody underneath is pretty rotten.

 

 

This weekend my three brothers and I were able to get the engine out of the donor. Took about 7 hours, learned that it would be much easier with a cherry picker and the tranny removed. We definitely spend way too much time fighting with it. hoping to find a good hoist and a stand soon.

 

How do you like the ratchet straps hanging from the rafters? Haha

 

 

This is my first big project. I'm an engineering teacher and not a mechanic, my neighbor has is a retired mechanic and my brother is fresh out of UTI so I'm certain they will be helpful. however, neither of them have worked specifically on the Z's and I don't know how much help they will be with switching everything over to fuel injection, so I will have many questions.

 

Oh and my goals for this build at the moment are almost a stock transfer. I want to get the Engines swapped and get the car driving then do one upgrade at a time and record the results of each upgrade.

 

Any suggestions for cleaning up the donor engine before dropping it in? also the intake is so ugly with all that crap on the top seen alot of people go to an N42 intake on here and plug every hole on the top. I will probably stcik with the one I have, just not sure what I need to keep and what I can plug up.

 

Hope to keep ya updated on a weekly basis

Edited November 5, 2012 by Co0ke

[BluDestiny]

please use smaller pictures. I can't see the epicness

[Co0ke]

Alright first post is modified with smaller pics...those were wAY TOO huge!

[Z Greek]

So i've had a 260z for about 2 years now. Have just been doing maintanance and keeping it running. I had originally planning on an NA build with my goal set around 200rwhp. But after alot of thought I decided the turbo build was way more cost effective. The other day I located a donor car and went to pick it up. The guy who sold it to me was able to start it, the turbo spooled and the only problem was getting it in gear, hopefully just needed to bleed the lines better as he had just replaced the master and slave cylinders. Some may be upset that this car is restorable but it's been sitting for several years with a broken window letting rain in and the unibody underneath is pretty rotten.

 

 

This weekend my three brothers and I were able to get the engine out of the donor. Took about 7 hours, learned that it would be much easier with a cherry picker and the tranny removed. We definitely spend way too much time fighting with it. hoping to find a good hoist and a stand soon.

 

How do you like the ratchet straps hanging from the rafters? Haha

 

 

This is my first big project. I'm an engineering teacher and not a mechanic, my neighbor has is a retired mechanic and my brother is fresh out of UTI so I'm certain they will be helpful. however, neither of them have worked specifically on the Z's and I don't know how much help they will be with switching everything over to fuel injection, so I will have many questions.

 

Oh and my goals for this build at the moment are almost a stock transfer. I want to get the Engines swapped and get the car driving then do one upgrade at a time and record the results of each upgrade.

 

Any suggestions for cleaning up the donor engine before dropping it in? also the intake is so ugly with all that crap on the top seen alot of people go to an N42 intake on here and plug every hole on the top. I will probably stcik with the one I have, just not sure what I need to keep and what I can plug up.

 

Hope to keep ya updated on a weekly basis

Holy Moly that looks precarious. Do yourself a favor when you are ready to put it back in and rent a cherry picker for 50 bucks and save tearing those trusses out of your garage! That engine alone weighs about 450 pounds, add the gearbox, and you are pushing 550 pounds. Those ratchet straps are for holding a load down, not lifting with, yikes, be careful!

[Co0ke]

yeah....I underestimated the weight of the engine for sure. laid a 4x4 across the rafters and used 1700lb ratchet straps but definitely did not work as I imagined. going to pick up an engine stand today. I will be buying or renting a hoist whenI go to swap it in.

[NewZed]

 

 

I'm an engineering teacher

 

 

What kind of engineering do you teach?

Edited November 5, 2012 by NewZed

[cgsheen]

Welcome to the 260 TURBO Club!

 

Do yourself a favor though and scrap the stock engine management from the start. You'll have to do some re-wiring to mate the ZX engine with the 260 frame anyway... Spend that time and effort learning about using the MAF, TPS, Coil & Ignitor, Chopper Wheel, ECU off an early (distributor type) VG30E (Maxima, 300ZX, Infiniti M30). The stock A18 ECU will run the L28ET much better than it's original ECU and flapper-type AFM.

[Co0ke]

NewZed:

 

I'm really a math teacher, high school level. But just this year was recruited to teach for PLTW (Project Lead The Way). I'm only trained to teach Principles of Engineering at the moment, but I love it. Looking to teach Digital Electronics and/or Computer Integrated Management next year.

 

cgsheen:

 

I'm assuming I can locate the ECU and AFM at a local yard for cheap? <-- this area I am scared, I think I was going with stock because I felt it would be easier to swap the wiring...

[DevilZeto]

There is a write up somewhere in the forum that explains the process of the A18 ECU swap. Also check the classified area if you plan on doing the swap. There are a lot of members selling what you might need. Good luck

[loy]

 

I'm really a math teacher, high school level. But just this year was recruited to teach for PLTW (Project Lead The Way). I'm only trained to teach Principles of Engineering at the moment, but I love it. Looking to teach Digital Electronics and/or Computer Integrated Management next year.

 

 

That's cool, I took PLTW in high school!

[cgsheen]

I'm assuming I can locate the ECU and AFM at a local yard for cheap? <-- this area I am scared, I think I was going with stock because I felt it would be easier to swap the wiring...

 

You definately should be able to find the parts. The conversion is only slightly more difficult than putting the stock ECCS harness into an S30 frame and the results of using a much smarter ECU are fairly amazing. (Much of the trouble we turbo-swap guys run into is the OLD harness, wiring, and bad connectors. You end up chasing wiring gremlins - besides having to wire it into the 260...)

 

You need to be able to read and follow a wiring diagram though. If you're interested in tuning down the road, get an ECU you can mount a NIStune board in. But, bone stock, the VG30 ECU is already more than capable of making the L28ET purr.

 

I did the stock swap at first. Once I actually did the ECU/MAF swap, I wondered WHY I put the stock harness on the thing in the first place. More HP with the MAF and better boost response. The new ECU "learned" how to get my idle AFR right in the 7-mile trip home from the shop and keeps the AFR correct during cruise, enrichens nicely under boost. (I have a NIStune board in mine using the stock map and it runs this well - manual boost controller now at ~10psi - wideband too. That's all stuff you can add later actually...)

[Co0ke]

I'm sold....time to search for a vg30 ecu/Maf.

[jdizzy204]

Teach at North Meck?

[Co0ke]

I teach at Hopewell.

 

Quick question: Do I need the turbo ECU from a 300zx or will an NA ECU work? On the sticky it says turbo but reading through some other posts I'm certain i've seen people use an NA ECU in their turbo build. This would open up the door for many more avaible choices from the yard.

[NewZed]

new ECU "learned" how to get my idle AFR

 

Hate to be picky, but I'm pretty sure that the early Z31 ECU's don't "learn". They don't record engine parameters for future use and have a new "tune" ready when the engine is started. I think that they only store engine fault codes. They do self-trim "on-the-fly" as the engine is running via sensor inputs like the O2 sensor and they do some self-maintenance like burning off the MAF wires, but I can't find anything that says there is any kind of programming incorporated that records "knowledge" of the engine and saves a new file for operating the engine. Every engine start is from scratch, I believe, and the self-trimming begins new every time. Resetting the ECU doesn't lose anything but fault codes.

 

I might be wrong but that's what I get out of the various descriptions of how they work, that I can find. Could be semantics but compared to the Nistune, which can store a user-specified startup file and default file (as I understand it) for when sensor parameters might be out of range (WOT, for example) it might matter for the conversation.

 

I bring it up because the FSM implies that default values are used at idle. The O2 sensor isn't even used. The engine idle parameters should be the same every time the engine is started. What you noticed may have just been from the engine warming up or the MAF wires getting cleaned or the O2 sensor drying out or some other new parts thing (no offense).

[cgsheen]

That's why the "learn" is in quotes. And, I'm using an Infiniti M30 (F31) ECU & related equipment. Heated O2 sensor and the ECU is pretty much "up to speed" as soon as the sensor is warmed up. Takes seconds. With my wideband, the AFR is on target just as soon as the heater cycle is finished. Stock ECU doesn't even start "polling" the O2 sensor until the CHTS reaches a certain temp and can't keep idle AFR without a working AAC. The M30 ECU can keep my idle AFR on track without the AAC. Personally, I'm not really sold on the Z31 ECU... The '90's Infiniti or Maxima is what I look at. Seems like they always put more tech in the Infiniti's though.

 

Co0ke: You don't need a turbo ECU to run stock. You'll need a tunable ECU to go much past that.

Edited November 7, 2012 by cgsheen

[NewZed]

Just trying to tease out the details. The main VG30 ECU swap that's pinned in the FAQs is for the 1984 300ZX. Sounds like the M30 ECU is more advanced, so your swap might be better.

 

http://forums.hybridz.org/index.php/topic/26230-z31300zx-ecumaf-to-280zxt-swap-guide/

 

 

The M30 ECU uses the O2 sensor for idle control? Then your comment about improved idle within minutes makes more sense. Sounds like it might be a good swap even for a simple stock NA 1976 EFI setup, like mine. Is the O2 sensor for the M30 narrow or wideband? (Never mind, I see from the web that the wideband wasn't even developed until 1994). Not to thread-jack, but the OP could probably use the information also, just for options.

 

Edit - Found my answer about the better idle. The ECU controls idle based on RPM, but doesn't use the O2. Still much improved over the early EFI ECUs. Assuming that the 1989 system is similar to the M30. Here's a diagram from the 89 300ZX FSM.

 

Edit 2 - Of course, you probably don't have an idle-up valve on your L6. Still wondering...who knows, maybe there's a timing advance algorithm in the ECCS to control idle also.

Edited November 9, 2012 by NewZed

[Co0ke]

Ok, spent a good part of my day reading stickies and searching the threads. Still a few gaps for a newbie me.

 

Think I need:

Z31 MAF

maxima/infinity ECU (with connector?)

use wiring harness from 280zxt

I believe I saw that I will need a different O2 sensor?

 

This is where I will start, NIStune looks expensive and it almost seems like a couple hundred more and I could just get MS 2 or something similar. Again, I just want a pretty much stock turbo set up that I can upgrade slowly as funds permit.

 

A lot of cleaning and looking over still needs to be done on the engine, as well as prepping the 260.

 

Thanks for all the help.

[jdizzy204]

I teach at Hopewell.

 

Quick question: Do I need the turbo ECU from a 300zx or will an NA ECU work? On the sticky it says turbo but reading through some other posts I'm certain i've seen people use an NA ECU in their turbo build. This would open up the door for many more avaible choices from the yard.

 

Cool, I graduated from Hopewell in '05. I'm sure most of the old faces are gone by now though

[Co0ke]

Update: over the weekend I got the engine mostly apart. Had my neighbor (retired automotive teacher/corvette street racer/had a shop for several year/best neighbor ever) look at it and he said it looked really clean for 180k miles. Gonna check rod bearings, valve seals and a few other things, clutch looks pretty new. PO said it was and a racing clutch....doesn't look special, ill take a pic of that maybe someone can tell if its somehow better then the original.

 

Got the tranny cleaned up nice

 

And even got a little over excited to see what the Chevy orange would look like before I was done cleaning the block ...here's the one side I hit this afternoon.

 

 

Pretty much it for now the new gaskets should come in Wednesday and I'm sending a box full of parts to the dealership for my brother to put in the parts washer. Gonna finish the block and start on the head this week.