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Eibach Springs - Front sits high... *pics*

suspension springs lowering

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#1 PCressey

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Posted 20 January 2015 - 10:22 AM

I have found a few threads on this issue, but no real resolution.  The front sits noticeably higher (over 1") after the installation... it appears the front didn't even drop a millimeter from stock.

 

Springs:  Eibach Lowering Kit

Shocks:  KYB

 

Checks:

  • 6305.001 springs are on the front.
  • 6305.202 springs are on the rear.
  • The label and part number are right-side up so you can read them.
  • The springs are seated properly.
  • The control arm bolts/nuts were tightened with the load of the car (not on jack stands).

 

Does anyone have a clue as to why the front did not lower?  Seems basic enough...   :unsure:

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1973 Datsun 240Z

Currently under restoration.


#2 hwvigo

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Posted 20 January 2015 - 01:08 PM

Some times old stock springs sag lower than new lowering springs get you, I had this happen to me before.  How long have you had them on? have they had time to settle in?


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#3 calpoly-z

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Posted 20 January 2015 - 02:09 PM

I have Eibach/KYB's on my 280Z. Its hard to tell looking at pics, but I think my front springs are a bit shorter than the ones shown. I do know that I have my springs ziptied to the perches because at full droop the front springs are not compressed at all and would be loose on the spring perch. My front ride height is a bit lower than yours, but then I also have a heavy turbo/intercooler setup that may be adding more weight up front. 


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#4 Miles

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Posted 20 January 2015 - 02:11 PM

Your car is a 240Z or 260Z?

 

I recalled seeing a post on classiczcars.com

 

Hope this helps:  http://www.classiczc...prings-in-260z/


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#5 PCressey

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Posted 20 January 2015 - 02:43 PM

Some times old stock springs sag lower than new lowering springs get you, I had this happen to me before.  How long have you had them on? have they had time to settle in?

 

The rear definately dropped about 1/2", but the front did not... it should be lower.  The springs have been on for about 50 miles through bumpy roads... I was hoping they would settle in, but haven't.

 

 

 

I have Eibach/KYB's on my 280Z. Its hard to tell looking at pics, but I think my front springs are a bit shorter than the ones shown. I do know that I have my springs ziptied to the perches because at full droop the front springs are not compressed at all and would be loose on the spring perch. My front ride height is a bit lower than yours, but then I also have a heavy turbo/intercooler setup that may be adding more weight up front. 

 

Yes, and your part number is 6303.XXX as opposed to my 6305.XXX (referencing Miles post just above).  They also stated there was slop between the perches, and I had to use a spring compressor to get mine on.

 

 

 

Your car is a 240Z or 260Z?

 

I recalled seeing a post on classiczcars.com

 

Hope this helps:  http://www.classiczc...prings-in-260z/

 

My car is a '73 240Z.  That post was helpful, and appears he ran into the exact same problem as me.  He has 240Z struts and 260Z struts to interchange though, and the perch was 1" lower on the 260Z.  Hmmm... I am going to go measure my struts and perches to see if maybe they were changed at some point, then call Eibach for answers.


Edited by PCressey, 20 January 2015 - 02:43 PM.

1973 Datsun 240Z

Currently under restoration.


#6 Miles

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Posted 20 January 2015 - 03:35 PM

Some Eibach problems came up from other Z sites when I Google  "eibach 6305.001"


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#7 PCressey

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Posted 20 January 2015 - 04:08 PM

Some Eibach problems came up from other Z sites when I Google  "eibach 6305.001"

 

Yeah, I have read through them all.  I'll update this thread as I figure it all out.   ;)


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Currently under restoration.


#8 randy 77zt

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Posted 20 January 2015 - 05:17 PM

I did this-the springs are on the wrong ends of the car.



#9 Leon

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Posted 20 January 2015 - 08:39 PM

Mislabeled spring part numbers? I'd call Eibach and figure out exactly which spring goes where (not using part numbers).



#10 PCressey

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Posted 21 January 2015 - 10:51 AM

I did this-the springs are on the wrong ends of the car.

 

Mislabeled spring part numbers? I'd call Eibach and figure out exactly which spring goes where (not using part numbers).

 

Perhaps, randy, but according to all docs and other peoples conversations with MSA and Eibach, the 001 goes up front and 202 goes in the rear.  Leon might have a point with the labels being printed on the wrong springs...  hmmm...

 

From my attached photos, you can see the rear springs (labeled 6305.202) have quite a few more coils closer together (more progressive?)...  would it make sense that those should be in the front...  This is what I will have to clarify with Eibach to debunk the possible mis-labeling issue.

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1973 Datsun 240Z

Currently under restoration.


#11 NewZed

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Posted 21 January 2015 - 11:10 AM

If they're the same length the higher rate goes on the back.  One quick way to figure things out.  Put a heavy object on each spring, the one that gets shortest goes up front.

 

 

Notice also that the difference is only 1/2", in your picture.  That's F versus E on the gas gauge.  Averages out to level rocker panels, which may be the way they were designed.


Edited by NewZed, 21 January 2015 - 11:12 AM.


#12 grannyknot

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Posted 24 January 2015 - 03:03 PM

I noticed the same thing when I installed my Eibach springs, I had to install a 1/2" spacer at the top of the rear springs to level the car out.



#13 JCan

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Posted 25 January 2015 - 08:01 PM

You know, Every time I set up a Z ( we have had 3 so far) we have had to cut the springs in the front and add spacers in the back.  The car pictured is using Eibach springs and I believe we cut 1 turn off the front spring.  In general, I have learned that the stock Z ride height is rather high and when you install lowering springs the spring constant must be increased because the travel to the stop is reduced by that same amount.

 

Moving forward, I am planning to install coilovers in the front in an attempt to get more travel and install bilstein shocks to provide a better ride.  Regarding the rear, I have not bought into the need for coilovers there.


Edited by JCan, 27 January 2015 - 07:38 AM.


#14 PCressey

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Posted 26 January 2015 - 09:27 AM

I called Eibach late Friday to try to get some answers, and the rep basically said the 240Z spring kit is discontinued, and they specially make them for a vendor (I presume MSA).  He stated they didn't have any information about the technical aspects since the part for them has been discontinued for so long.

 

I will get on the horn with MSA today, but not expecting much.

 

 

If they're the same length the higher rate goes on the back.  One quick way to figure things out.  Put a heavy object on each spring, the one that gets shortest goes up front.

 

 

Notice also that the difference is only 1/2", in your picture.  That's F versus E on the gas gauge.  Averages out to level rocker panels, which may be the way they were designed.

 

The thank wasn't even half full.

 

 

You know, Every time I set up a Z ( we have had 3 so far) we have had to cut the springs in the front and add spacers in the back.  The car pictured is using Eibach springs and I believe we cut 1 turn off the front spring.  In general, I have learned that the stock Z ride height is rather high and when you install lowering springs the spring constant must be increased because the travel to the stop is reduced by that same amount.

 

Moving forward, I am planning to install coilovers in the front in an attempt to get more travel and install bilstein shocks to provide a better ride.  Regarding the rear, I have not bought into the need for coilovers there.

 

Where did you get the spacer?  Looks like I am going to have to cut coils in the front to make this look right... what a pain in my rear.


1973 Datsun 240Z

Currently under restoration.


#15 seattlejester

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Posted 26 January 2015 - 02:49 PM

Or you could add weight to the front, a turbo system sounds about just the right amount of weight :).

 

All kidding aside, that spring does look like the traditional progressive style spring that eibach uses, I wouldn't be surprised if the coils that are closer together are all touching when on the car. Trimming the front or adding a spring spacer in the rear would be the solution.



#16 Swami

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Posted 26 January 2015 - 08:10 PM

Last time I bought eibachs, my front end rode higher than I preferred too. Ended up having to take a few coils off in order to get matching wheel well clearance from front to rear. Have you reduced weight in the front at all? I get the feeling that eibachs

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#17 Swami

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Posted 26 January 2015 - 08:13 PM

... for early Z cars were designed around all the smog/bumper/bracketry weight of a 260z. Just a hunch, but yeah I've been there too.

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#18 JCan

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 07:33 AM

For the back, you can purchase some large diameter washers and drill them out so that they fit in-between the car body and the top of the strut mount.  The nice thing about using this type of spacer is that they are inexpensive and allow you roughly 1/8 inch steps up to the height of the screws which stick above the bolts right now.

 

In summary, to get the car stance right I am suggesting you take a little off the front and add a little on the back of the car.  It is what we did and the car (almost) sits perfect.   Good Luck!

 

By the way, your '73 looks just great!  Keep up the good work!


Edited by JCan, 27 January 2015 - 07:37 AM.


#19 PCressey

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 09:50 AM

Or you could add weight to the front, a turbo system sounds about just the right amount of weight :).

 

All kidding aside, that spring does look like the traditional progressive style spring that eibach uses, I wouldn't be surprised if the coils that are closer together are all touching when on the car. Trimming the front or adding a spring spacer in the rear would be the solution.

 

I don't think a turbo will weigh it down enough... probably needs another 150lbs to drop it 1/2"...  good idea though!   :D

 

 

Last time I bought eibachs, my front end rode higher than I preferred too. Ended up having to take a few coils off in order to get matching wheel well clearance from front to rear. Have you reduced weight in the front at all? I get the feeling that eibachs

 

Only weight reduction up front is the removal of the smog pump and AC unit.  I have a 280Z radiator so that adds a smidge.  Even with the smog and AC unit the car wouldn't drop much at all.

 

 

For the back, you can purchase some large diameter washers and drill them out so that they fit in-between the car body and the top of the strut mount.  The nice thing about using this type of spacer is that they are inexpensive and allow you roughly 1/8 inch steps up to the height of the screws which stick above the bolts right now.

 

In summary, to get the car stance right I am suggesting you take a little off the front and add a little on the back of the car.  It is what we did and the car (almost) sits perfect.   Good Luck!

 

By the way, your '73 looks just great!  Keep up the good work!

 

Sounds like the plan of action.  I can probably go up to 3/8" until the mounting insulator bolts are too short.  I will raise the back up first then work on the cutting of the front springs.  I will post updated photos with exact measurement when done... don't plan to get this done in the next few weeks though, engine bay is getting touched up.   :D  


1973 Datsun 240Z

Currently under restoration.


#20 socorob

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 11:05 AM

I have a similar problem with my TTT setup with eibach springs. I had to use the large insulator on the rear and put in a ton of preload on the coilover so it won't drop at all with the weight of the car on it. On the front, I have about 1-1.5" of space between the spring and hat when the car is lifted off the ground and used the short insulator. It was a PITA to get the car close to level. This is on a 78 280z.


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