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Won't start after fuel rail upgrade


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#1 Turbo_the_world

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Posted 16 June 2016 - 08:20 PM

Alright guys, I have a 1976 280z with a l28. Mostly stock other than a stage 1 cam. Ran just fine before I messed with the fuel system. I went with the pallnet fuel rail, Toyota cressida injectors, new injector clips, and deleted most of the vaccum lines. I rewired the injector clips, solder and heatshrink tubing. Installed the fuel rail and injectors. The fuel rail is getting pressure, the guage reads about 35psi. I'm getting spark, replaced plugs and took one out and connected to wire while cranking and sparked fine. Won't even try to start, even with starting fluid sprayed in the intake I don't even get a hiccup. On another note my positive cable gets hot when cranking? I'm guessing just because it's using so many amps. Please someone help!

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#2 jacky4566

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Posted 17 June 2016 - 06:34 AM

Cressida injectors are high-z no? Do you have an aftermarket ECU to control them?



#3 Turbo_the_world

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Posted 17 June 2016 - 06:40 AM

I honestly didn't even check, I thoughthink I read somewhere they were low impedance. I will check when I get home.

#4 NewZed

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Posted 17 June 2016 - 09:00 AM

deleted most of the vaccum lines. 

 

. I rewired the injector clips, solder and heatshrink tubing.

 

. I'm getting spark, replaced plugs and took one out and connected to wire while cranking and sparked fine.

 

Won't even try to start, even with starting fluid sprayed in the intake I don't even get a hiccup

Could be you shorted an injector ground and are flooding.  Check the plugs for fuel.  Are you spraying the starting fluid in to an intake port or somewhere else like at the end of the plastic snorkel?  Best to remove a hose and squirt directly in to the manifold.  If you're getting spark, the timing is right, and the cylinders are dry, it should start.

 

Odds are high though that you left a big vacuum leak when you removed those "vacuum lines" whatever they are.  Why would you do that, they serve a purpose?



#5 NewZed

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Posted 17 June 2016 - 09:02 AM

I just took a second look at your picture and see that the PCV hoses are gone.  There's your problem.  Put the PCV system back together.  Google "280Z PCV vacuum leak".  Read the Emissions chapter.  It's all there.



#6 Turbo_the_world

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Posted 17 June 2016 - 09:16 AM

I thought the pvc hose and valve were on the underside of the intake manifold as I still have that connected.

#7 NewZed

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Posted 17 June 2016 - 09:18 AM

You thought half-right.

 

http://www.nicoclub.com/FSM/280z/



#8 NewZed

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Posted 17 June 2016 - 09:21 AM

And don't get mad.  What you're doing is just amusing to everyone out here that's worked on the EFI system.



#9 Turbo_the_world

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Posted 17 June 2016 - 09:28 AM

I'm not mad at all, I appreciate any help I can get. Just trying to understand.

#10 NewZed

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Posted 17 June 2016 - 09:43 AM

Unintended consequences.  You can either put the system back together or block it completely.  It actually keeps your oil cleaner, and your engine bay.  Removing parts that aren't understood is a common problem source.

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#11 Turbo_the_world

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Posted 17 June 2016 - 09:49 AM

Okay, I already have my open port on the throttle body blocked off, I didn't realize the crankcase vent on the valve cover was vacuumed as well. I will route it when I get home.

#12 NewZed

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Posted 17 June 2016 - 09:58 AM

I'm going to predict that your next problem will be that it starts but idle speed is off.  Either too high or too low.  It might also start and idle cold but die when warmed up.

 

Just a guess.  Enjoy.



#13 Turbo_the_world

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Posted 17 June 2016 - 04:56 PM

All hooked up, still nothing. Fuel pressure is at 30psi, getting spark, fuel in the cylinders. I have no idea. It just cranks, that's it.

#14 Turbo_the_world

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Posted 17 June 2016 - 04:56 PM

Here's the picture.

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#15 NewZed

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Posted 17 June 2016 - 06:19 PM

Well, that's a bummer.  Fuel pressure should be 36 psi but you should still get a pop or two.  It should start.  Are the spark plugs wet or dry after a no-start attempt?

 

Did you try the starting fluid directly in to the manifold?  Pop the little hose that supplies the AC control bottle and squirt some in there.  The hose next to the booster hose.



#16 Turbo_the_world

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Posted 17 June 2016 - 06:34 PM

Spark plugs look dry. It's so weird, not my first time around a car lol. I took the fuel rail off and gave it pressure, injectors were firing just fine. Spark is good, made sure I had the correct firing order. I tried starting fluid in the manifold and nothing.

#17 NewZed

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Posted 17 June 2016 - 06:51 PM

How do you know the injectors were firing?  That's the part you just worked on so the most suspect.  If they were squirting and you have dry plugs, there's a logic issue.  You can see the disconnect there.

 

Is the spark strong and bluish or weak and orangish?  Sometimes you can get spark in open air but none under cylinder pressure.  The old 280Z ignition modules are failing at a pretty regular rate.

 

If random actions fail you could start at the basic troubleshooting steps described in the FSM and the Fuel Injection Guide.  The 980 Guide covers all years up to 1980.  http://www.xenonzcar.../s130/other.php



#18 Turbo_the_world

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Posted 17 June 2016 - 07:02 PM

I took fuel rail off the manifold, and cranked the car while fuel shot into a tub I had. The spark issue would be interesting. It would make sense since I don't even get a pop with starting fluid. I'm not sure how I would go about testing that, I suppose I would just buy a new coil? Maybe new rotors and cap, the coil plug in the cap looks a little worn.

#19 NewZed

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Posted 17 June 2016 - 07:18 PM

76 has electronic ignition.  Engine Electrical.  You didn't say how the spark looked.  The fact that the injectors sprayed while cranking indicates that the coil was discharging.  That's what the ECU uses to know when to open the injectors.  Go to the basics of what's supposed to happen.  If the cylinders suck in some starting fluid and there's a spark you should at least get a pop.  Something's missing.

 

The details are important.  You didn't describe the spark, and you haven't said how you sprayed the fluid, just "in the manifold".  You might be spraying in to an electrical plug.  Who knows.  Thinking about replacing the coil without testing it is a bad sign.

 

The beauty of these cars is how much testing information is on the internet, free to anyone that want's to use it.  You could have had the whole system tested by now, with a meter and one of those books.  Just saying...



#20 Turbo_the_world

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Posted 18 June 2016 - 09:22 PM

Alright so, I'm not very good with electrical. Imy trying to test my ignition coil. Imy reading the same voltage as the battery on the positive and negitive ground test for the coil.

Edited by Turbo_the_world, 18 June 2016 - 09:27 PM.





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