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TimZ

T56 behind an L-series

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Okay, my main winter project this year is to put in a T56 magnum, and I've been looking at a few different options to do this - the cleanest (but not the cheapest!) option would be to fit an F-body tailshaft housing and have a bellhousing made. 

 

I've been looking at the bellhousing that Quicktime makes - they have a Nissan RB to T56 bellhousing and I think that it might be possible to get them to do one for the L-Series.  As far as I can tell through various searches the RB engine's bolt pattern is pretty close but not exactly the same as the L-series - can anybody confirm this?  Obviously if the bolt pattern were the same then it would just be a matter of getting Quicktime to build me one of their RB bellhousings with the trans flange rotated to suit the L series.  Even if it's pretty close, it might not be too hard to get them to make an engine side flange to match the L-series.

 

As a one-off this would likely be kinda pricey - am I the only one crazy enough to consider this, or would anybody else be interested in such a bellhousing?  Even if you didn't want/need the Magnum, this would still allow you to bolt up a an F-body T56.  I'm not necessarily looking to do a group buy or anything at this time, but it would be good to know if I need to look at this as just a one-off for myself or something more than that...

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Someone on here - I forget who - had a 510 with a turbo L6 in it that I am quite sure had a T56 behind it. I'll have to see if I can find out who it was.

 

Edit: The owner of that car was 510six, who appears to still be around - profile shows activity 3 days ago.

 

Here's a thread that discusses it a bit: http://forums.hybridz.org/topic/95242-the-t56-to-an-l28-kit-its-been-done-look-and-see/

 

Edit: More: http://forums.hybridz.org/topic/71185-t56-behind-l-series-how-it-was-done/

Edited by rturbo 930

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Would the Cd009 route maybe worth looking into? I know austin was planning on making adapters for them and they are considered to hold a fairly silly amount of power.

 

I just imagine it would be pretty astronomical for a one off piece. 

For the purposes of this post I'm mostly trying to figure out if anybody would follow if I were to blaze this trail.  Seems like there are periodically people looking into a T56, and then it turns out to be a lot of one-off fabrication so they go another route.  If there were a bellhousing available and Austin is already making a rear crossmember for the LS crowd, maybe it would be more palatable, maybe not, since the Quicktime bellhousings appear to be high quality, but not particularly cheap.

 

I'm already running a gForce T5 and while it's been holding up, I'm currently quite a bit over it's 500lb-ft torque rating.  The magnum is rated for 700lb-ft, which is likely pretty close to where I am at the flywheel but the 700lb-ft number appears to be pretty conservative, especially for a turbo car that will never hit that hard in 1st gear.  If I'm going to replace my working GF T5, I want to go with something that's more of a known quantity.

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Im not well educated on the topic, but would an adaptor plate be an easier or cheaper or more achievable option vs a full on custom bellhousing?

I'm looking at that option too, but it has its own issues - namely adding an adapter plate adds distance between the trans and the engine, which means you have to figure out how to get the input shaft to reach, both for spline and pilot shaft engagement.  Also need to deal with shifter location - the adapter can help or hurt with this depending on the tailshaft housing configuration.

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Tim,

Could you explain the adaptation process for the GF trans.

I talked to Bubba there, but not sure he was the guy that builds the trans.

So you have a standard T5 - larger - input/output ?

Sounds like it takes some abuse :)

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Tim,

Could you explain the adaptation process for the GF trans.

I talked to Bubba there, but not sure he was the guy that builds the trans.

So you have a standard T5 - larger - input/output ?

Sounds like it takes some abuse :)

Yeah, Bubba is generally really helpful but I don't think he's actually done this mod himself.  Kevin at The GearBox did all of the conversions that I know of.  Yes the input and output shafts are larger, and I had gForce make me a custom input shaft that was the correct length and had the correct pilot shaft for the Datsun setup.  Here's a link where I talked about it - broken links are fixed towards the end:

http://forums.hybridz.org/index.php/topic/45954-t-5/

 

The GF T5 has been a really strong trans - I'm just thinking that it would be smarter to upgrade before I break it, and actually have a good trans to sell...

Edited by TimZ

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So - does anybody have definitive dimensions for the engine/bellhousing bolt patterns for RB vs L-series?  I found this post where Austin shows the specs for the L, but haven't found the equivalent for the RB...

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Well...

 

The KA box bolts to an L-series, 

 

KA_RB_Gearbox_Overlay.jpg

 

According to that the KA and the RB20 can overlay.

 

SMT798B is KA

SMT534A is RB

 

And the RB20 and RB25 box are swappable between each other.

 

The KA engine along with the SR20 and RB20 sit tilted to a different amount then the L-series though. Not sure if it is changed on the 25 and the 30.

 

I would hold out for a diagram though as the internet can often be incorrect.

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Well...

 

The KA box bolts to an L-series, 

 

KA_RB_Gearbox_Overlay.jpg

 

According to that the KA and the RB20 can overlay.

 

SMT798B is KA

SMT534A is RB

 

And the RB20 and RB25 box are swappable between each other.

 

The KA engine along with the SR20 and RB20 sit tilted to a different amount then the L-series though. Not sure if it is changed on the 25 and the 30.

 

I would hold out for a diagram though as the internet can often be incorrect.

 

Thanks!

 

So I spoke with a Holley tech rep today (Holley owns Quicktime) and they did have both bolt patterns on file.  He confirmed that they were close but not exact matches.  The "closeness" is not necessarily helpful since they are close enough that you can't just drill two sets of holes - you'd have to slot a couple of them, which would kill the SFI rating.

 

All is not lost, though - he talked to their shop foreman at Quicktime and he was willing to take a look.  They are willing to make me a one-off for an extra $450, which isn't too terrible.  They did say that in general they were interested in establishing more presence in the import world - not sure how much this particular setup will help, but they might make it into a product.  I'll be sending them my T5 bellhousing for a reference shortly.

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I'll have both a TR6060 (better T56) and a CD009 transmission in my garage here shortly. I'll be able to get the lengths of each. One nice thing about the CD009 that I recently learned is if you are using the R200 from a 280Z, the ratio is the same as the 350Z, so it is an ideal matchup gearing wise.

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Thank You !  I did see it linked above by TimZ, but the link you gave actually says its for the RB motor, and the T56.  Boy thats a pricey piece of metal...   :shock:

 

Thanks again

~ joel

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Thank You !  I did see it linked above by TimZ, but the link you gave actually says its for the RB motor, and the T56.  Boy thats a pricey piece of metal...   :shock:

 

Thanks again

~ joel

Agreed it's not cheap, but it should be a direct fit and it is SFI rated.  

Do you know which T56 you wanted to use? That bellhousing, mated to an F-Body T56 should put the shifter 30" back from the engine mounting surface, which should work out well for the Z's opening in the trans tunnel.  

Still have to figure out what to do for the pilot shaft - it looks like it would protrude about a half inch past that bellhousing, and I don't recall offhand if that's enough to reach the bushing in the crank.  I'm thinking 510six's solution of pressing a bushing into the flywheel might be better than having to get a custom made input shaft...

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I def don't need a trans, as I bought a brand new RB25det Neo 5spd from Japan, and have only drove it less than 100 miles, but I have an itch to put a T56 close ratio behind my rb26.

 

I need more studying to know what model T56 to buy, and if I can continue to use the HKS duel plate clutch/flywheel I'm now using with the RB trans.

 

post-181-0-00954900-1485265379_thumb.jpg

 

post-181-0-28798600-1485265400_thumb.jpg

 

post-181-0-70682400-1485265421_thumb.jpg

 

post-181-0-24528500-1485265456_thumb.jpg

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Hello there,

 

Rb26 please tell me how much it cost you for the RB25det Neo 5spd, and from were you buy it ?

 

 

 

Thank you

 

You will have to email RHDjapan to check availability.  I paid close to $1,500.00 for mine delivered from Japan.

 

Here is the RHD link to get you started >>   http://www.rhdjapan.com/

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Thank you so much

 

I find one but its 1700$ plus shipping !

 

http://www.rhdjapan.com/nissan-oem-5-speed-manual-transmission-ecr33-rb25det.html

 

Is same yours ?

 

Can easily swap on L28 engine?

 

Thank you

 

That is about what I paid.

 

I chose a later model ( r34 )  but either model will fit the RB motor.

 

I don't think a L28 will bolt directly to a RB gear box without modification.

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I def don't need a trans, as I bought a brand new RB25det Neo 5spd from Japan, and have only drove it less than 100 miles, but I have an itch to put a T56 close ratio behind my rb26.

 

I need more studying to know what model T56 to buy, and if I can continue to use the HKS duel plate clutch/flywheel I'm now using with the RB trans.

 

...New from Japan R34 RB25det mission.jpg

 

.New from Japan R34 RB25det mission.jpg

 

New from Japan R34 RB25det mission...jpg

 

New from Japan R34 RB25det mission.jpg

You can, if you pick the right T56. You'll need one with the 26 spline 1.125" input shaft. Then you'll need to get a center hub with the boss for a Nismo 6 speed/OS88 splined boss. Or if you're using the older HKS twin plate, clutch disks for the OS88 transmission. They use a 26 spline 28mm hub/disc which is the same.

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You can, if you pick the right T56. You'll need one with the 26 spline 1.125" input shaft. 

In general, this means the "GM" variant, not the "Ford" one.  The Quicktime bellhousing is meant for the GM style - the Ford input shaft is shorter in addition to being a different spline configuration

Edited by TimZ

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