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240zdex

2jzge swap in progress

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This thread was a should I stop my sbf build for a 2j build and now it's a slow and steady build for the future.

engine will remain stock for a while till I can to afford to properly boost the engine with decent parts.(or a second engine while enjoying the car to keep the down time to a  minimum)

engine is from a 92 sc300 ran and drove.

i chose to get a trans from a 04 g35 for the fact I had a few that were local and sub $150 price range(picked mine up for $100)

i still need the adapter and flywheel kit and I think I'm going to use the mavericks kit $900 and if and when the 04 trans dies just pick one up from nissan for $1800 after the car is diving.

 

engine and management 

 

im going to try and use a microsquirt as my engine management and some of the stock parts will need to be replaced to get it to work properly.(hopefully lol)

i will add my updates when I get to this part in the build.

worst case I will do the tt ecu mod and safc.

(I still have the stock engine harness and m/t ecu if I can't make the microsquirt on the stock engine)

 

fuse box 

 

my chassis has the stock fuse box in the center consol but was thinking about replacing and or adding a separate fuse box for the engine and mircosquirt.

not sure what I should do here any input would be great.

 

im going to be using a fuel cell because the stock tank was pretty bad and got a great deal on a 7 gallon cell.

im thinking about running the fuel and rear brake lines on the driver side so when the turbo parts are installed the lines don't heat up and cause any issues from the exhaust heat.(I heard somewhere that was an issue not sure where though)

 

Rear diff

I have an r180 240z diff.

im pretty sold on the tried and true r200 but thinking about other options for the long run and parts availability.

iv thought about the r180 sti with adapter hubs,Ford 8.8,r230 but I think it will be hard to beat the price of an r200 swap.

My main concern I have is making the drive shaft.I want to make sure I have the long term diff installed and ready to rock before I make the driveshaft and that's why the r180 subi diff is sounding good because I could get away with making the drive shaft now with the stock r180 and upgrading later down the road.

 

 Suspension 

I'm all kinds of lost here I don't know what I want other then affordable lowered  responsiveness and comfortable.

im not sure if I can get away with a set of springs new struts and new bushings and get the ride height right.

(not looking for a full time  track car just a weekend and once in a great while take it to the track)

 

sorry if this seems like I'm asking for somebody to hold my hand through this build because I truly em not.

i feel like I bit off more then I should at first but I'm slowely kicking my @$$ in the right direction which seems to lead me too "don't over complicate things".

theres a load more info I can put in right now but the real issues I'm having trouble with are of the funds type lol.

thanks for reading the update and I look forward to keeping you guys updated and getting  constructive criticism.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Edited by 240zdex
Build in progress

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Stream of consciousness stuff is good for story telling, but makes for a very long post.

 

Your basic question is you planned on a sbf swap, have the kit for it. You found your way into an SC300 with the W58. Should you change gears and go 2jz.

 

You have time and effort invested. You probably are going to have to account for some other things that will pop up that you are not considering, jumping into another engine swap may be problematic. 350-400hp out of a JZ is going to require boost, which in turn means ECU, probably better trans then the W58, turbo and manifold, not including all the other bits. It also sounds like you are farming out quite a bit of work? That can be costly. 

 

If the 2jz is the swap you have always wanted to do, then it would be better to change gears now rather than later. If HP is your end goal then you already have progress towards a swap that will be able to reach that goal. 

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Goodness, that was a long sentence lol.

(Organize your thoughts, and try to just get the main point across, save your musings and thoughts for a build thread)

 

If you are content with modifying slowly, always wanted the 2jz, have a complete running donor car, then it might be worth it to go down that path.

 

Then again if you already have a fully functional car, swapping the drive train into another chassis seems a bit of a hassle if you don't have an end game planned. 

Edited by seattlejester

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2 hours ago, seattlejester said:

If the 2jz is the swap you have always wanted to do, then it would be better to change gears now rather than later. If HP is your end goal then you already have progress towards a swap that will be able to reach that goal. 

 

This is really the end of the thread right here.

 

You either really want the 2JZ, and are willing to pay more for it, and have it take longer, or you don't, and just finish with the Ford swap that you already started.

 

We can't tell you what you want.

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Well I thank you guys for putting up with my unorganized sentences and bantering.

i guess to answer I already have and it's time to start tearing apart the sc300.

i know you have modified the cx racing mounts seattlejester to be more centered.

I've also heard a lot of people say they wouldn't trust the stock mounts that bolt to the engine what are your thoughts on it  minus the standard boots the kit comes with?

as for the trans mount I'm not overly worried because I plan to upgrade in time.If you had to choose a trans which  way would you lean towards cd0009 ar5 BMW or anything else that would be cost affective and pretty easily sourced.

sorry for all the long post but I guess after the holidays I'll start getting things togeather and hopefully have a build thread.

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1 minute ago, Greeko said:

The cx racing kit for the R154 will require a bit of modification for the W58. It was pretty easy to do. 

That's great to know.

would you buy the engine and trans mount togeather or have the trans mount fabbed up because I don't intend to keep it for more then 2 years?

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1 hour ago, Neverdone said:

 

This is really the end of the thread right here.

 

You either really want the 2JZ, and are willing to pay more for it, and have it take longer, or you don't, and just finish with the Ford swap that you already started.

 

We can't tell you what you want.

You sir are correct only my wife can tell me what I want even if I don't want it lol.

in all honesty I guess I was looking for  reassurance  that the 2j was the better swap indefinitely.

i highly doubt anybody here will say one swap is better then another swap specially here on hybridz so I thank you aswell for your input.

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One swap really isn't better then the other as you say. Each has its own merits. You are asking in the toyota section so your answers based on traffic is probably going to be a bit more biased honestly. Ask the same question in the V8 section and they will probably steer you towards staying or maybe even pointing out the merits in a newer ford or the LS motor. The only thing that makes me suggest otherwise is that you said you have always wanted to do a xjz, if you are the type of person that won't settle for less then what you want, then better to just head towards what your end game is off the bat.

 

If you have the means, I would just have a set of custom mounts made up. It really is not difficult for any decent fabricator. Tell them you want the engine level, and you want the tube style mount with the bushings. I'm not sure what boots you are referencing, the bolts maybe? I'm using hardware acquired in the states for the most part.

 

There are lots of designs out there if you go with custom. The only reason I went with the CX mounts were because they seemed to be the easy route and similar to what I had with the 7m. If I had the space I would have just done my own, but that was at a premium.

 

I really wouldn't want to tear apart the sc300 if it runs and drives. Keep it running and driving, do the upgrades to that, and when the time comes swap it all over, it seems like your chassis may have a bit of a ways to go. The SC300 also has a nicer differential selection, CV axles, disc brakes on all 4 corners, double wishbone suspension if I'm not mistaken, power steering, etc. If I had a whole donor car, I'd be tempted to bring quite a bit of that with me.

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On 12/8/2017 at 4:56 PM, seattlejester said:

If you have the means, I would just have a set of custom mounts made up. It really is not difficult for any decent fabricator. Tell them you want the engine level, and you want the tube style mount with the bushings.

 

If every picture I've ever seen of the CX mounts is any indication I would definitely do this. Personally, If I was doing the jz swap I'd go insane if the engine wasn't centered in the bay.

 

On 12/8/2017 at 4:56 PM, seattlejester said:

I really wouldn't want to tear apart the sc300 if it runs and drives. Keep it running and driving, do the upgrades to that, and when the time comes swap it all over

 

Also this. Chassis work takes waaaaaayyy longer than you expect. If you decide to start the swap you'll basically have two non-functioning cars for a long time. If I had the SC I'd personally be using it as a daily and upgrading that stuff to swap over down the road. 

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Do you want torque or boost?  I was at the same crossroads when I was picking an engine for my car - I had a 1JZ supra and driven plenty of 2J's... with turbos ranging from GT35 400hp cars, to 76mm 700hp cars.  Boost is fun, but its really a highway pull type experience. I decided I wanted N/A V8 torque for the Z, since it was lighter and wanted more of a "point and squirt" backroads bomber.

 

Both are good choices, but I think you need to decide about how you want the car to drive, as the two engines will give two different experiences.

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The sc300 is in bad shape inside and out front bumper is missing a nice chunk the 1/4s are rusted and pretty much smashed on the passenger side and as I was driving it yesterday I lost all brake pressure it's a good parts car nothing more at this time.

i may just keep having the z chassis worked on while I keep sourcing the parts trans standalone intercooler fuel injectors rails turbo parts and like you said just drop it in one shot and be done.

ive Looked into using the sc300 double wishbone suspension and rear end and it seems to be a huge hassle with my intended budget.

i still have another early 260 that needs a complete restore sitting at the sellers farm(he was  diagnosed with cancer and can't move all his things to pull it out yet)

i may just keep the v8 build going and start the 2j in the 260 next winter if I can't get a buyer for my sbf parts.

 

 

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On 12/8/2017 at 2:02 PM, 240zdex said:

That's great to know.

would you buy the engine and trans mount togeather or have the trans mount fabbed up because I don't intend to keep it for more then 2 years?

 

Its a great starting point. I would just buy that mount. 

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So I have a huge update and not a good one.

so the guy I had building my z was  diagnosed with cancer and is doing  chemotherapy and requested I pick my car up sooner then later.

i had paid him sum money but not a ton and hope him a full recovery but this puts me in a bad spot going foreword as none of the rust things have gotten done(top of my  priorities)

im debating on getting a sub $500 mig welder and  attempting replacing the drivers floorpan both frame rails and some other spots here and there.

i also need to make my engine mounts and have a trans mount made up.

I was going to use the jag xjs v12 engine mounts (already bought) may change because of my lack of any welding or fabbing skills.

 

BUILDING A CAR SUCKS AT THIS STAGE SUCKSSSSSSS!!!!

sorry I had to vent but will keep everybody posted not that anybody is paying  attention  or wanting it just helps me see how far it’s come or in my case how little it’s come. 

 

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Keep your chin up, this is exactly where so many projects fail, on this forum alone there are hundreds guys who have been right where you are now. There are lots of project threads in the archives if you need a little inspiration, Mig welding is not that hard to learn but I would suggest you get a tank of Argon/Co2 and not go the fluxcore wire route.

Think of the character building, good stories to tell at your first car show.

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have to agree with grannyknot, give the fabbing a chance. Plan a lot before doing any fabbing, grab some cardboard and make your first template see how it goes. Once you think you have all the issues solved transfer your template to metal.

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With a decent welder you can sell it for what you got it for so you don't really have to consider it a sunk cost. 

 

Ask around, you may be surprised who has a welder or who knows someone with one who may be able to help you out.

 

Additionally I tell people this all the time. If you have all the pieces cut out, the surface prepped, and the new pieces ready to go in, you can either call a mobile welder or rent a welder over the weekend and put it all in in a couple days. It is the fitting, shaping, and cutting that takes a long time.

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On 6/18/2018 at 4:34 PM, seattlejester said:

Additionally I tell people this all the time. If you have all the pieces cut out, the surface prepped, and the new pieces ready to go in, you can either call a mobile welder or rent a welder over the weekend and put it all in in a couple days. It is the fitting, shaping, and cutting that takes a long time.

That's a great idea.

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13 minutes ago, grannyknot said:

That's a great idea

I tell people that all the time when they find out I have a welder and tell me they have a welding project. Just have the piece completely prepped and I can swing by and zap it in. 1 person has taken me up on it, granted they just had me order all the parts new and order it cut to length. 

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So I’m a bit lost going foreword I may have bit off more then I can chew without having Dave doing most of the work.(sure do wish I can find another guy for $30 an hour)

 

i have picked up my z and brought it to my business parking lot (short term thing till I can find a suitable place to work and store the car that’s not to far from where I live)

 

i may have a place to do all the work but I won’t know till Friday but me being a happy go lucky guy I’m looking at welding as cautiously as I can.

that brings me to this delima 

i rent a bunch of tools for my business and my local rental place will rent me there mig welder for $15 a day but I’d have to wait till September for that price otherwise it’s $50 or buy it outright for $800(don’t know all the specs but it will work with a household plug and has a gas option but they only rent it with flux core)

Option 2

its been said and my quote button is not working for some reason.

having a Mobile welder do the floor and frame rails for $90 hour plus Parts and gas depending on where I get a place to work on the car)

 I work 70-90 hours a week in the spring,summer and fall seasons and I’m pretty sure I’ll fu€k up the welds but I would like to learn but is this the worst thing to learn on?

 

Also started messing around with the engine for an hour or so waiting on Parts to come in for my dump truck I did not get far because I couldn’t find my deep 14mm socket.

 

after looking at the engine today I really want to clean it all up and redo all the gaskets and main seals while there easier to get to.

and yes I know it being outside on a pallet is not ideal but it’s all I got for now E93A5291-8E3D-4B00-9DFA-1B426AE5069C.thumb.jpeg.91a577738613ae6852bbf3e122e933b8.jpeg

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You don't want flux if you can help it, it requires clean up afterwards so quite a bit more work, MIG is what you want. Once again you don't really need to think of welding for quite a while. Getting all the pieces cut out with a perfect fit and prepping the surface is way more time consuming.

 

When the time comes as in you have all your pieces ready, you can look around. You really only need it for a week or 2 if you have all the pieces ready so $15 a day is a good deal granted you would have to go rent a bottle, but if you are looking to buy, $800 is pretty expensive. You can get a Hobart Handler 140 for under $500. Lincoln also sells a MIG welder for under or around $500 as well. You can even look at some cheaper units like Everlast or AHP which have offerings for even less than that, even harbor freight can be an option.

 

Welding MIG really is not that hard, have someone show you the ropes and maybe come by and check on your progress after a while. 

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Posted (edited)

It’s been a while since I’ve last posted to the build thread and nothing major to add except I found a new guy to weld for me and I dropped the car off to him.

he seems excited to be doing this resto and I guess that is a good thing.

im going to order the Mavericks motor sports conversion kit this weekend.

he will be out of state working for nearly a month and that’s a good thing for me as it gives me time to save buy and deliver parts when my business slows down a bit.

 

Our game plan seems solid but would like to share it and see what your guys opions are.

step one floor pans: drivers side was gone so it’s been cut out.passanger side can be saved with patch’s.

 

step two frame rails: both have some rot and rather then cut it all out I was thinking about cutting and patching the bad spots and having him rust proof and weld on a second layer of frame rail.(or just buy the bad dog rails)

 

step 3 attach engine to trans and have mounts made once it’s looking right.

once mounts are made I’d like to pick the engine and trans up to be freshened up or replace engine entirely with a complete running engine that hasn’t sat in the rain we had all of last month.

trans will need a newer style clutch fork and something else I can’t remember because I’m dead ass tired.

 

step 4 new fuel and brake lines fuel pump master cylinder rotors pads and other things in that nature.

 

step 5 some type of suspension set up I found a few weld in coil over kits and also found lowering springs and struts.

not sure what I’m looking for yet but I know I want to have a few track days in the future.

these are what I’m thinking about running

https://www.cosmoracing.com/260Z-280Z-1974-1978-1

 

step 6 cut wheel arches and replace unless my brinksworth flares will cover the rotted parts and fit the right way with enough clean metal.

 

step 6 wheels I found a set of wheels for $676 shipped the wheel size is 16x10 in a 4x114.3 with a 3.5 inch back space I had the off set written down somewhere but I’m a tad tired to care at this time but it should fit the build nicely.

 

step 7 get the car sound proofed wiring loom sorted fuse box built and engine bay painted.

 

step 8 install engine and trans for the last time have shifter modified wire engine up and hope to at least get the microsquirt to say yep there’s an engine.

at that point the car will leave him and that’s where I start my job.

 

sorry for the long post but it’s late I can’t sleep my belly hurts and I’m pretty sure my wife hates my guts.

anyway do you guys think we’re on the right track? As always feel free to throw out your comments concerns opions and burns.

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Edited by 240zdex
Needed to find a link and picture

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Finding someone who says they can weld is pretty easy, do your diligence now rather than later, you want to see some test pieces and make sure he shows you the welds before he goes and covers them up with paint or seam sealer. These are really structural pieces take caution.

 

Stay away from cosmo. It is just a spring setup with an adjustable perch, might as well go with a ground control kit at that point which has way more options, better design, and you can convert to a camber top.

 

Those star wheels are pretty neat, but looks like the most they come with is 5.5 aka 0 offset. You might be able to run them with real thin coilovers, but you would want almost an inch more outboard probably via spacer if you wanted to fill out flares, that is quite a massive weight package.

 

For the effort, I would say trying to find a cd009 over the cd001 you have would be beneficial.

 

I'd almost say making sure the trans fits would be better before you went and welded in the floors, once you weld new floors in it kind of locks the trans tunnel in place makes it harder to stretch out or manipulate. Granted I guess you can't really hammer the trans tunnel without a solid connection to bend around. Looks like you have an earlier Z which means quite a bit of material removal will be required. Might be worth taking a look at how you want everything to fit and then try and build around it rather then weld everything and have to cut it up to make room again.

 

Depending on how bad the floor is it may be easier to just put in a new floor and it will be cheaper to if you just make it flat.

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