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bawfuls

the always troublesome rear spindle pin removal

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Posted (edited)

I managed to remove one, with a combination of heat and hammering. The second is proving much more challenging. Here's the current status:

 

xNi8cKz.jpg?1

 

The pin is about 3 inches removed, through again a combination of mostly heat and hammering. But I also tried pulling this one, i.e. I put a spacer (that section of threaded pipe and a couple washers) on the end and then cranked down the nut. Eventually the nut stripped, and now it won't even back off. It just tuns in place. I tried wedging a screwdriver in between the washers to put some force on the nut and back it off, but that didn't work. I heated the control arm with a torch until the rubber bushing inside caught fire, then hammered the other end with an extension inserted, but it still won't move from it's current spot.

 

I even tried cutting between two of the washers but after removing a bunch of washer it started grinding down and eventually bent my sawsall blade. I do not know what is left to try, aside from going to get new blades and continue cuting. But even if I cut the stripped bolt off, the pin is still stuck inside.

 

I searched but most old threads say "lots of heat" so I'm posting for more ideas. I am just replacing bushings, not the whole suspension so any way I can do this without removing everything from the car would be preferable.

Edited by bawfuls

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It's been a while but I seem to recall pounding one back and forth in the hole.  Wears down the high spots.  Can you pound that back in?  Will seem like you're giving up ground but if it got there once it can get there again.

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I tried my spindle spins for about 20 min on each side, and realized very quickly that it was NOT going to be an enjoyable experience at all.

 

I paid a shop for an hour's worth of labor. Not sure what exactly they did, but I do know it involved a hydraulic press. Anyways, $100 later and a huge headache and hours of my time saved. Worth it for me.

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I would try pounding it back in but the spacer prevents that right now. Need to remove the stripped nut in order to do that.

 

This car has been stripped of it's engine (and exhaust, fuel tank, etc) so it's not relocating to a shop any time soon. I guess if I really couldn't do it myself, I could put the wheels back on, put the other control arm back on, rent a trailer to put it on, and take it over to a shop. But that sounds like more work than just getting this thing out myself.

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I think another member swears by an air hammer. Although he removes everything and mounts it to a bench if I recall.

 

Sawzall with a good blade will cut through it. I've done a set in a junkyard with a battery powered sawzall before. The dewalt black blade or a milwaukee torch with the higher TPI count will cut it, but that still leaves you with having to press it out and most likely you will shave a bit of metal off the LCA or maybe it is just rubber right there. But if you bring it to a shop like that they won't charge you as much to press it out.

 

You don't need to take the whole car. Assuming your exhaust is detachable you can jack the car up on the rear diff and put it on jack stands on the rear frame. Remove the front diff crossmember and the two rear caps in the back (nut and bolt so make sure to grab the top nut somehow) and you can remove just the upright and the control arm as one unit. 

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Lots of penetrating oil in the hole where the little lock bolt goes can help. Mine were rusted there. Also, I've read somewhere that they are designed to come out only in one direction. I don't know if I was trying to remove them in the correct direction, but in the end, the whole strut assembly had to come out and I used 13 tons of pressure in a large press to get them out. In the end, the only spot that had any corrosion was in the middle. My guess is that small amounts of water had entered through the locating bolt area. 

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13 hours ago, bawfuls said:

This car has been stripped of it's engine (and exhaust, fuel tank, etc) so it's not relocating to a shop any time soon. I guess if I really couldn't do it myself, I could put the wheels back on, put the other control arm back on, rent a trailer to put it on, and take it over to a shop. But that sounds like more work than just getting this thing out myself.

 

???

I just took out the strut assembly and the lower control arm together and brought that in. No need to take the whole car lol

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30 minutes ago, AlbatrossCafe said:

 

???

I just took out the strut assembly and the lower control arm together and brought that in. No need to take the whole car lol

Yeah that' seems obvious now. Yesterday was a long day of futility and I was a bit fried by the time I posted. If a fresh blade doesn't work this week I'll pull the assembly and take it to a shop.

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It happens. I think it took 3 blades, mine was just sitting against the floor. Mounted I think it will take less. 

 

The center lock pin only goes in one way, but the spindle pin it self should go in both ways. Kits use bolts to replace them, if the hole was tapered that would be problematic.

 

Albatross, happen to know the shop that pressed them out for you? I still have a set with the pin stubs pressed in after I cut the arm off.

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That spindle pin tool is probably NOT going to help in this situation.  I'm with Jester, use a "sawzall" (recriprocating saw - $20 at Harbor Freight if you don't have one) and cut the spindle pin in two places between the control arm and the hub.  Then you can figure out a way to get what's left of the spindle out of the hub section.  Much easier to press, beat, or air hammer out without the control arm in the way. You're going to burn out the bushings in the control arm so there's no reason to push them out of there...

 

The spindle pin is fairly soft steel so it's not difficult to cut through with a good bi-metal blade.

 

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7 minutes ago, cgsheen said:

That spindle pin tool is probably NOT going to help in this situation.  I'm with Jester, use a "sawzall" (recriprocating saw - $20 at Harbor Freight if you don't have one) and cut the spindle pin in two places between the control arm and the hub.  Then you can figure out a way to get what's left of the spindle out of the hub section.  Much easier to press, beat, or air hammer out without the control arm in the way. You're going to burn out the bushings in the control arm so there's no reason to push them out of there...

 

The spindle pin is fairly soft steel so it's not difficult to cut through with a good bi-metal blade.

 

Yeah, the tool is basically the approach I took myself with the nut and spacer but now it's seized/stripped. I have a battery operated sawzall here just need to pick up some new blades

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The spacer method only works on kind of medium seized ones if I remember they use like an adapter so that you actually apply the load not directly to the threads like you would if you put washers right underneath so the threads are just connecting and being pulled rather than pushed against. 

 

I will note depending on how seized they are it won't come out with a 12 ton press even after cutting the a arm off. At least not with my harbor freight press while being heated a little bit. 

So look for 4x4 or shops with more serious presses like a 20 ton or so. They probably would find it laughably easy.

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Posted (edited)

update:

 

new saw blade cut through the spindle pin... and shaved that housing down a touch too (the red is the paint from the saw blade)

 

9gf88Xn.jpg?1

 

Then after lots of heat and some hammering on the other end I got to here, cut end:

 

IXzKWJN.jpg?1

 

other end:

 

C8aVLYR.jpg?1

 

Hammering with an extension hasn't done anything. It is of course more difficult to hammer now with the control arm removed and the assembly just waving in the wind. Anything else worth trying at this point before removing the assembly from the car?

 

Edited by bawfuls

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Oh you are going to want some resistance. Can't really get a jack under there since there is a spring up top, I'd suggest it would be worth dropping the three nuts and the parking brake and brake line to get it on a bench. I'd say it might almost be better to make sure the end that is out is a bit more tapered and hammer that backwards, the way threads are if that mushrooms while it is in there it is going to grab and be really hard to get out.

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21 hours ago, seattlejester said:

It happens. I think it took 3 blades, mine was just sitting against the floor. Mounted I think it will take less. 

 

The center lock pin only goes in one way, but the spindle pin it self should go in both ways. Kits use bolts to replace them, if the hole was tapered that would be problematic.

 

Albatross, happen to know the shop that pressed them out for you? I still have a set with the pin stubs pressed in after I cut the arm off.

 

425 Motorsports over in Bellevue! I see you are from there. They are about a mile west of Crossroads. I live about a mile east of Crossroads so they are convenient for me. They are doing the chopping/welding for my coilovers. They have done very high quality work for me so far.

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I can't see your pictures, but what ended up working for me was soaking the strut housing in pb blaster for 3-4 days.  I don't mean spraying it on or pouring some in the hole a couple times a day, I mean buy a gallon and fill a paint tray with it and completely submerge the area containing the spindle pin. 

 

This was after trying at great length on my own.  I had been turned down by 1 shop and had another unsuccessfully try to heat it and press it (oxy/acetylene torch and at least a 20 ton press.)

 

It still took a little pounding to get it out, but I could see movement after each hit.  If you could fill a bucket with pb blaster to submerge it, you could feasibly do it while still on the car I think.

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1 hour ago, AlbatrossCafe said:

 

425 Motorsports over in Bellevue! I see you are from there. They are about a mile west of Crossroads. I live about a mile east of Crossroads so they are convenient for me. They are doing the chopping/welding for my coilovers. They have done very high quality work for me so far.

 

I keep forgetting they have a shop as well as a show room. I live pretty close by as well, I've gone to them for some weird seat brackets and stuff before. Nice people.

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On 5/14/2018 at 10:55 PM, Miles said:

Take it to a machine/suspension shop and have the pin pressed out.

Today I finally did this and it came out within about 5 minutes.

 

Now I'm fighting the new bushings that are slightly thicker so they don't want to fit over the spindle upon reinstall. I think I saw some people freeze them or something to shrink them and get the control arm back in place? Are there other clever tricks for this or should I just sand a milimeter or two off the bushings?

 

edit: here's a couple images of what I'm talking about

 

O3ID84i.jpg



sS2v4Yx.jpg

Edited by bawfuls

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Paint scraper I think is the go to. Usually made out of stainless so it is pretty hard, angle it so it acts as a ramp. Employ two, one on each side and push the upright down.

 

Heat can make them a bit more pliable, but really you don't want them to deform.

 

If that doesn't work you can shave a little bit off. The arms can come in a bit if you tighten it, but you have to make sure you don't take too much off or it will want to bind the sleeve to the pin.

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