Guest JAMIE T Posted May 6, 2005 Share Posted May 6, 2005 I've counted the splines on the ZXTT axles and hubs multiple times. I assure you all that they are 32 splines. Stony, that's too funny. But, I really don't think this will break. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben D Posted May 6, 2005 Author Share Posted May 6, 2005 Hope these pics are of some use to folks. Cheers, Rob Rob, Great pics. I'm stuck with a Z31 300ZXT trailing arm at present and can't see how I'd shoehorn a Z32 TT rear hub in there, and then again still running the R200 means you could only really run an Z32 CV on the outer, the inner CV needs to suit R200. I honestly can't tell you when the R200, half shafts and CVs begin to break on a Z31 T , I've only broken stub axles to date. Those other bits are surprisingly strong... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackBeaut Posted May 6, 2005 Share Posted May 6, 2005 I've counted the splines on the ZXTT axles and hubs multiple times. I assure you all that they are 32 splines. Not sure if this was in reference to my post or not but just to clarify, the 5 stud hubs I've got are from a normally aspirated 300ZX not a TT, the NA uses a 4.08:1 R200v AFAIK. Do you have any pics of your rear set up Ben, is it basically the same as the early Zs rather than the Z32, obviously there's going to be some differences due to the trailing arm set up. I'd imagine though that like Jamie, and eventually myself, in order to convert from stub axles to later style hubs would require some major reworking of the strut/hub housing. For my end needs I think I'll be well sorted with 29 spline axles from a 200SX. I'm going with a 3.0l stroker EFI, hoping for around 300bhp at the crank, so well within the capabilities of the R200 I've got with Torsen LSD. Another advantage for me in the UK is that 200SX spares are easily available so replacing bust axles won't be too much of a nightmare. Cheers, Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben D Posted May 6, 2005 Author Share Posted May 6, 2005 Do you have any pics of your rear set up Ben' date=' is it basically the same as the early Zs rather than the Z32, obviously there's going to be some differences due to the trailing arm set up. I'd imagine though that like Jamie, and eventually myself, in order to convert from stub axles to later style hubs would require some major reworking of the strut/hub housing. For my end needs I think I'll be well sorted with 29 spline axles from a 200SX. I'm going with a 3.0l stroker EFI, hoping for around 300bhp at the crank, so well within the capabilities of the R200 I've got with Torsen LSD. Another advantage for me in the UK is that 200SX spares are easily available so replacing bust axles won't be too much of a nightmare. Cheers, Rob[/quote'] Rob, The S12 RSX gazelle has an identical rear endset up to a Z31 300ZXT. In fact , after a moderate accident on a race circuit I replaced the damaged S12 rear crossmember with one out of a 200ZR. It bolted straight in. Thus while I may have a Silvia/gazelle (and an old one at that), I feel like I belong here as the drivetrain is all Z31 T Z car. From my experience with the R200 stuff you'll not have any troubles with your set up, until you attach something like a TO4Z to that puppy you're building... Getting late here now, time for bed and dreams of unbreakable IRS and 8 sec quartermiles... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JAMIE T Posted May 6, 2005 Share Posted May 6, 2005 I was just clarifying that the ZXTT hubs are more substantial than the S13 or ZX-NA hubs. So far the only car or anything for that matter that I can find that uses the R230 is the 300ZXTT. From ALL of the information I can find the Q45 diff is a big housing R200 that uses the big 6-bolt stub axles like the GT-R. Even the mighy GT-R uses an R200. Also, I can't find any aftermarket gear sets for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackBeaut Posted May 6, 2005 Share Posted May 6, 2005 Getting late here now, time for bed and dreams of unbreakable IRS and 8 sec quartermiles... Same dream, different sides of the planet, bit worrying really Jamie, could you tell me the diameters of the 300ZX CV shafts for reference? I've just measures the 200SX shafts that I have, the main shaft is 28mm, the splined end is 30mm. Also they use tripod type CV joints like the 280ZX, although they're a bit larger. I believe the 300ZX uses Burfield joints with balls and cage. Any idea of the advantages/disadvantages of one design over the other? I agree that finding alternative R230 diffs seems be a bit of a tough quest, made even harder in the UK by Nissan's smaller range of cars, and most of those are crappy compact FWD types. Cheers, Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stony Posted May 6, 2005 Share Posted May 6, 2005 Hey one of the reasons i didnt go any further with trying to improve the rearend i built was that i was headed into the 9s and was under teh impression that a car that fast would not pass tech with an IRS. Anyone ever read this? and if so why even try to develope something like that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JAMIE T Posted May 7, 2005 Share Posted May 7, 2005 Here in the states, that is true, but I don't know about Aus., etc... If my car runs a 9, I will probably crap myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spork Posted May 7, 2005 Share Posted May 7, 2005 Hey one of the reasons i didnt go any further with trying to improve the rearend i built was that i was headed into the 9s and was under teh impression that a car that fast would not pass tech with an IRS. Anyone ever read this? and if so why even try to develope something like that So what does a guy do if he wants to run some of these import classes like NOPI's Turbo 6 class...are you guys saying that I need to pick a different car? lol. I figure I need to run mid 9's to be somewhat competative. Heres what they state •DRIVE TRAIN: FWD, AWD, and RWD entries. Stock drive train configuration required. OEM rear end must be used. * Rear ends: O.E. bolt in differential casing allowed. No aftermarket substitutes allowed. Examples (8.8â€, 9â€, or 12 bolt). If vehicle comes stock with I.R.S., vehicle must stay that way for competition. am I screwed, or will they allow it? I guess I just need to find someone to call and fine out... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spork Posted May 8, 2005 Share Posted May 8, 2005 Well, I haven't had a chance to talk to anyone yet, but heres what I found on NHRA's website. The last rule update for IRS that I could find was done in 1998/99. Heres what it says. --------------- A long-standing rule that requires any car with independent rear suspension (IRS), weighing over 2000 pounds, and running 10.99 or quicker to replace the IRS with a conventional rear-end housing has been modified. For 1999, only those IRS designs which utilize a lower control arm only (like a 1963 to 1982 Corvette) will have to comply with the above requirement. If the suspension utilizes both upper and lower control arms, the IRS may be retained regardless of weight or e.t. ----------- Doesn't our car classify as having both upper and lower control arms? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JAMIE T Posted May 9, 2005 Share Posted May 9, 2005 Yes. On our cars, the strut is the upper arm. That rule applies when the upper arm is the axle like on a '63-82 Corvette or Jag IRS. When an axle breaks on one of them, the suspension for that side is LOST. The wheel just flails around and a crash ensues. Basically, if you can roll you car around and set-up the chassis without the axles installed, it fits the NHRA rules. Spork, I'd like to hear more about you project. Tell me more... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikelly Posted May 9, 2005 Share Posted May 9, 2005 Spork there is no "UPPER" control arm in the design, which is why any of the serious drag Zcars convirt to the solid axle from the IRS. If you look at the suspension layout on a C5 Corvette, that is considered an upper and lower control arms setup, using shocks instead of struts. The double A-arm setup is an excellent example... If your HybridZ is truly capable of 10 second passes, plan and prepare now for the inevitable. Change the rear out now and not later... Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben D Posted June 7, 2005 Author Share Posted June 7, 2005 Ok, sounds like the Z31 300 ZX semi trailing arm rear end has an advantage over earlier designs in that when we break stub axles, the brake caliper keeps the wheel on (the disc can't escape past the brake pads!) and you just coast down the track on one wheel power if you only break 1 stub, or get pushed back if you break both. I've done both, and driving down on one wheel is the least embarrassing and most fun, provided your diff isn't locked up and puts you in the wall. Thats why I like to shim my LSDs up tight, but not weld them, as its safer that way if something else breaks. Anyway, we've done a bit of R&D at modern motorsports and reckon the 35 mm, 33/35 spline stub axle option for Z31 300 ZX rear ends is a goer. If anyone is running this semitrailing arm rear end and is sick of changing out the stubs, drop modern motorsports sales@modern-motorsports.com or me ben@digsfish.com a line for more details. I plan to run deeper in the 9's with these units in a manual car, so I'll post feedback on them if anyone wants to sit back and watch developments. Cheers Ben D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stony Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 Spork there is no "UPPER" control arm in the design' date=' which is why any of the serious drag Zcars convirt to the solid axle from the IRS. If you look at the suspension layout on a C5 Corvette, that is considered an upper and lower control arms setup, using shocks instead of struts. The double A-arm setup is an excellent example... If your HybridZ is truly capable of 10 second passes, plan and prepare now for the inevitable. Change the rear out now and not later... Mike[/quote'] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
260DET Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 Keep it coming Ben, its sure to be of interest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Modern Motorsports Ltd Posted February 12, 2008 Share Posted February 12, 2008 Just cruising some posts and see Ben didn't update this. We did do some larger than Z31 OEM diameter Z31 stubs with matching companion flanges/bearing-distance spacers. They finished as 41 spline (yes, 41!) 4340 pieces that got Ben into his quickest times with the car and showing a few skylines in Australia who's boss:smile: http://forums.hybridz.org/showpost.php?p=790657&postcount=72 From Ben in post above : "Ross has manufactured these and I have tested the prototypes and can report they are good to at least 1.33 sec 60 foots and 9.12 &154 mph in my little 4 banger beast. In fact, its possible to hang the wheels in the air a fair ways with these parts." We've seen little demand from Ben's success's but we're guilty of not having marketed them much so may see that change. Certainly an option to open the envelope for some Z31's. We're working at putting a v. similar combo into the Z strut housings.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stony Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 Is there a writeup on this install anywhere... ie struts this applies to. When i did my s30 strut mod i had to get the strut housing machined to accept the bigger bearing fro the z31. Is this the case with this MOD? very interested. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S15 200sx owner Posted February 14, 2008 Share Posted February 14, 2008 Ross, I have already spoken with you a few months ago in regards to this swap for the s30 struts, after i had been emailing Ben. This would be a great alternative to doing the whole technotoy rear swap. I am also very interested, once you have made these parts (including a companion flange to suit the 6 bolt inner GTR or Z32TT CV) I am sure they will be a big seller. When are you likely to have them availble to suit s30? Please keep us updated Ross. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Modern Motorsports Ltd Posted February 17, 2008 Share Posted February 17, 2008 Stony, are you building another Z or planning some changes? Sets done to date were for Z31 struts. Ben's Ozzy set was for his Gazelle (special edition 200SX we saw in the 80's), which from the factory had the Z31 R200 clutch rear and Z31 4 bolt outer flange CV's. Our design was done a while back but our goto for finishing this package has been inundated with projects but finally we've got their nose to the grindstone successfully! (sorry Rick, I just didn't have the heart to say it was still parked!) If we're in agreement then it should certainly be a solution without boring required but I'll know far more next week as their design check with my own is being progressed over this weekend and early this week. Thanks for the support S15, we've already got a short list of site members that'll be adding these to their present Modern Motorsports drivetrain parts. Next week I'll have details confirmed but we'd expect to see them available this spring. It's truly fun seeing what you guys can crank out for power and performance from these Z's! On a similar note another of our longer term projects is nearly done. Will include a full differential mounting setup for the later R200's and R230's. We've long had the billet R200/R230 CV adaptors and replacement center axles for our customers. Now they won't have to sort their own differential mounts out. Will include full front mount, rear mustache and rear crossover. Will also include the less common later R200 with the 5lug side flanges. More info forthcoming on this (pricing will be finalized when productions costs finalized) but certainly available this spring and first few spoken for by site members including an install by a site guru. Always great to see the support. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stony Posted February 17, 2008 Share Posted February 17, 2008 Nothing soon just keeping up to speed on developments just in case :> I modded the S30 strut to accept the Z31 stubs with cromoly axles and the z31 stubs snapped right at the part where they are the smallest. If someone came up with a bearing setup that would fit the s30 struts and accept your 33 spline stubs that would make allot of people happy. I think with a good aftermarket r-200, chomoly axles, your stubs and running an automatic one could see many 9 sec runs on the bumper ;> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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