Exotic "SOUNDING", high revving V8! Read "ENTIRE" thread before posting!!!

[nicamarvin]

Well I feel the crank would have to be re-drilled since the stock oiling hole would pretty much fall directly between the two rods and most 4 cylinder engines have a rod width roundabouts 1inch while the stock chev rods are .940 width as well. If you managed to wedge two custom rods on there the width would probably be well below .700 width which is starting to get skinny.

 

well, we all know there needs to be custom thing to do, but to me this is the closest thing to a Flat plane I could ever get, plus I don't intend to reve this thing past 6K I just want that cool sound too

[nicamarvin]

check this link

http://www.bucksengines.com/gm-30liter.aspx

 

with guys like GM building this and alot of Race teams basing their engines in the Chevy II 4 cylinder engine there must be alot of Crankshafts around to be had..........and with some work they should be able to work fine,

 

the idea came to me as one guy said if we could take a 4 cylinder crank and make them work on a V8 since a 4 cylinder crank is basicaly a flat plane crankshaft, but our fried BRAAP here said that it could be hard because those engines are too small

 

hey BRAAP what do you think of this idea?

[BRAAP]

well, we all know there needs to be custom thing to do, but to me this is the closest thing to a Flat plane I could ever get, plus I don't intend to reve this thing past 6K I just want that cool sound too

 

For terminologies sake, an inline or opposed 4 cylinder crank shaft IS a flat plane crank.

 

check this link

http://www.bucksengines.com/gm-30liter.aspx

 

with guys like GM building this and alot of Race teams basing their engines in the Chevy II 4 cylinder engine there must be alot of Crankshafts around to be had..........and with some work they should be able to work fine,

 

the idea came to me as one guy said if we could take a 4 cylinder crank and make them work on a V8 since a 4 cylinder crank is basicaly a flat plane crankshaft, but our fried BRAAP here said that it could be hard because those engines are too small

 

hey BRAAP what do you think of this idea?

 

I think that is an excellent idea and I encourage you and anyone else to keep digging and research as much as you can!

 

1) Determine suitable V-8 blocks, (SBF, SBC and SBMopar are all suitable in my mind, don’t' rule out the Mercedes, BMW, Infiniti, Yota V-8's. We are now starting to see those show up in U-pull-it yards which makes the inexpensively accessible).

 

2) Determine suitable 4 cylinder crankshafts with main bearing spacing that matches one or more of those suitable V-8 blocks main web spacing. Don’t get too concerned over bearing diameters, main bearings can be custom made if the crank journals are too small for the block, or the crank can be ground down if the journals are too large.

 

3) After finding matching block and crank combo, rods would be next on the research list. Find as many suitable rods that would fit width wise in the journal, (rods can be machined narrower on the big and small ends), journal diameters, and overall lengths.

 

4) Then pistons. With the very common 4" bore of the Small Block Ford, Chevy and Chrysler/Mopar, there are tons of inexpensive off the shelf pistons in varying pin heights.

 

Here are some single plane cranks;

 

Bryant Crank, (thrust main appears to be in the middle and is one piece rear main seal, possibly Ford, Mopar, Nissan, Toyota?)

 

SBC single plane crank for 2-pce rear main seal;

 

Ferrari F-355 single lane cranks;

 

Toyota 4 cylinder crankshaft that I photo-shopped the oil feed holes for discussion sake in the DIY 180 degree/single plane V-8 crankshaft thread;

Edited November 3, 2009 by BRAAP

[nicamarvin]

For terminologies sake, an inline or opposed 4 cylinder crank shaft IS a flat plane crank.

 

 

 

I think that is an excellent idea and I encourage you and anyone else to keep digging and research as much as you can!

 

1) Determine suitable V-8 blocks, (SBF, SBC and SBMopar are all suitable in my mind, don’t' rule out the Mercedes, BMW, Infiniti, Yota V-8's. We are now starting to see those show up in U-pull-it yards which makes the inexpensively accessible).

 

2) Determine suitable 4 cylinder crankshafts with main bearing spacing that matches one or more of those suitable V-8 blocks main web spacing. Don’t get too concerned over bearing diameters, main bearings can be custom made if the crank journals are too small for the block, or the crank can be ground down if the journals are too large.

 

3) After finding matching block and crank combo, rods would be next on the research list. Find as many suitable rods that would fit width wise in the journal, (rods can be machined narrower on the big and small ends), journal diameters, and overall lengths.

 

4) Then pistons. With the very common 4" bore of the Small Block Ford, Chevy and Chrysler/Mopar, there are tons of inexpensive off the shelf pistons in varying pin heights.

 

Thank you friend, BRAAAP you are one cool guy, I thank you for your cool idea,

 

many Guys at Midget racing just cut a v8 in half and use all the parts they can to save money, others use race built engines(based on the old chevyII 4cylinder engine) guys like fontana make them check this lik: http://www.fontana-automotive.com/4cylinder.html

 

now GM racing is coming with this cool new engine(based on the SBC), it shares some parts with the R07 NASCAR engine, check this link:

http://www.racecar-engineering.com/allarticles/271309/more-than-half-a-v8.html

 

and GM also sells 4 cylinder OHV Vortec engines(also related to the SBC) check this link: http://www.bucksengines.com/gm-30liter.aspx

 

with engines like this I know there must be lots of used crankshafts outthere just waiting for us to use them.....

 

 

[BRAAP]

COOLIO!

 

Did a quick search on some common V-8 bore spacing, just need to find the bore spacing on those hot 4 cylinders and you are that much closer to making this a reality.

 

The SBC and LSx info I know for fact is correct, the others is info I found on the net, you may want to verify for sure.

 

SBChevy is 4.40”

BBChevy 4.84”

GM LSx 4.40”

Caddy Northstar 4.00”

 

SBFord 4.38”

BBFord 4.90”

SBMopar 4.46”

BBMopar 4.80”

 

Infiniti VH/K41/45/56DE 112mm (4.41”)

Toyota 1UZ ???”

[nicamarvin]

COOLIO!

 

Did a quick search on some common V-8 bore spacing, just need to find the bore spacing on those hot 4 cylinders and you are that much closer to making this a reality.

 

The SBC and LSx info I know for fact is correct, the others is info I found on the net, you may want to verify for sure.

 

SBChevy is 4.40”

BBChevy 4.84”

GM LSx 4.40”

Caddy Northstar 4.00”

 

SBFord 4.38”

BBFord 4.90”

SBMopar 4.46”

BBMopar 4.80”

 

Infiniti VH/K41/45/56DE 112mm (4.41”)

Toyota 1UZ ???”

 

DUDE you are my HERO...

 

BUT, BRAAAP why haven't you done this yet? or do you already have that custom made less than 3 inch strok crankshaft of yours?

I know that when I find one of this I will be restricted to the stock stroke I can find...but any ways I dont plan on spining this past 6.5K

 

and do you think 180 degree headers are need it once you have a flat plane crankshaft engine?

[nicamarvin]

I will get the spec on the cranks soon, but now to the Camshaft dilema!! do they have to be custome made? or could I use one of this Midget or marine camshafts(based on the small block V8)?

 

hey MOPAR guys, check this link: here is your FLAT PLANE crankshaft

http://www.allpar.com/mopar/la4.html

[BRAAP]

Easiest route would be the custom ground cam that fits the block. The 4 cylinder cams are missing the lobes for the other 4 cylinders. i.e. Cylinders in a V-8 are not sharing cam lobes.

 

Have you seen this thread about a DIY flat plane crank V-8?

 

http://forums.hybridz.org/showthread.php?t=139545

Gets fairly involved with cranks, rods, cams, etc.

[mikedoubleg]

Just messed up and posted on the wrong thread... (the pinned one)

 

Hey all,

 

Why not using a W8 engine? They sound A+ and according to the VW website, they have 8 brand new units in stock for a huge discount. To me, $4100 for a brand new engine is a steal.

If one of you mechanical wizard manage to mate it to an manual tranny, it will be the easiest route to follow i would guess.

 

Link:

http://www.vwparts.c...et-center/?pg=4

INJ.ENGINE

part number: 07D-100-011-AN original msrp: $29763 discounted price: $4100 saving: 86% available # 8 Passat W8 04

 

My only concern about this engine is the lack of after market support...

[vega]

So I am a pretty fast reader- but this still took me 2 hrs to read all of this info. Great info, albeit has this gone anywhere?

[HowlerMonkey]

I know this thread is old but I've run into some information relevant to the original post concerning "exotic sounding".

 

I got a chance to listen to an original ford GT40 with 180 degree headers and am currently making headers for a few aston martins in which it seems could fit 180 degree headers that meet behind the shallow bellhousing which has immediately necks down to the diameter of the torque tube.

 

There looks like enough room for primary pipes from 32 to 36 inches in length.

 

180 degree headers or engines with a flat plane crank sound exotic..........until you put an exhaust system that merges the exhaust of the two banks or links them with an "X pipe".

 

Also.....your choice of muffling (if used) could very well ruin the awesome sound even if you don't merge the two banks.

Edited September 20, 2012 by HowlerMonkey

[kiwi303]

Here is a new engine option...

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/car-manufacturers/porsche/9573500/Porsches-650000-918-Spyder.html?frame=2353753

 

 

The 918 uses a 580bhp/369lb ft dry-sump, flat-crank 4.6-litre V8 mounted longitudinally behind the cabin.

 

 

however, 650,000 pounds sterling is a bit much!

[Speedmade]

I had posted in this thread in the past. My opinion was to get a Ferrari engine and convert it for RWD

So I decided to try out my theory.

I am adapting a Ferrari 348 motor to a Ford bell housing with a Borg-Warner T5 transmission.
With the help of a friend (and a large CMM unit) I was able to measure the block and bell. I have created the CAD file for the adapter plate and I am sending that off for machining.

Stay tuned
Reed H

 

Edited May 18, 2013 by Speedmade

[Leon]

I had posted in this thread in the past. My opinion was to get a Ferrari engine and convert it for RWD

So I decided to try out my theory.

I am adapting a Ferrari 348 motor to a Ford bell housing with a Borg-Warner T5 transmission.

With the help of a friend (and a large CMM unit) I was able to measure the block and bell. I have created the CAD file for the adapter plate and I am sending that off for machining.

 

Stay tuned

Reed H

 

Dude, you need to start your own project thread on this! That is AWESOME!!!

[socorob]

If you're just looking for the sound, 180 degree headers and Dr Gas frequency mod mufflers gets it sort of close.

[boatbloke]

1. I know this thread is rather old but I have just stumbled upon it and found it quite fascinating. Someone touched on a MerCruiser 4 cylinder being half a v8 - well the MerCruiser 470, which was 3.7 litres and produced 170HP used a Ford big block head, I think Ford pistons, a Ford flywheel and as pointed out a flat plane crank. I have had several to bits years ago and I seem to remember the crank being a big heavy thing. I think it was MerCruisers own block which was made out of aluminium but I have heard it being attributed to a Renault truck. Must have been a custom crank and even if you could re machine it into a V8 then presumably it would be a Ford big block - stroke appears to be pretty much the same, 2 x 3.7litres = 7.4 litres, is that not what the Ford big block is? Incidentally it was a horrid thing..

Want an engine noise to make the hairs on the back of your neck stand up? BMW M5 V10 with special exhausts. 500+ HP and a scream to match. If only I had the budget to firstly buy one and then invest in the sophisticated electronics needed to control the damn thing, find a way of ditching the silly semi automatic gearbox (no manual option in the UK) so I could stick one in my 72 HS30. Hope one of you guys managed to achieve the flat plane sbc!

[Speedmade]

348 motor and T5 trans all mocked up

 

[thedarkie]

Cool!! Watching this one

[Leon]

That may just be the most awesome V8 swap ever...

[Sven]

Looking on Fontana's website from one of the previous links, it appears to me that they are cnc'ing their own aluminum bock and copies of LS heads. Their listed data does no mentio bore spacing, but the deck height is in the ballpark to be a 4 cylinder LS3. I'm not in a position to do this now, but has anyone contacted them about the crank for their "new" midget engine? I have dreams of a dry sump ITB titanium rod flat crank LS7 dancing in my head.