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Mike Kelly's Zcar Project


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Motor is carrying 40-45PSI constant at idle. I believe when I called RacerParts Wholesale, they told me I would need the 20-25# unit. I questioned them and they said it should be fine... Funny thing is now that I have it all installed and the motor running, it clearly isn't working.

 

Mike

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I'm sure you've seen this but

 

AccusumpTM not filling or filling too slowly

It should be noted that the standard electric valve units fill slowly. The design of the valve is to ensure that too much oil is not diverted from the engine during refill. These units are recommended for pre-oiling and not for surge control. The EPC electric valve will fill slowly until the pressure threshold is reached at which time it will rapid fill.

Other reasons for slow or no refill:

1) The manual valve is not being opened completely.

2) The EPC is wired incorrectly. When the pressure is above the threshold, the valve should not be energized.

3) The wrong EPC pressure threshold was selected for your engine's pressure range. The pressure threshold

should be below the engines normal operating pressure.

4) The EPC valve may be plumbed incorrectly. The pressure sender should be installed closer to the engine than

the electric valve.

5) The electric valve may be installed backwards. It should be mounted so the port marked “IN†is plumbed to

the AccusumpsTM and the port marked “Out†is plumbed to the line running to the engine. When the valve is

mounted backwards oil will not enter when it is in the off position.

6) The feed lines or connecting port is too small.

7) The pre-charge is too high and not letting oil enter.

8) The unit is bent, distorted or mounted incorrectly.

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Mike, is your reason for the Accusump surge control or pre-oiling?

It seems that since this is a race car, you'd want to not be using the EPC at least in the normal fashion, since the flow is too slow for surge control?

AccusumpTM not filling or filling too slowly
It should be noted that the standard electric valve units fill slowly. The design of the valve is to ensure that too much oil is not diverted from the engine during refill. These units are recommended for pre-oiling and not for surge control. The EPC electric valve will fill slowly until the pressure threshold is reached at which time it will rapid fill.

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Pete, This is why I bought the EPC (from Canton):

 

"For high performance applications that require rapid refill and constant discharges we recommend the EPC electric valve listed below.

For those looking for the convenience of an electric valve and the fast refill rate required in racing applications our (electric pressure control) E.P.C. electric valves are recommended. The pressure control system keeps the electric valve in the off position during times of normal oil pressure. With the valve in the off position it is able to quickly recharge the Accusump with oil pressure after discharge, thus being ready for the next oil surge. When the engine's oil pressure drops below the EPC Valve's preset level the valve opens and releases the stored oil in to the system. Like our standard electric valve the EPC valve can be wired to a remote dash-mounted switch or can be wired directly into the ignition so it will turn on and off automatically when the ignition is in the 'on' or the 'off' position."

 

 

 

In my old configuration before this rebuild, I had only a standard pre-oiling valve.  But after the problems with oiling and this motor, I ordered the EPC last fall and installed it because I wanted a rapid response and wanted something that would allow for more than pre-start oiling.  After lengthy discussions with the folks I bought it from and from reading on Canton's site, I ordered the EPC.  If I can't get this thing sorted, I'll just remove it all together and see how the combo of the 6.5 quarts of oil and the cooler handle it.  If that doesn't work, Maybe I'll convert to a drysump.  The tank and lines will be able to be re-used when I convert to the LSjuan build.

 

Mike


 

Edited by Mikelly
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Mike. If the valve is working and it sounds like it did before, is bet you have air in the Accusump. Run the air side up to 60 to purge and then reset base line pressure again. Do it a few times until you get it to work correctly.

 

Mine did he same thing when I first put it together. Took a few times to get the air out and oil in.

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Mike, I found the source of my confusion

There are 2 different designs for the EPS (click link to their catalog page for these)

One design is for pre-oiling and is low flow (PN 24-270)

The other is for surge control and high flow (PN 24-271, 245-273, or 24-275, depending on which pressure range you want)

I'm betting that the low flow one used to be the only one available and the text that mark quoted from their troubleshooting page that talks about the EPC not to be used for surge control is from a time when they offered the low flow version only?

Word to the wise - be careful buying an EPC if you want to use it for surge control - make sure it is the 24-271, 273 or 275 (which are high flow versions) or is the 24-270 version that's been converted with their upgrade kit, 24-271K, 24-273K, or 24-275K.

Edited by pparaska
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Pete, that is exactly why I bought the unit I bought. It is the 24271 unit.

 

On other unrelated notes, I got my fire system in today. I will start the install on it once I have the accusump issue resolved.

 

Mike

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So the Zcar is on hold while I finish up the suspension on the Mustang.  doing a full Eibach pro plus kit to get rid of the 4X4 stance and make the car go around corners flatter.

 

I'll get back on the Zcar next week, promise!

Mike

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Started the install of the fire system and I'm most of the way done with it.  I have routed two nozzels into the engine bay, one to the driver's seat mid-section, and one to the fuel cell area.  I need to mount the cables (one inside the car, one ouside the car) and drill the holes and mount the straps.  That should do it. 

 

After that, I'll troubleshoot the accusump, then do an alignment. 

 

Mike

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Hi Mike,

 

What type of fire system?  If you have halon or similar make sure you don't get sprayed directly because even wearing nomex I got a good burn when mine went off in a formula car.  It also is very good at displacing oxygen you need to breath.

 

Cary

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Cary, I have one nozzle aimed basically at my crotch.  It is a AFFF (Aqueous Film Forming Foam) based system.

 

Today I managed to get the accusump issues resolved and also installed the rest of the fire system.  I then moved on to wiring up the coolsuit box.  I'm most of the way thru that, and once that is done, I'll wrap up the alignment!

 

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Cary, I have one nozzle aimed basically at my crotch.  It is a AFFF (Aqueous Film Forming Foam) based system.

 

Today I managed to get the accusump issues resolved and also installed the rest of the fire system.  I then moved on to wiring up the coolsuit box.  I'm most of the way thru that, and once that is done, I'll wrap up the alignment!

 

61527_636859972997097_635327501_n_zpscee559525_636821523000942_1468300432_n_zps9485178_636860172997077_1619775669_n_zpsb

I really like the pillar aero treatment, mine is duct tape presently. I'm going to steal that design or at least go in that direction. Its something Ive been wanting to do for a while. I want to incorporate the quarter window in the design as well.

 

Diamond plate works but is heavy compared to other composites. Was that a budgetary decision? Which I understand better than most.........

 

BTW........The fender vents work great and I did some vents on the rear flares as well to release the pressure. Just cut vents in the rears and did mesh then painted flat black. 

 

Check your schedule for July 20-21 for the NASA races at VIR. I will be staying over for my friends Monday event on the 22nd as well. Join us for a great three days...............(I usually will get a hotel room for Tuesday and sleep for 18 hrs before trying to drive home)

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Matt, PICS on the rear Vents???

 

And I am flatter, borrow anything on my car that will help!!! The diamond plate is aluminum and very thin and light.

 

Mike

Edited by Mikelly
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Dude the event we are doing at the end of the month is 3 days, four 30 minute sessions per day, plus a student and his sessions.  When I'm done at the track it normally takes me a few days to bounce back!

 

Mike

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