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project choice: s13 vs s30 2+2


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If you're looking into spending $$ on the S30, I went to ecology (junkyard) and saw a 1977 2+2 with an EFI L28.

And there's a 50% off sale this saturday and sunday 06/05/2010 & 06/06/2010.

 

Bleh I got NOTHING this weekend. I needed injectors to get my Z running and wanted to do the E12-80 dizzy swap while I was at it. Well, I did get the door cards out of the 2+2 to use as a form if I do some fiberglassing or whatever.

 

As for 2+2 and heaviness, my 76 weighed in at 2695# at SanAntonio Dragway, and that coincided nicely with my consistent 15.50 1/4 mile times (and that was with my then 255# frame in the car, wet. It is of course a Fairlady Z 2/2, but anything you have on that car you can do to a 280Z and get nearly an identical weight out of it. Power for that kind of weight is relatively easy to achieve to a 10:1 P/W Ratio with even a non-intercooled low-boost turbo. Thing is this would be a non-forged internals setup so your RPMS would be limited to below 7000.

 

Funny that you mention keeping revs low without forged internals. This is a big concern of mine on the KA build I was planning. I wanted forged more for the insurance against failure caused by the long stroke and high piston speeds rather than actually needing them for my power goal. What's the verdict on this? You also said you have 40k of dailying, so I'm assuming that includes some kind of track time - what's your experience dailying a boosted, stock bottom end motor that gets thrashed on the weekends?

 

We used Bad Dog Frame Rails for 'rust repair' on our Bonneville car (1976 280Z 2+2). There are some extensions to make because the floor is longer (as noted) but the sections that are not covered by the front and rear frame parts Bad Dog Sells are simple box structures easily made at any commercial HVAC shop for pennies. They can make a "Hat Stringer" for duct reinforcement out of 12 or 14 gauge electroplated or flashed steel usually up to 12' long for a reasonable price, and you will be amazed where you find it will fit nicely for stiffening up a floorboard or other project.

 

Any chance there are pics floating around somewhere? I haven't had a chance to familiarize myself with any specific 2+2 weaknesses.

 

- The more you modify the suspension to improve track performance, the less fun it's going to become as a DD. I don't know how an S30 compares in this regard to an S13, but I'd guess that the S30 would need more agressive mods so perhaps a well set up S13 would be easier on the street? I don't know this - perhaps others can chime in here.

 

I'm not a huge fan of the 2+2 due to the extra weight, but I suspect that a warmed-over (engine and suspension) 2+2 would be pretty unique just about anywhere you went. You'd surprise a lot of people on the track I'm sure.

 

This, this, THIS! This describes my dilemma exactly. I am wondering if it is reasonable to assume that I can build my Z to handle as well as my s13 on the track and street. I am finding that a lot of the modifications that people are doing like subframe swap, steering rack swap and hell even brake swap are really outside the cost ($$$ and time)/benefit ratio for me. Don't wanna be another cookie cutter s13 but I also realize it's probably the better platform for me. :(

 

in my opinion s13 is the best option here. however if you trying to drift a z i would consider the steering angle, brake, and suspension options. suspension gets expensive rather quickly on these cars.

 

definitely a change from all the s13's

 

I dunno man, serious drifters for S13s need all kinds of stuff to set up that multilink... RUCAs, LCAs, toe rods, damn. STA rear == less parts to buy :rolleyes:

 

Good ish guys. I had my flame shield on expecting posts like 'gtfo S13 and 2+2s both suck lulz'. The 2+2 Z seems more FUN to me, a unique SMOG TEST FREE project (woot!) but the s13 is more of a sure thing, albeit one that 782321 people have also built...

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the s13 multi link stuff is alot more avaliable than the z stuff.

but if your serious a z isn't the best option anyways

but yea

 

i've actually been wanting to do a Z 2+2 drift/fun car

because i actually like them :blink:

they remind me of the older skylines etc.

and also because of the increased wheel base which is similar to an s14

 

 

do it :lol:

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Honesty. Sorry if it seems a trifle rude.

 

My reaction was "If you have to ask the question of S30 versus S13, and "the D word" is involved at all, then the 240SX is your answer..

 

 

If I knew a guy with a 91 Z-28, and a '70 Z-28, and he was thinking of setting one up for a street/some track Fun DD car, and wanted to know which he should do.. I know I'd be pointing at the third gen. Save the Papa John Z-28 for a big hole in the hood and a blower, something to spin out on the weekends to turn heads and have fun and look cool in.. that MAYBE sees 1500 miles a year.

 

SURE, your pretty Z-car is going to be used a HECKUVA lot more than that, but keep the Z for putting a fancypants looking engine with triple webers under the hood to look cool and score street cred at weekends when you show up in that instead of the 240SX. The Z can have ANYTHING done to it, and this way you can take the projects on it one step at a time and do them right.

 

If you want a unique drift car, go get an 80's 4WD Subaru, convert it to RWD, (a Z-car or 240SX driveline could be used for this, with an R180 rear end and an adapter plate to bolt the trans to the engine. The transmissions used in the Z-car, the 240SX, and the Subarus were all of VERY VERY common lineage.) drop an NA EJ22 into the thing and do something for rear E-brake (the soobies had E-brake on the front!!(?)!) and THEN you will turn heads. BRAT, station wagon, coupe, sedan, or even the rare Touring Wagon with the 2 1/2" hi-rise roof... LEETNESS!!

 

 

So if I seemed blunt or rude at the outset, I figured I would get bizarre for comic relief. All my comments were intended to help you reach your best outcome; good luck!

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No way, not rude at all. Ya I'm prob gonna stick with my S13 cause it suits my goals better. To be honest I was hoping to hear that there was something awful about the 2+2 to make my decision easier heh. Appreciate the straight talk. Maybe this thread will help someone else out heh. Mad respect for S30s... gotta respect your elders :D

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You *could* also get ahold of an L28 to drop into your S13....... It has been done before! Six cylinder goodness, still Nissan, without the price of getting an RB... Throw it together with some carbs and its easy to get 200 horse for 2K, if you can find the right engine package to pick up, or maybe a bit more if you have to source things and put it together yourself. The transmission from the S13 is swapped into S30s frequently by way of a modified L-series bellhousing on the S13 gearbox... so that much is easy, you just have to fit the engine under the hood. Not sure how easy this is or is not, but as I said it HAS been done before and it would certainly turn heads just from the sound. :D

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  • 3 weeks later...

Go S30 2+2 I have owned mine for more than 20 years and everyone seems to want it...I belong to one of the biggest NEWER Z club in Chicago and my 76Z is more popular everywhere it goes. its fast and unique, any motor can be installed and you will never lose money on a well modified S30 2+2....unlike most S13's

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You *could* also get ahold of an L28 to drop into your S13....... *snip* its easy to get 200 horse for 2K

 

Can't do that in CA (legally). I could however legally put a KA in an s30. Engine has to be same year or newer. Also, buttloads of power can be made on a KA for much less than 2k. Engine choice is the least of my worries since I was planning a KA-T for the s13, and my s30 has infinitely many options because it doesn't require a smog check.

 

my 76Z is more popular everywhere it goes. its fast and unique, any motor can be installed and you will never lose money on a well modified S30 2+2....unlike most S13's

 

Hmm yeah that's my deal. I get a LOT of encouragement to do up the s30 because it's unique, which I certainly value but I just don't get the same warm fuzzies like I do my s13. Ultimately, I'm building this for myself, but deciding what's "best" is elusive, if not impossible.

 

Citation needed

 

+1 My s30 needs some parts and I hate buying stock replacements only to dump them for aftermarket goodies soon after. If I jump into aftermarket, I'm out that money when I go to sell, unless potential buyers think like 2Zowner :)

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