ShaggyZ's 2J8Z: 280Z + 2JZ-GTE

[ShaggyZ]

I don't have time to write up a good story right now, but here are the preliminary pictures of the 2JZ-GTE hanging into the engine bay. It's really just for motivation because I know it fits thanks to a number of pioneering members.

 

List of points:

- bought this '77 off ebay on July 4th, 2007 but a terrible motorcycle accident, marriage, moving, and a baby on the way has put off the project for quite awhile

- it sat for 10 years before I bought it

- lots of suspension and brake parts need to be replaced/upgraded

- just bought a 3.15 LSD R200 to go with the R154 I got for free

- I'm debating using the stock twins or spending another $1000+ to go single now.

- the 2JZ comes off ebay for $1500 from a guy who was going to use it in his Mustang to compete in some class of drag racing which changed from 2 power adders to 1, so he couldn't use N2O to spool up his monster turbo. The engine is from an Aristo but the seller put on a Supra mid-sump oil pan. I prefer the Aristo engine because it's less likely to have been beat on as compared to a Poopra engine.

 

(click for larger pictures)

 

 

 

[ShaggyZ]

Small update: I've been trying hard to clean out the garage by selling off the superfluous parts in my garage and I'm finally at a place where I feel I can focus on the install. I had three transmissions, three differentials, and three engines in the garage. It's good to be getting rid of that stuff to make a small amount of money and to not be so cluttered.

 

The project as a whole seems insurmountable as I've never done anything close to this before. It's very helpful to just only think about the first step or I get discouraged.

 

I have to replace the brake system (already installed rear discs), shocks/struts, springs, bushings, fuel system, and install MegaSquirt. I may pass on all of the suspension parts while I work on getting the car actually moving under its own power so I can also take time to save up a little more money for the suspension, wheels, and tires.

[ShaggyZ]

The project has been on hold for a number of reasons. Money is the primary. I did, however, get a hold of some Toyota S12 calipers and slotted rotors and installed them not too long ago. I inspected the bearings and regreased them. I was amazed to see they were in such good shape. This car is so low mileage, having sat for 10 years; I believe the bearings are fine as they've been preserved by the grease.

 

Having just blown an oil line on my XR4Ti on the way back from my short vacation with my wife for our first anniversary, I've got to devote MORE time to that car. We drove 90 miles with a smokescreen behind us because I was too stubborn and stupid to pay for a tow truck and figure out a way to get our trailered motorcycles home. The car went through 25 quarts of oil and I gave up 10 miles from home and called on my dad and brother for assistance. The turbo oil supply line sprung a pinhole leak that only worsened and drenched the underside of the car and the trailer and motorcycles.

[ShaggyZ]

Short, not particularly interesting update and no pictures.

 

I finally decided (remembered, rather) to install the gas tank I bought off a guy who had it completely refreshed; the original tank was NASTY and rusty and I sold it for $30 - the kid didn't care it was so gross. I've wondered if I should modify it for any reason: baffling, larger outlets. Right now, I'm going to leave it alone as I've gathered that the stock 280Z fuel tank and fittings are adequate for a ~$400 HP turbo engine. Installing a fuel tank for the first time using a bum left wrist that is weak and inflexible and a right shoulder that has something torn in it is not an easy task. It took awhile, but I got it all back in and, hopefully, the hardened rubber hoses on top of the tank and the fill-hose will hold up; replacing them didn't look like fun (how do you pull out the right rear internal panel?!) and I was determined to finish installing the tank right then and there.

 

I will, of course, be looking for a decent inline fuel pump. I may even look to using a stock MKIV Supra fuel pump, though those might be in-tank. I'd like it to be factory quiet. Perhaps just good rubber isolation will be enough if I go with the standard Walbro 255 or Bosch 044 (I think those are the right numbers).

 

Otherwise, I spent some time pulling out the rest of the engine harness and trying to figure out what should stay and what should go. I stared at the harness after pulling it from the passenger cabin to the engine compartment; I was thinking I might leave it hooked up to the ECU's pigtail/plug/harness for now because I might use the information I'll get from knowing what went where as I begin the Megasquirt installation. We'll see. I'm sure I'll probably just pull it out before long without caring.

 

Prior to disassembling anything on the car, I hooked up a battery to test some of the electrics; really, I just checked the lights and most of them worked and looked great. After pulling the engine, I applied power back to the harness as part of a way to find out which wires were the headlights, blinkers, markers, horn, etc, so I'd know what to leave alone. Long story short, I couldn't get any power to anything and every light connector had continuity with ground. I dont know why this is and I was hoping for the quick and dirty, work hard, not smart problem solving to figure it out: it didn't work out. I still don't understand, but pulling all the unnecessary wiring will simplify the problem.

 

Fortunately, because this car is so low-mileage and it sat for 10 years, the wiring and connections look fantastic; I fully intend to reuse a great deal of it.

 

I also pulled the brake booster and, though it looked pretty crusty on the bottom, might actually be usable. I don't think I'm going to use it. I've considered looking to other vehicles, such as Toyota Supras, to use their brake booster and master cylinder. The only two complicated things for me are the diameter of the brake boost (interference with the clutch master cylinder) and modifying the shaft of said brake booster to work with the Z pedal. I've read too many complaints about non-OEM (read $500 brake boosters from Nissan) not to entertain the idea of other brake boosters. After all, this is the same mentality that had me choose a 2JZGTE over the L28ET. If you have any ideas, I welcome messages sent through HybridZ.

[ShaggyZ]

My work on this project will have to be non-costing only for awhile as I've been out of the job for a couple months and am nearly out of money. Stupid economy!!

 

Spent some time last night dropping the 2JZ into the engine bay again and examining clearances and the possibility of using the Toyota Aristo engine mounts. The main reason I'm not going to go with the Beta Motorsports crossmember ($350 + shipping) is that I'd have to buy Toyota Supra mounts ($200+ easily) and isolators ($150ish).

 

I sat the engine as low and far back as possible. The driver's side Aristo mount clears the steering shaft by 5mm, so I don't know what I want to do. I'll likely end up fabricating entirely my own mounts and using the Jaguar V12 isolators that go for so cheap on eBay.

 

While the engine was in there, I started eyeing the Aristo dipstick again. I didn't think I could use it because it doesn't have the correct shape or bracket; really, I don't even know if it goes to the right depth - I'll decide once I put oil in it. BUT, I spent a half hour gently bending the dipstick tube into a shape that works and bolts up to the intake manifold where I believe it should. The clearances are tight and there is one bend that is a bit tight, offering a bit of resistance to insertion and removal of the dipstick itself, but I'm fairly confident it'll be fine. I don't know what other front-to-rear-sump 2JZ purchasers do; my guess is that they're buying new, correct parts or scour forums, eBay, and rear sump engines in junk yards.

 

Several months ago, I remember looking at Z-Gad's alternator setup and figured I could do something similar. I believe he said he fabricated a bracket. While the engine was hanging in the engine bay, I messed with that, too. Over the past few days, I've been moving around my leftover L28e parts to clean up and sell some of them; I remembered the L28 alternator bracket and wondered if that would work. The short: it had to be flattened out from it's zig-zag shape, but it works great. I was hoping to have a fancier setup that threads out to move the alternator out and tighten the serpentine belt so I don't have to use a crow bar in one hand and tighten the bolts with the other, but this will be just fine for now.

 

Also, while in that area, I decided to remove the OEM serpentine belt tensioner. It's just three 13mm bolts and it comes right out. Unfortunately, when the first one broke loose, my socket popped off and went right down the timing belt hole. It took about 15 minutes to fish it out with a bent hanger - I was not interested in removing anything just to get a socket out of there. As much tension as the tensioner provides, I'm amazed how light it is - easily around, if not less than, 1 lb. I suppose I'm a little disappointed that it doesn't remove more weight... like 10lbs!!

 

I took pictures to show the modified and installed dipstick and the removed tensioner along with the new alternator bracket, but HybridZ's albums aren't accepting my upload for some reason.

[ShaggyZ]

Money spending commence! Well, kinda.

 

I reluctantly sold my XR4Ti a couple weeks ago for $3k; I bought it a few years ago for $750 with a blown head gasket but brought it back to life and put a lot of parts on it from my other XR4Ti and a lot of love. It had beautiful, comfortable leather seats, heat/AC, sunroof, power windows, cruise control, and character - it was in great shape (way better than most)and had huge potential. It's now gone for financial and emotional reasons - it was a love/hate relationship and I ultimately let it go so I'd have one less project.

 

My wife and I agreed we would use some of that cash to put toward the 2JZ project just to make one nice, big step for motivational purposes; also, it would get me a little further along so that some day soon I can have only the Z and my SV650 and her '97 Corolla as the family car in which to tote around our lovely 6-month-old daughter.

 

I knew exactly what I was going for - the 2JZ-to-R154 bell housing! I also bought another little goody, the Toyota factory 1.125" shifter extension pieces (some say 1.25", but I think that pushes it a bit, though, it is definitely over 1"). I have some pictures of the parts for you guys who can't "read" without pictures; it's nice to read illustrated works, I know. The total for all three pieces (bellhousing, shifter extension and shifter extension housing) came out to $476 after tax and shipping. It's about $50 steeper than I was expecting because the shifter pieces are more expensive than I'd last seen reported. There's a picture of the invoice attached so you can see part numbers, descriptions and prices; there will be explicit detail at the bottom of this post.

 

One thing of note: the new bellhousing (it's basically from the R154'd 1JZGTE cars) is ~1.5" shorter than the bellhousing for the 7MGTE. There was an initial shock when I opened up the big box and found a little box and thought "there's no way there's a bellhousing in there... they screwed something up. Poop!" But then I opened it up and saw the purple paint (you'll see that on every one) and knew it was okay. Still, feeling that is seemed shallower or shorter than the other, I took it out for measurement and confirmed my suspicion. I began to wonder if other 2JZ swappers forgot to mention needing to shorten the input shaft, but have ultimately determined there must be enough difference between the rears of the 2JZ/1JZ and the 7M engines.

 

I'm excited and pleased with myself for having researched the shifter extension I mentioned in the Toyota L6 section; actually, I created an independent thread here, but no one seemed interested enough to comment. After seeing other 1JZ/R154 or 2JZ/R154 installations into S30's by the likes of Gritz and timbo1jz, I felt comfortable with needing only another 1" to put the shifter in an acceptable location. There is another option to extend the shifter which I could do for ~$10 in parts and $40 in aluminum TIG welding or pay a grossly overpriced $300 for the ~4" extension Driftmotion sells, which caters to SC300 and MK4 Supra guys who want to run the R154 instead of the auto or W58, and is made exactly the same way anybody in their garage would make. The nice, factory, cast aluminum part is a MUCH better solution for anyone needing only just a bit more length. Despite the extension, the 2JZ will have to be set very near the firewall - my guess is within an inch; I'm totally fine and actually prefer this for handling, weight characteristics, cleanliness, and room in front of the engine, which also facilitates bringing the radiator and intercooler further back. [anger plug]There's a particular member here who still owes me $300 for the 3.7 LSD I sold him for a miniscule $400 over 8 months ago; he's been dodging me ever since. When I do hunt and confront him, he's deceptively contrite and the last time I spoke to him he said he had these longer extension pieces and I suggested we make a deal to include those parts, end our transaction, and improve his character - not a word since... 2 months later. Until he makes this right, I may go out of my way to dissuade others from having any dealings with him that don't involve immediate payment. You're on COD buddy![/anger plug]

 

That pretty much covers the purposes so following you'll find the info on acquiring said products.

 

1JZ R154 Bellhousing - $300

Toyota part # - 31111-14111

 

longer R154 shifter lever "housing" - $26

Toyota part # - 33521-24040

strange naming on the invoice because I don't know how it's a housing

 

longer R154 shifter lever housing "retainer"

Toyota part # - 33570-24010

this is the outside piece that bolts onto the transmission

 

 

I've heard before that Champion Toyota is the place to talk to about getting the bellhousing for this swap. There's a Champion Toyota here in Austin so I thought I'd run over there one afternoon when I was ready to start spending. After giving the guy the part numbers and coming up with nothing, I said "well, weird... a lot of people have bought stuff from you." The parts dude then tells me that some people confuse Champion of Austin for Champion of Houston. "There's one in Houston?!" He mentions a guy named Jeff may be the one to help me; then, another parts guy walks up and says "oh ya, Jeff Watson is his name. If you need JDM stuff, you need to talk to him." Sweet! So I Googled Jeff Watson and found his name all over the place for 2JZ and Supra stuff. Unfortunately, the last mention of him I saw was in 2006 and the earliest was 2002 so I was concerned he would no longer be at Toyota. Well, I called up and mentioned his name and he picked the phone right up and knew exactly what I needed. I paid by Visa and expected 4 weeks (Jeff said) for the shifter parts to arrive from Japan, but he said they have the bellhousing in stock! I ordered on February 23 and received all of the parts today, March 6th - 10 BUSINESS DAYS!!!

 

Summary: Champion Toyota could have gotten the bellhousing alone to me for $335 shipped (tax is 8.25% here). Jeff Watson is the man to talk to - he's been a valuable asset and a great 2JZ advocate; it'll be sad if/when he's no longer on the scene.

 

BY THE WAY: I've been thinking about restarting this project thread in a different section, such as Toyota L6, so I can get feedback and more traffic. I don't really want it littered up with questions from outsiders or kids who "love everything Supra and JDM" but are really just crazy. The truth is that I'm not a seasoned engine builder or engine swapper and I've never done any tuning before; this is my first real project and I'm trying to do it fairly "right," hence the nearly indestructible 2JZGTE and R154 and the slow and steadyish pace I'm working at. Please PM me if you have some solutions for me or even some compliments. Thanks.

[ShaggyZ]

Yep, I haven't done crap with this project. In March 2010, I went from working almost 30hrs/week from home to about 8 and that don't pay the bills for a family of 3. I got a real job, a good job in June and we're climbing back out of minor debt and medical bills from our now-2yr old daughter and the birth of her sister a few months ago. I've also been investing a lot of time and my little play money in motorcycles and getting my racing license; not a real good idea when you got a family but my wife encourages me to do so.

 

The car has been sitting in the garage and becoming a shelf and it is really sad. Since starting my job, I've had a 35 minute commute in the morning and 45 minute in the evening and I come across cool-sounding cars occasionally that inspire me slightly. A couple weeks ago, I was riding in my friend's LQ4-swapped Chevy pickup and we raced a built Honda Civic hatchback and totally killed it; something about that made me really want to get off my butt and either sell the Z or get to work on it.

 

For now, I'm determined to start work on it again. I visited the metal-supply place today to pick out some engine/tranny mount materials and I have on my to-do list to start constructing some of my old design ideas out of cardboard. Thinking solid motor mounts or merely isolated by a square of one of my track takeoff motorcycle tires so some of the high frequency vibes will be absorbed... maybe. I don't know what I'm doing but I plan to learn the hard way! The motor mounts may consist of 2"x2" 11ga. square carbon steel tube welded to and coming nearly 90° out from metal plates that bolt to the engine in the stock position; these tubes will extend to the top of the frame rails where they will rest either on and bolt to more steel laid flat (maybe angled as much as 30°) on the frame rails. Two concerns: 1.) I don't trust welded materials if I've seen them welded versus materials that show up welded (weird thing I have) and 2.) driveline angles!

 

It was a pleasant surprise the metal I need for the initial part comes out to only $11 so it looks like all my mount materials could be less than $50.

 

Next update will hopefully be within a few weeks.

[ShaggyZ]

Bummer update. The short: I chose to try out motorcycle racing and now my time, money, and space are committed to that. I've made almost no progress on this project and figured it was going to be awhile longer so it's silly just to let stuff sit in my garage.

 

With two young daughters and a loving wife, I've chosen to only do one expensive hobby and, for now, it's the motorcycle. Over the past month, I sold off all the 2JZ parts and finally sold the engine yesterday. Possibly selling the Z and my primary commuter to get one fun car with back seats, like a 240SX, Fox body Mustang, or possibly a 2+2 Z. Though, now that I sold the 2JZ, I'm kinda thinking about doing what I can to find a good drivetrain to put in this for cheap so I can drive it and possibly sell it as a driving vehicle. I'm getting my speed fix in racing so I don't need a 400HP car for now; a 250HP L28ET would suit me fine

 

Probably not gonna need the 3.15 R200 LSD anymore so someone shoot me an email if you're interested and you've got something like $1000. Includes vented rear cover and Z31 turbo halfshafts.

Edited March 25, 2011 by ShaggyZ

[ShaggyZ]

Hello. I'm back. Sold the 77 to buy our first house in early 2012, then got a small insurance settlement from a car I got for free and paid for a very low mile '89 Fox body coupe 2.3. Has back seats. Tried to stick a 1JZ + R154 in it without spending much money on a K-member or other stuff. Didn't work out. Lost momentum when our 3rd child came along. Got tired of looking at the Mustang and tired of not having a Z. Found another good Z here in Austin last week and bought it the same day I sold the Mustang. So the plan now is likely to put the 1JZ in this car. Already collecting parts. May just piggyback this thread...

Edited June 18, 2013 by ShaggyZ

[Boosted12]

DO it!