Fiberglass Newbie :)

[Guest Anonymous]

Hey Zeds,

well I've got some time on my hands with school done, and I've decided to start on a few turbo sub-projects. Including making a fiberglass a-pillar gauge pod. I think its an awesome addition to the "cockpit" and I will need 2 more gauges.. A/F meter and boost, Then I will probably replace the clock with a fuel pressure and call it good. So anyway, I've read through this on exactly what I want:

http://www.hybridz.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=8;t=000683

Lone made a good "recipe"

So I went out and bought a few things to start up this project.. All Evercoat products I bought at home depot:

Evercoat "everfix" epoxy resin and hardener (1pt each)

Evercoat Pro Fiberglass resin finish coat 1 qt (opted between this and laminating resin, wasn't sure, finish seemed better)

formula 27 all purpose filler

sea glass fiberglass cloth, and a few foam brushes.

I also got some of that flower wetform stuff, about 10x3x4 which seems big enough. So I'm about to follow Lones instruction and cut/press the foam to make the basic shape. I'm just planning on making something that basically contours the two 2 1/16" gauges.. smooth and ease of sanding etc being ideal here. So...

once I mold/melt the flower foam into roughly what shape I want, then do I paint it for best fiberglass non-absorbsion? Or what should I coat it with? Another very confoozing thing in my mind is that this will be a negative-something-or-other (read the term used in another 'glass post). Meaning the glass will totally double back the mold and it wouldn't be able to just pull out, so once its dry how will I remove the foam (or wouldn't I just be able to leave it in there?). Just use acetate? I read that multiple molds are necessary for doing something with negative-whatever. Did I buy everything I will need or should I buy the laminating stuff instead of the finish (which has wax?). Anyway moving on, after painting or coating the mold, then I mix the resin/hardner and apply with the foam brush, or sea foam cloth? How thick should the resin/glass/resin coats be? I'd like to have to do this only once

then, using the bondo-fiber filler stuff just contour the rest and then let dry, sand, paint? What would look best for painting, once again I'm unsure on this as I have no experience in this area... I've heard of gel coating first? I don't mind giving it the krylon touch just so long as it looks decent. Any/all help is appreciated. If this turns out good I might try to do my own fender flairs, that would certainly solve my problem of finding some decent ones!

TIA

-980mak

[Guest Anonymous]

Oops

Meaning the glass will totally double back the mold and it wouldn't be able to just pull out, so once its dry how will I remove the foam

Brain fart!

Now I realize how this isn't actually a negative form, since there will be no 'glass on the a-pillar side. Well, still need help with the other things!

[Jeff]

I didn't see your post until this morning. I was the one talking about negative draft and multiple part molds. This doesn't apply in your case because your are fabricating a custom part and not a mold. Molds are used to cast multilple parts from. Once you have your part fabricated you could use it to pull a mold from.

 

Lone's explanation is very good and takes you through step by step. The fiberglass will not need to be very thick for this application, 1/8" to 3/16" should be fine. You will need to remove the foam as it will prevent you from being able to install the gauges and the foam will release easier if you coat it first. The fiberglass will be rough and you will need to sand and body fill to your desired finish. I would use a texture paint to try and match the other plastic panels in the vehicle.

 

Just take your time it's not that difficult and the materials are very forgiving. You can fix just about any mistake you make.

[Guest Anonymous]

Thanks Jeff,

but I'm still curious about the other stuff I asked. I have the epoxy resin, hardner, and fiberglass resin. Should I use the fiberglass resin instead of the laminating? And I'm still unsure of the role of the sea glass, you cover the mold and apply the resin/hardner to it and work it in until the white cloth fibers disappear (says instructions)? So will I be good for just spraying my foam with some sandable primer or will the resin stick to/absorb that also? Fiberglass seems like a lot of fun to work with however I've never seen the process myself.

-980mak

[Jeff]

Lets see if we can hit the rest of these.

 

1. Spraying the foam with primer is fine. This is just an aid to help it release later. It still will not come out completely clean, just use a little acetone if you want it all gone.

 

2. I prefer the polyester or fiberglass resin over the epoxy simply because it sets faster.

 

3. The following is a quote from Lone, he describes it perfectly.

Lay down a coat of resin, lay a sheet of glass on it and then take a small brush and slowly wet the mat with the resin and trying to remove folds and air bubbles. Repeat with another coat of resin and glass and its nearly done.

Hope this helps, once you give it a try you'll find it's not that difficult. Don't forget to always wear a pair of latex gloves when you're working with fiberglass and/or acetone.

[Guest Anonymous]

Well this is what came of it. I used the epoxy because I hoped it would be slower to cure/easier to correct mistakes. Well it was all cake until it came to laying the glass. I had some moderately sharp corners so through and through quite a few folds were produced, and while the whole thing was set there really wasn't any way to "work it out." The actual bezel face is quite flat and should be smooth after sanding, all of the folded underneath looks like crap.. and I should probably do another layer. Now the next part just pissed me off. Well I got to using both my hands as the glass was pretty hard to work with. Baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaad mistake. I layed the glass 5 hours ago, my hands are still sticky

not to mention literally half the things in my house as I'm looking for some acetone. I don't think this stuff will clean with anything else. I was hoping to get a few other things done today, but I spent about 4 hours cleaning up.

This thing better work

-980mak

[Guest Anonymous]

PAM in the spray can for cooking skillets makes a good cheap spray on release agent for molds.

[DavyZ]

Originally posted by Tomahawk Z:

PAM in the spray can for cooking skillets makes a good cheap spray on release agent for molds.

Now that's a GREAT idea!!! Heh heh, who would have thunk. I'll buy the butter flavored kind to make it even more enjoyable! (I just hope the wofe doesn't find it 'missing' for a while when I need it).

 

Davy

[Guest Anonymous]

Tomahawk that is a pretty good idea..

I have an idea that this will be somewhat of a PITA to remove even after priming it.. I'll probably just go profuse on the acetone.

So anyway...

I wanted to try this to both make a gauge pod and see if I wanted to get into fiberglass. I think if I were to do something of less intricate nature, gentle curves I could make it an enjoyable experience.. say.. fender flairs!

Actually, for how cheap it *could* be, of course requiring I get it right the first time, etc. its worth it just to save the money. The only deadend road I can see is actually making the mold to fit my ZX. I am using wheels that stick out about 1.5" from the stock flairs, so I would imagine making 3" flairs would be about on par with finding another car to take them off, and trim, bond, etc. I'm not sure what material to actually do this with but it seems entirely possible to just extend the stock fenders- where they start folding down I would just have them extended further. Aside from flower foam I don't know what people use to simulate what molds are being taken from (my extension) or what material to actually make the molds themselves. I suppose another deadend would be that I'd have to make all four, equally, since I have no way to invert the design of one side to the other. It seems possible in my mind, I'm curious of what you guys think of it. Either way, I have to do something about 2" of rubber sticking out from the sides of my mean machine

-980mak

[Guest Anonymous]

Go for something small to duplicate. I made a buck out of wood (2X4) to simulate the recess for a flip up Jaguer gas cap.Then layed fiberglass around it and used the Pam for the release agent. It popped right off and then I fitted it into the rear passenger fender of Fat Boy. It came out good . Fiberglass is one messy/sticky medium to work with and gets hard fast with little time for errors. It is also expensive. I would start out small to learn the working characteristics of fiberglass. Lone's fiberglass lesson is an excellant beginning point because it will prepare one for a bigger project. I would like to duplicate the Ferarri 250 GTO dash found in the replicas using early Z gauges. I have a fiberglass dash overlay for the Tomahawk but prefer the GTO style for my other projects.

[Jeff]

Get some latex gloves and you can use your fingers to work those intricate areas. Keep some acetone handy to get the resin build up off your gloves while your doing this.

 

If you move on to larger areas you will want to precut the cloth to shape, wet the cloth with resin and the apply the wet cloth to your area. They make a special roller to smooth the cloth and get the air out.

 

Keep playing with it you'll get the hang of it.

[Guest Anonymous]

well so far its going pretty good! Today I spread the f-27 bondo on there and that stuff is much easier to work with, easier than real bondo. the pod is moderately smooth with one layer of glass and the bondo, I'm not sure if I should go with another layer of glass to top it all off or just finish it with some more minor filler for some small gaps, etc. I left a small part for the pod to screw onto a metal mount which it will be screwed onto where the a-pillar cover is screwed on, and one other hole to screw on. Next comes ordering the gauges. I figure it would be somewhat inspiring to have a boost gauge and an afr meter even if my car doesn't have the turbo yet (still using it as a daily driver ). I also agree with the texture finish, although it would be desireable to get something similar to vinyl panel rather than the stone kinda finish sold in the can. I haven't seen anything else sold so I was thinking of spraying it, then wiping it around for some inconsistancy, sanding it down a bit, then painting it to match interior. Result: vinyl effect. I won't be home until later this week so I'll try and finish it by then and get some pics or the finished piece. Till then!

-980mak

[Guest Anonymous]

In regards to the difference in polyester and epoxy resins let me say this,polyester is excellent for any parts that are not exposed to very much stress such as interior pieces and such. However if you are producing parts such as body flares, airdams and so on, then you should use epoxy for these pieces. I fabricated aircraft parts in the AF and I have seen the difference in strength between the 2 types of resins. Most companies that sell fiberglass parts use polyester resins due to the cost and shorter curing time. Also you can use liquid car wak as a seperating agent, but I like using PVA as it can be cleaned off very easy and painted over with excellent results.