Datsun Deron

Hey guys, Well I managed to get EDIS 6 running tonight with Megasquirt II V3.0! Very excited about the whole thing still however I ran into one problem. I checked the timing with the SAW (pin 3) not hooked up and it was around 12 degrees which is close to the 10 degree mark I was supposed to hit. Adjusting the VR Sensor with my bracket I built is a bit of a pain so I just left it as is for now. Turned the car off I then plugged the SAW wire into my relay board "S5" turned the car on put on the timing light and when reving the car up the timing didn't change at all. I have configured Megatune to the EDIS settings that are on the MS website. Also I matched one of the ignition table to be similar with one that I found on hybridz. It seems that for some reason my ECU is not adjusting the timing... For troubleshooting and equipment information: -Im running the Chrysler coil pack with the EDIS 6 Module. -I tested the wire from the relay board to the EDIS 6 Module and that tested fine. -I tested the spark time change with another EDIS 6 Module and that made no difference. -The Relay Cable I ordered online from diyautotune so I'm thinking that there should be a reason that it they have wired the cord for "S5" but I still need to check that. -Originally my ECU was setup to run with direct coil control however I changed the ECU to Match Step 51a http://www.megamanual.com/ms2/V3assemble.htm. -I also dont think that there are any changes that have to be made to switch from coil to EDIS on the relay board? -The only step that I wasnt sure about was on step 52 which may or may not be messing things up. It says: 52. Select the tach input circuit with jumpers: For the VR sensor: Jumper VRIN to TACHSELECT on the bottom side of the PCB (near the DB37, opposite the heat sink.) Jumper TSEL to VROUT (Or VROUTINV if you want the VR input to be inverted) on the bottom side of the PCB, near the center. OR (Do NOT install both sets of jumpers, chose one set or the other!) For the Hall sensor, optical sensor, coil negative terminal or points: Jumper XG1 to XG2 on the bottom side of the PCB, near the 40 pin socket, Jumper OPTOIN to TACHSELECT on the bottom side of the PCB, near the DB37 connector, opposite the heat sink. Jumper TSEL to OPTOOUT on the bottom side of the PCB, near the center. We left this as being the Hall Sensor (the second option) because up above this it lists: Distributor Pickups: general information, GM HEI: use the Hall/Optical circuit, GM DIS: use the Hall/Optical circuit, Ford EDIS: use the Hall/Optical circuit, Ford TFI: use the Hall/Optical circuit, Bosch 0 227 100 124: depends on trigger type, MSD 6A: depends on trigger type, Direct Coil Control: depends on trigger type. Is it possible to confirm which tach input I should have used? Also if I am using the correct one does anyone have any other ideas of what we can try? Thanks in advance, Deron.

Thanks a lot Rolling parts the diagram that I have is very busy. I tried to wire as close to that diagram I had and did ground my power cable. I thought it seemed a little odd to have that while I was looking at the diagram but I hadn't heard any complaints so just went with it. Lucky for me I haven't had a chance to wrap things up yet other wise I would have been trying to figure out why it wouldnt start. I went back to the wrecker as I was in the area last week after I did the post and managed to find the ford capacitor. I must say that I'm a little confused as to how it ties in if that isn't supposed to be grounded. Unless perhaps its only supposed to be grounded if I have the cap? Either way I think I'm going to run no ground for now and if there are problems I can always add it later on.

Perfect thanks for the info guys.

I did some more digging regarding this and found http://forums.hybridz.org/showthread.php?p=1009800 and found z-ya saying: "The cap should go from the coil power to ground. It should have a minimum voltage rating of 20V or greater. The + on teh cap must go towards the +12v coil power. I would have a separate circuit for the module and coil pack. A 10A fuse should be sufficient." From what it sounds like either would work but I'm thinking the 22 uF at 63 Volts would be the better of the two options...

Hey Guys, Im just in the middle of wiring up my edis 6 with the Chrysler coil pack and while wiring pin 8 on the module I noticed that I dont have at 25uF capacitor that goes to ground. I went to my local electronics shop and they laughed at me when I asked for a 25uF cap because apparently it is an "oddball capacitor". I picked up the two closest options at 22 uF at 63 Volts and 33uF at 33 Volts. Will these do the trick or should I go to the wrecking yard and dig for a 25uF Ford one? Below is the wiring diagram im using from the "Correct wiring" in the "MS useful thread links (look here before searching)" link

Well I took it out again today and did a couple passes on a very long hill. I drove it for about 20 minutes doing 1-2 minute runs at 4600 RPM in the 60-70 KPA range. The car still won't shut off. I even pulled over to the side of the road about a minute into my last run. Pulled the top cover off the MS unit (left top plate unscrewed) and felt around inside, nothing is hot to the touch by any means. I watched the duty cycle as well today in megatune (not sure how acurate it is) and it was hitting between 30-40% duty cycle. The car is non turbo and is running stock injectors, I do have an after market fuel pressure regulator and was at 37 PSI when it was on the dyno. Right before the last time it died on the dyno we dialed it up to 40 PSI and the problem still occoured. I might just try doing similar tests on the stim like you said clint78z and see if I get any issues. I fabricated a heat shield today as well to tuck under the fuel rail. Im running an early Z intake with no webbing between the runners, so I'll keep that aside until the next dyno day. Thats a good point z-ya I'll definately add a few more grounds to the unit for extra insurance. As for my PWM settings I have the PWM current limit is set to 18% currently, any lower and when I rev the car it starts to hesitate. Also the Injector open time and PWM time threshold is set to 1.1 as the car dies when the Injector open time is at 0.8.

Naviathan - We did most of the steps that were included in the instructions just incase we were wanting to make any changes in the future. Here's the break down of what I did if it makes any difference. 22. Now you need to make a decision on the first 'optional' component: if you are going to use an IAC stepper motor with MegaSquirt-II, you must install a jumper from the hole marked S12C to the hole marked JS9 (+12C). These are on the bottom side of the board, on the DB9 side of the processor. DO NOT INSTALL THIS JUMPER FOR NON-MegaSquirt-II APPLICATIONS - IT WILL DESTROY THE PROCESSOR!! -I skipped this step since im not using an IAC stepper motor. 50. (50a) To install the Hall/optical input circuit (or points without a coil connection) OR (50b) For triggering off the coil negative terminal/points: (However, you can only trigger off the coil's negative terminal if you are NOT trying to control ignition timing) Then you can add the variable reluctor (VR) circuit as an option which included in step 51. The result of doing step (50a) or (50b) and step 51 means you must jumper between the two options 50 and 51. - For step 50 I installed both curcuits but jumpered for the Hall sensor Circuit. By doing this For the Hall sensor, optical sensor, coil negative terminal or points: Jumper XG1 to XG2 on the bottom side of the PCB, near the 40 pin socket, Jumper OPTOIN to TACHSELECT on the bottom side of the PCB, near the DB37 connector, opposite the heat sink. Jumper TSEL to OPTOOUT on the bottom side of the PCB, near the center. -After step 62 there is another option with for PWM Idle Valve Users. I was not going to be using this option so this was skipped as well. 65. It is choice time again. In this case, you will decide whether to populate the high-current ignition driver circuit. -With this option you need to follow what ever ignition circuit you are using. In my case I am using the direct coil control, so as a result on its link (http://www.megamanual.com/ms2/vb921.htm) it says I need the high current driver. So I followed the instructions starting at (65a) and went up to (65d). Then it says Note: If you are using the high current driver circuit to control an ignition module instead of a coil directly (and don't want to use the processor port directly - i.e., you have not jumpered JS10 to IGN), you likely need to to add a pull-up resistor I skipped that because I’m not going to be using an ignition module, so basically I then jumped to step 66. 69. Once again you have a choice to make about whether to install certain components. In this case, you need to decide if you wish to install the PWM flyback damping circuit as well as the standard flyback circuit. The PWM flyback damping circuit is useful primarily for those running pulse width modulation (PWM) with low-impedance injectors. However, it will work fine if you install it with high impedance injectors. If you prefer to install only the standard flyback circuit, skip ahead to step #70: To install the PWM flyback damping circuit: -Well since the stock Datsun injectors are low impedance the PWM flyback circuit is needed. So I will have to complete step 69 and as it says Even if you have installed the PWM flyback damping circuit, you should install the standard flyback circuit as well (step #70). So step 70 was to be completed also 71. It is choice time yet again. You have to decide whether to install the current limit circuit for driver FET protection. This clamps the current to ~14 Amps, and it is recommended that most people install this. To install the current limit protect circuit -Well no harm should come of this, nothing wrong with limiting the current in my mind and as it says most people install this so it was added as well. Those are all the steps I took along the way. z-ya: Unfortunately I didn't run any logging on the dyno I was so frustrated with what was going on it didn't even cross my mind. I will definately do so next time I'm on the dyno. As for ground wires there is only one, Im running a Relay board so from the Relay board I've got one wire that goes from it to a common ground. The common ground spot has a wire that is attached to my intake manifold also. The load on the dyno was the same as my VE table was showing when I did my street test (40 KPA). But I will try doing the same test going up hill. A buddy brought up the idea last night as well of the injectors possibly getting over heated, I'll check the duty cycle as well on the injectors when I do the test.

Hey guys looking for some possible advice/suggestions here. Heres the story: Well after getting the MS-2 unit (fuel only with relay board) running with very little problems I decided to take it to the local dyno shop to dial in the VE table. Things went pretty smooth in the beginning we were tuning the 40 KPA portion of the VE table and we worked our way up to 4600 RPM. After holding the throttle at 4600 for about 30 seconds, megasquirt just turned off and the engine died. (the laptop also was not talking with the MS unit). We let the dyno rollers come to a stop started the car up and began attemping to tune again. The same thing happened again after 30 seconds. So we checked the timing at idle, it looked great and we checked the vaccuum also good as well. So then we dialed up the fuel pressure to 40 PSI from 37 PSI and again the same thing happened. We started the car once more and I kept an eye on the fuel pressure guage on my pallnet fuel rail while again holding the car at 4600. The car died again and I didn't notice any sharp changes in the guage. I took the car out earlier today to an abandoned road and attempted to copy the same issue. I drove the car at 4600 in 2nd gear held for a full minute and it wouldn't turn off, I then did it again about 30 seconds after with no luck again. Coming back on the highway I did the test again for a full minute but this time in 3rd gear and still no issue. Today is a fair bit cooler then it was on the dyno day. When we were on the dyno it was about 20 degrees celcious where as today it is 10 degress celcious. I'll have to do the test again as well on a bit of a warmer day. The other things to note are that on the heat sink there may be two potential problems that happened before the dyno. 1) R38 used for current limit circuit for driver FET protection began to lift off the heat sink. R38 and R37 both attach with double sided thermal tape. If i pushed on R38 it did still stick it would lift after a couple hours. So I held it down and tacked the edges with some hot glue to keep it down. I did this on both R38 and R37. 2) When I was pushing the board back into the case I accidently pushed on the voltage regulator (U5) which is closest to the DB9 port. As a result it did get shifted slightly and now when I push on it, it does move around. As of right now I have't changed anything I'm thinking I should leave it, try again on a warmer day to copy what happened on the dyno as well. Then if I can get the same thing to happen make my adjustments on the heat sink and see if the problem gets resolved. The only other thing that crosses my mind is if vapor lock could cause the engine to die. As previously mentioned I'm running a palnet fuel rail but im not running any heat shield between the intake and header. Today when driving there was airflow under the hood, however at the dyno with their large fan and my hood up I cant imagine much air getting past. Other then what I've mentioned I'm out of idea's to as what the problem might be. I think for the next dyno session I'll keep the screws off the top cover on the ECU so I can take it off completely and possibly set up a fan to cool it off. I think I'll also be fabricating a heat shield for the fuel rail just incase that may be an issue. If anyone else has any idea's or experience with similar issues please let me know so I can get this unit dialed in finally.

Well Im glad to say I got MS-II up and running, took about an hour of messing with the wiring but I got it done. I wired it according to the diagram below. After it was all wired the car would not start, the fuel pump would prime as normal however when starting the TACH signal in Megatune and on my autometer tach jumped all over the place. And by jumped all over the place I mean like 100-5000 RPM even though the engine was just turning over. We couldn't figure out the source of the problem after checking everything over so we decided to remove the wire from terminal 15 on the Relay board. Well when we did that of course we got no tach signal in Megatune any longer. So we hooked it back up and instead disconnected terminal 11 on the relay board. First turn without that wire and the car started up immediately, I also was getting clean tach readings like normal. What I'm wondering is what is terminal 11 used for? Did it cause me problems because im not using spark control? The only other thing worth mentioning possibly is that I didnt use a sheilded wire for terminal 11 however I did use a sheilded wire for terminal 15. I put a day permit on the car today and drove it around trying to dial in the VE tables a bit and had no problems what so ever. Is there any reason why I should re connect this?

Yea, im not doing spark control yet at this point. Im hoping just to get it running on fuel only to begin with and then move to a spark setup. However I'd be very intested in seeing how I could control the timing using MS if it's not too much of a bother. My vaccum advance has been removed, and the advance has been locked inside the distributor as well.

My car is an 81 280zx, so the wiring scheme is a little different. I do like your idea though Randy 77zt, I think connecting it directly to the coil is by far the simplest idea and that just might be the way to go. So just to confirm would I still need the resistor and go direct to the negative on the coil like the picture illustrated below. Or is there a resistor already built into the wire that isn't showing in the Manual? The book actually mentions that connection "L" on the dizzy that goes to the Negative on the coil should have 11.5 to 12.5 volts. Here's the wiring harness picture as well for my Non-turbo dizzy. If i was going to attempt to follow turbo dizzy picture from Moby's sticky, based on the information on the following troubleshooting page it mentions "Br" to be tested in "start" ignition key position and "L" to be tested in the "on" ignition key positon. So I'm thinking "L" would have to go directly to 15 on the relay board, with a switched 12volt and a pullup resistor on the same wire. (keep in mind L goes to the negative side of the coil). "Br" would be my 12v, but I'm unsure if it would really have to tie into the circuit the way it does currently. Then "LY" and "LW" would be discarded. These appear to be used for the mechical advance which has been removed previously. I then would have my ground grounded of course (which isn't shown). Anyone know if this would work? I suppose the big interest in the 2nd method of the tach signal is to have megasquirt wired so it doesn't rely on the original mess of wiring.

Hey guys, I got my MS-II board all built and tested now im dreaming up how to wire this thing. So far most of it looks pretty straight forward, basicly im going to disconnect the stock 280zx (non turbo) ecu and wire everything with the image below. What has me confused is terminal block 15. Since im non turbo do I need to worry about the dizzy wire. And also can anyone give me some idea of why terminal 15 needs a switched 12 volt. Isn't it already provided on the top right of the Relay Board or are they completely unrelated? I have also read somewhere that the stock 280zx injectors are not polarity specific and that they just need a positive on one side and negative on the other, is this correct? Thanks in advance, Deron,