tim.d
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Posts posted by tim.d
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I've also spent some time on the passenger side inner fender, made a new panel where the battery tray was...which i'll probably end up mounting in the back of the car. Will wait until fuel tank is in and see how much room I've got. ANYWAY, did most of the forming over my knee with a bunch of hammer and dolley work. Also stitch welded the first strut tower, and did a bunch of welding on the new frame rails and fender tie ins:
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Aw shucks, thanks fellas!
Since I left off with the TC buckets, here's where they've progressed to:
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Do you want torque or boost? I was at the same crossroads when I was picking an engine for my car - I had a 1JZ supra and driven plenty of 2J's... with turbos ranging from GT35 400hp cars, to 76mm 700hp cars. Boost is fun, but its really a highway pull type experience. I decided I wanted N/A V8 torque for the Z, since it was lighter and wanted more of a "point and squirt" backroads bomber.
Both are good choices, but I think you need to decide about how you want the car to drive, as the two engines will give two different experiences.
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Oh, and TC buckets went back in. They'll be tied into the frame rails longitudinally later on.
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Making the upper radiator support removable. I HATE the wiggle of getting an engine and transmission out of an engine bay. Should have used some wider metal so I wouln't have to worry about the gap at the front but I'll address that later. Trimmed and ground tabs, it's reasonably flush now.
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Then I made a new radiator lower support bracket to accommodate the larger Howe radiator I'll be using, and strengthen the area for the next step...
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I drilled two sets of cross member and sway bar mounts, the second set 1" further forward from stock... Should I ever decide to push for high caster angles - not exactly sure why i'd do that, I think I read it on blueovalz's build and said to myself "well gee Tim, since you're here... drill the extra holes." All the various pieces started going back together.
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At which point I realized I fucked up and cut the main length too short, the riser to the engine bay rails would protrude 1.5 inches into the cabin, hitting the throttle pedal. So, had to extend it out. Added in the extension at a point on the length where I thought it would see the least stress - around the seat mounts which I was planning on redoing out of tube too.
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And then I went AH **** IT at which point the car went from "get back driving and not immediately die" to "time to get not shitty at fabrication and build a car to a level you haven't done before." I've done a dozen engine swaps, rewires, fuel systems... but never this much metal work. Made a jig to locate TC buckets and made the main floor rails out of 2x3 .125 IIRC. Lots of time spent getting things level in an unlevel garage, measuring, making sure things are as square as possible. Lots of mocking up, looking at it for a few weeks, a couple tack welds, adjust...look...think...undo...redo..think...drink beer... From the time I started cutting the rotten frame rails out to the time they were fully welded in was a bit over a year.
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Floor boards before I wised up and cut everything out. Even bought Bad Dog frame rail reinforcements...
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At first, began tearing it down. Thought I could redo the floors, and patch the necessary areas of rust in the engine bay and frame rails.
Eh... not so much.
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Well I think I'm finally ready to make a build thread for this car. My original intention had been to really document the snot out of this car and build, and compile it into an extremely thorough and detailed log... which I'd still like to do but meh. I'm tired. We'll see where this goes.
A little background on me: been a car nut my whole life, originally went to school for engineering before dropping out and changing directions when I stubbornly finally admitted engineering wasn't for me. But during that time I was lucky to get exposed to some really neat stuff, including working at a race shop on Ferrari Challenge and Star Mazda cars, as well as building street cars when not working on the race cars. A few years after that I got into Supras and had a built Mk3 with a 1JZ, but eventually got rid of that. Had always been into Zs, but really got into them after going to a Canby, OR Datsun meet back in 2010 with my best friend. Well he got the bug too, we bought his car and started wrenching on that (it's getting a S52...54...shit he'll call me a dumbass for forgetting my BMW engines). Maybe one day he'll make a build thread for that...hahahhahahahhaa. Anyways, Got married, moved a few times, and finally picked up my Z in 2015. Now I've got a toddler and holy moly they take up a lot of energy...
The car is a '72 240z I found up in Virginia, right before the Z market got really hot, where it is today. Originally I wanted something I could mechanically restore and drive for a while, and then at some point later on break down and do a full restomod/build on. Well, that didn't happen. The car I got came with a L28ET, 4spd from a 280, and a CLSD R200, but was all taken apart. The owner's grandfather bought the car new. It then was passed onto his father and when he died, it left the family for a few years until his son found it and bought it back. He drove it for a few years until he was diagnosed with cancer - it then sat in his garage waiting a restoration for 3 years, untouched, until I got it. Pictures were hard to get as it sat in a small one car concrete shed. Did my best for a thorough inspection to know exactly what I was getting myself into, but Zs were already becoming harder and harder to find on the east coast, and this one already had some goodies.
Well, once I dug into the car and started repairing rusted panels, found out that the engine bay frame rails were shot. Royally rusted pieces of rust. At that point the car went from "get running again" to "just build it now."
End goal of car: V8 torque immediacy, in a nimble car. Want a "low speed" point and squirt dart. Got tired of the turbo highway pull machines, want something for bombing NC's back roads. So, body stiffness and suspension first, power second. Input feedback is very important.
So, the "quick" rundown of plans for the car:
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Body
- Custom full-length frame rails
- custom floor pans
- rust repair throughout body
- Removable upper radiator support
- S&W kit or locally bent main hoop roll bar with frame rail integration
- ZG Flares, BRE spoiler, "Type 1" spoiler
- Fiberglass hood and fenders
- Stitch welding
- Lots of reinforcement
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Interior
- New seats and custom mounts
- Speedhut gauges
- Nardi Wheel
- Complete rewire
- Sound deadening
- Dash restoration
- Skillard goodies
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Engine
- Stock Roller cam SBF 302 5.0
- 85 - last year of the carb'd engines
- Plans to go stroker 347 w/heads once car is road worthy
- Custom fuel system - F body camaro tank, AN lines from carb to tank
- 2.5 exhaust with Xpipe
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Trans & Rear end
- Rebuilt T5 with MGW shifter
- New master & slave cylinders
- 3.90 CLSD with new cluches from Gary
- Rebuilt Half Shafts
- Z31 CV conversion?.. Looking like yes.
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Suspension
- Poly bushings
- BC 'DR' digressive coil overs
- Raised FCA mounts
- Bracing everywhere
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Brakes
- S12W fronts
- 82/83 280ZX "Crab" Calipers and rotors
- Wilwood master & PV
- AN line conversion
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Wheels & Tires
- Rota RKR, 17x8.5, 17x9.5
- 245/45/17, 275/40/17 tires
- Whole bunch of other crap
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Where it sits today:
Majority of major fabrication is done. Going to pick up transmission and gas tank from the family barn to start work on mounts. I lurk the HBZ forums a few times a day, but the Z has gotten most of it's updates on instagram: https://www.instagram.com/tdphoto240z/ Hopefully now that I've taken the first build-thread-step I can keep this going.
Oh, and there's also some photos on an imgur account for those who want to browse: https://dugants.imgur.com/ Really wish Google Photos had better forum integration...
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Body
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Dang!!! It's particularly bittersweet that the Z aftermarket is so strong right now when we're losing some of the extremely influential old guard...
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Well this topic has got me doing some more research since I last looked into a tig, and my opinion has changed...
Factors:
- Quality/Inclusion of Foot Pedal
- Regulator or Flow Meter?
- Pulse Settings (Didn't think I'd care too much for this, but I tried it on a buddy's welder last week and its great)
- Starting Amps
Between these Models:
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AHP AlphaTig 200x ($680-800, +200 = $1k)
- Pros: Low Initial Cost, pedal interchangeability, pulse & ac settings. All of your settings are easy to see at a glance.
- cons: realistically need to replace pedal and flow meter... so tack on another 200 to price. "More difficult" to store settings - need to record rotary position instead of digital readout. Not a big deal but people do seem to complain. Most questionable build quality. Price on amazon seems to fluctuate. Starting Amps high (10-20 IIRC)
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Eastwood Tig200 (680+160=$840)
- Pros: Low initial cost, decently well built, Eastwood has good support.
- Cons: Garbage foot pedal, no pulse settings. Definitely pretty barebones. Eastwood seems to have proprietary connectors which makes parts interchangeability questionable. Also sold as the Longevity 200SX.
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Eastwood Tig200 Digital (900+40=$940)
- Pros: Loads of settings, bendyhead torch, eastwood quality, can save settings. A/C Tig Mix - includes a DC pulse to stabilize arc (!)
- Cons: Settings menu difficult to use quickly, steeper learning curve on setting up machine, again parts interchangeability is questionable, foot pedal looks unique to this product. Literature says it comes with a flow meter, but then parts list calls it a regulator. Product advertisements make it look like a regulator, probably need to replace. No specifications on starting amps, 220v ONLY
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Everlast 185DV (900+160 = $1060)
- Pros: Everlast seems to have stepped up their game with their Tigs. My previous comment was in reference to a multi-machine that I had experience with years ago, but its hard to find many negative things about their current machines. Machine settings are easiest to identify, included accessories will be the nicest and are interchangeable with other manufacturers. 5amp DC start (!), will have the cleanest arc.
- Cons: No foot pedal included, lower max amperage than others.
- Edit: Just found this amazon listing for the 185DV + Pedal for $950
Here's how my thinking has changed:
For me, a tig welder is more than just welding aluminum, it's also working on your welding skills and quality/precision of the weld. At the point I'm spending $800, I don't want to cut myself 10-20% short and regret something. For just welding aluminum without other concern yeah I think I'd go with the AlphaTig. But for stepping up my welding game, I think I'd rather spend that little bit extra and get a better quality arc. In the end, you're spending roughly the same amount on all of them, and the 5amp DC start of the Everlast means less blow through of thinner (ahem Datsun) metal. If the Eastwood was dual voltage, I think that would tie with the Everlast and put up with the settings menu, but I've only got one 240v outlet in my garage and I don't want to be fighting for machine space.
So as of right now, I'm voting for the Everlast 185DV.
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On 9/26/2017 at 11:48 PM, trackzpeed said:
One of the great Z vendors is putting the finishing touches on a complete 8.8 kit that will be super trick..... But I can let his cat out of the bag just yet. Keep your eyes and ears open......
GASP WEEEEEEEEEEE
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Correct, 85+ were rollers. Early EFI setups were notorious for having reliability issues, so it's a good thing he's using a later engine on that front.
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8 hours ago, ISPKI said:
Hey guys, been a loooong time since I was last on here. I am getting back into my engine swap project for my 77 280z. I sold the engine out of the z this year and picked up pieces for the swap. I am shooting for the following setup
302 EFI, W/C T5, unsure about rear differential
I have a W/C T5 already but it has no bellhousing, supposedly low miles
I have an 86 mustang GT 302 but I just obtained a free, running and driving 2001 Mercury Mountaineer with a 302 that I am told is the best factory 302 I can get, so I will likely be using that for the donor
I do not have a rear differential for the swap, that seems to be the only other BIG item that I am missing.
I have the solidwork prints from the Laine swap website and will likely be using those to fabricate my mounts.
I will be updating with pictures soon. Is there anything else I will need for the swap that I cannot pull from the Mountaineer? I was hoping I could use it's ECU and electrical system in the Z.
I would like to be producing over 200hp/325ft/lbs at the wheels with this setup. I was told that the cam in a mountaineer 302 is actually a truck cam and I could gain a decent HP boost (at the cost of a little torque) by swapping the cam out of my mustang GT 302. Does anyone have any experience with this?
Welcome Back! I'm in the process of a similar swap, and was all set on the Mountaineer/Explorer 302, but out of pure circumstance I'm using a carb'd HO out of an 85 mustang...bought the car wrecked, cleaned up the interior, got a free engine and transmission and made 3 grand on the whole thing!
But yes, to answer your questions....
-I've done a bunch of abuse to a bunch of different T5s in mustangs, and unless you're being actively stupid they're pretty reliable. And if they do go, parts and upgrades are plentiful.
-I haven't looked at the later EFI pinouts in a long while since I have a carb'd engine, but IIRC it is integrated to the transmission controller and an immobilizer , so there may be some hiccups on those fronts. Megasquirt makes a fairly drop in stand-alone with lots of available maps if you run into too many issues.
-the later model 302s are the ones to get. Distributorless, decent head and intake design, and strong power numbers that a cam swap will shift things around for a more "sporty" powerband.
Good to see more SBF cars on the board!
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I've heard mixed reviews on Everlast products, some guys swear by them for non-production use, but everyonce in a while some say that they're unreliable - don't know what circumstances they were really using the machines under. I've got an Eastwood Mig that I've been super impressed with (except for a cheap chinesium gas solenoid), and their new digital 200 looks promising, though not sure if I'd ever use the added features it has. If it were my money, and there weren't any decent used blues or reds on craigslist, I'd go for the eastwood and upgrades LLave suggested.
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Great to see you on the forum, love the YT vids!
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Sounds like you already know what to do.
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I'm kind of upset you're painting it, but more glad it's still alive!
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I think you're going to have a really hard time balancing the brake system with equal front:rear piston area.
Edit: nevermind misunderstood Op
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I prefer imgur, because it gives you BB code for each image and is more specifically made for forum posting
Edit: Though now that I test it again, not working. So nevermind, imgur it is for me.
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Flickr, google drive, imgur, lots of other options out there
Tim's 302Z
in S30 Series - 240z, 260z, 280z
Posted
Thanks for the input.. I've been wondering if the thick frame rails would be enough, but after hearing your experience I'm glad I'm planning on additional triangulation.
http://s160.photobucket.com/user/psanders240/library/BSR-260Z-IMSA?sort=3&hotlinkfix=1513342061687&page=1
This car, right? Definitely taking inspiration from him on some fronts, but this is a street car..gotta keep myself from going totally overboard with it. Finding some compromise on interior space has been something I've been mulling over for a while - Mostly around the firewall and how to reasonably but effectively connect to the rear of the car without a full cage. Suggestions welcome
Here's my photodump of other people's chassis stiffening: https://imgur.com/a/R27sh