Guest Jeff Rimmer Posted October 24, 2001 Share Posted October 24, 2001 Hello all! I've been a mere reader for the past while, sorting things through for my buildup of my 77 280Z. I've already scraped initial purchase of a block and plans for a 383 in hopes of something with higher RPM's and would like to focus on HP rather than a Torque monster (nothing wrong with torque mosnters, just want something to beat on my import pals, FEARCLY!. I was wondering though, if anyone could suggest either books or urls with good reference to the 327 buildup. I've been into the import scene for years, and lack knowledge of what parts are transferable to what, and what will create good solid HP and relatively high RPM's when compared to what the 383 would have provided. I've been told that with the 327 block, either swapping heads or a crank can give significant HP, into the 400 hp range, and be quite streetable. And I do believe that somone here is running a 327, with mere upgrades and achieving 400+ high reving horsepower, with the edelbrock fuel injection system. I initially jumped into the 383 project blindly, and realize that, as before with my import projects, I must do the proper research yet again! Thanks for the help guys, and yes I have cruised through most of the posts for answers, just looking for more. 327 seems to be what I am looking for. Thanks again, Jeff R. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pparaska Posted October 24, 2001 Share Posted October 24, 2001 Jeff, That's Mike kZ's 327 you're thinking of. If you're thinking that short stroke might bring some advantages, then maybe consider the 353 built with the 400 block and LJ327 crank. Same short stroke as the 327, but more cubes to boot: http://www.martelbros.com/afr/Articles/A3-P1.htm As far as books, I recommend Bill Jenkins book on racing the SBC, as well as Vizard's and Lingenfelter's book. I don't have the titles handy, but search amazon.com and they'll come up easily. Cheers, Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted October 24, 2001 Share Posted October 24, 2001 Something to bear in mind when contemplating a high rpm engine. You still have to shift it. High engine rpm means high transmission gear speeds as well. Shifting most manual transmissions becomes commensurately more difficult to do accurately and reliably the higher the shift point goes. The only tranys I know of that are designed to take really high RPM shifts are Lenco or Jerico. Both are big bucks. Synchros have a design limited capacity to match the two dissimilar gear speeds of any particular shift you attempt to make. The faster the gear is spining the greater amount of centrifugal force must be overcome to shift the trans. This duty falls directly on the synchros tapered cone shoulders. I recommend a GOOD rev limiter device if you plan on high speed shifting on a routine basis. We all miss a shift every once and while. Automatics as well have difficulties shifting above certain rpm speeds. I do not understand the nuances of why this is so, but I have found that shifting my 700 R4 at any RPM above 6000 caused weird shift delays between gears. I have to believe that some auto trany guru could tune this problem out, but who? where? and how much will it cost to achieve this? I simply opted to build greater HP/torgue at lower (under 6200 RPM) and eliminate the problem all together. You might also consider doing some homework regarding CFM requirements for high RPM engines. You would be surprised at how fast the needed CFM rates climb as you increase RPM past 6000. The "Mortec" site has a good discussion of how to determine this. Lastly, valve springs for a SBC which will consistently take high RPM have two drawbacks. 1. They are expensive. 2. Few of them are able to combine high open pressures with low installed height pressures. The result is premature camshaft wear. Cams which will rev above 6000 RPM (and still be building HP) have to have by definition intake durations of 245 at .050 and higher. Usable torque comes in way up in the rev range, which in street driven applications are simply not seen often enough IMO to justify them. Lastly, large duration cams bleed off a bunch of low end compression. To compensate for this you will need serious static compression ratios. Somewhere in the 12.5 -1 range. Fuel really becomes a limiting factor in this discussion and shouldn't be overlooked. The NASCAR guys get away with it because they are running 17-1 and better on fuel we can only dream about. Just food for thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike kZ Posted October 24, 2001 Share Posted October 24, 2001 Originally posted by Jeff Rimmer: I've been told that with the 327 block, either swapping heads or a crank can give significant HP, into the 400 hp range, and be quite streetable. And I do believe that somone here is running a 327, with mere upgrades and achieving 400+ high reving horsepower, with the edelbrock fuel injection system. Hi Jeff, I think your thinking of my engine.I think what's giving me the most power, and torque are the Twist Flow G2 heads, these are the ones with the canted valves, sorta like a BB Chevy. These need special length pushrods.Also the Pro Flo EFI. For the rest of the engine, it has the stock forged crank, 0.30 over hypereutectic pistons, Comp 270 cam (specs are at home), Comp roller tip rockers, the engine is balanced also., nothing real special, but the combo works! On the engine dyno it made 435hp, 493tq! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jeff Rimmer Posted October 24, 2001 Share Posted October 24, 2001 What static compression are you running with that engine combo? Your setup sounds amazing! Might I enquire as to how much you guestimate you invested in such a setup? I'm figuring I could do something similar minus the Edelbrock fuel system such as yours for about 3large. Though I must do the research first, how do you enjoy your setup? Sounds like a snappy little engine! JR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted October 25, 2001 Share Posted October 25, 2001 I now have slightly higher goals after seeing the numbers you put up! I hope my long rod(6.125") 327 performs almost to those levels. 425hp+ and 350-375ft.lbs. are the goal now! That should get me into the low, low 12's right? T-5 and r-200 w/3.54's. Am I crazy? Davy doesn't think so but how safe is it to trust that maniac(J/K!)!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fl327 Posted October 25, 2001 Share Posted October 25, 2001 man you guyz have some evil 327's and plans for much more, yyall is nuts. i was actually going to stick a tpi manifold on top of mines, and supercharge it, but im not sure, still have some suspension and body work to do before all of that. what do you think the power would be like if i went performerRPM manifold 700 cfm holley msd 6al box vette 350hp cam headers(yes im running rams horns) 1.5 roller rockers on the 202 camel hump heads stock rods, flat top pistons, stock 10:1 cr 2.5 y pipe into 3inch single(only way i can go with my slammed ass car and the "H" subframe going in) ?????? and how much if i just plop the tried and true weiand BLOWGUN 6-71 on top with the motor as is??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted October 25, 2001 Share Posted October 25, 2001 The only thing I would do is use a new cam with new ramps and current technology. The 375hp range should be obtainable with the old iron heads. The blower would not like the compression. For a street car run 8:5.1 to 9.0 and hit it with a couple of extra pounds of boost. It should be responsive off boost and really lively on boost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pparaska Posted October 25, 2001 Share Posted October 25, 2001 Agreed on the cam. In high school I had a 70 Camaro I built a 10:1 327 for and used the old 327/350 cam. Really dumb move. The car had a Turbo 400 trnas with stock converter and 3.08:1 rear! It was like a lame 230ci 6 cylinder until about 30 mph in first, then took off like shot out of a cannon. I'd say stay away from the old school Chevy cams. The new stuff gives more hp and low end torque with better streetability and mileage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike kZ Posted October 25, 2001 Share Posted October 25, 2001 quote: Originally posted by Jeff Rimmer: What static compression are you running with that engine combo? Your setup sounds amazing! Might I enquire as to how much you guestimate you invested in such a setup? I'm figuring I could do something similar minus the Edelbrock fuel system such as yours for about 3large. Though I must do the research first, how do you enjoy your setup? Sounds like a snappy little engine! JR I'm running 10:1 compression. The cost, mmm...I think the cost came in around $5000.I don't think you will get the same hp and tq without the fuel injection. I'm pretty sure that's what did it! Even my engine builder buddy couldn't believe the numbers from this engine, he kept it in his dyno computer to show others! and yes the responce of this engine is unreal!! It made my car take off like a bullet! By the way the cam specs are as follows: Magnum Comp Cam 270H-10 Hyd - , gross valve lift .470 int .470 ex 270 advertised duration 224 duration @ .050 int, ex 110 lobe separation [ October 25, 2001: Message edited by: Mike kZ ] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpeedRacer Posted October 26, 2001 Share Posted October 26, 2001 Great engine that SBC 327. I've got one in my car that started out as a 365HP version out of a '65 Vette. .030" over w/ forged flat tops, solid lifter Comp cam (their version of the 365 HP Duntov) Trickflow 23 degree aluminum heads @ 10.5:1 compression, 1.52 roller rockers, 3 2bbl. Rochesters, MSD Ign., block hugger headers and bolted up to a T-5/3.70:1 R200 LSD driveline. Never had it on a dyno so I don't know the true horsepower but I would think it would have to be North of 350. I wanted solid lifters and a high revving engine because of my car (OK - I know it's still missing 4 cylinders)!!! Redline is at 7,000 and it easily pulls all the way up to it. Never had a problem shifting it with the T-5. BTW, Z cars are so light that the reduction in torque is only envident in the fact that the tires don't spin as long as you guys with your 383's, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavyZ Posted October 26, 2001 Share Posted October 26, 2001 I love those Comp Cams stuff--especially their Xtreme energy cams. I am dreaming about one of those right now... BTW, Jason, you are a nut. Davy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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