new2Zs Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 Hey, So I've been starting with building up my junkyard 2jz-ge while searching for a suitable shell. I've been researching and it seems that swapping the stock head gasket to a 2mm think gasket is enough to get the compression down to 8.5 to 1. A lot cheaper than pulling the pistons and getting low comp pistons. My question is have any of you guys done this? I'm looking to get 600 max hp out of this motor, so i want to make sure it can handle the boost (probably 18-20psi). Any input would be appreciated, I tried the search function but I didn't find anything. cheers, brian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dexter72 Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 You should be able to find out the info by just doing an internet search or look up the supra forums and have at it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avernier Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 Theres no need to go any thicker than a stock gte gasket. On my 1.5jz, i run around 10.5:1 compression and have zero issues at 18psi and pump gas. Vvti ge blocks are the weakest, and also the highest compression, and many msny people have run 14-17 psi with 60 trims on a 100% bone stock motor and 93 octane. The extra compression helps off boost torque and spools the turbo faster. Results in an engine with great response. The combustion chamber shape and design helps combat some of the predet issues earlier engines are prone to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ask92 Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 If you are looking for anything over 450hp do yourself and favor and just go GTE. By the time you get a NA and build it to handle 500hp you will have spent almost enough to just get a GTE in the first place. While yes high compression will make for a quicker responding engine, the engine will not last like an OEM GTE will unless you dump some serious money into internals and tuning. I have seen countless NA-T builds and the only ones that last and make decent power cost more than if you were to just go GTE from the start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
new2Zs Posted November 14, 2013 Author Share Posted November 14, 2013 Thanks for the info. I want to build this for 450hp, but want to make sure it's good for 600hp just in case I get greedy and want to turn it up. I'm gonna have 8k in this car so I'm going to build up the na-t first and if it blows ill upgrade, but for now I'd rather spend the money on other parts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avernier Posted November 15, 2013 Share Posted November 15, 2013 Na2j nonvvti will take 500-600 all day bone stock with no complaint with zero issues. Its been done thousands of times. The key is in the tuning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
new2Zs Posted November 15, 2013 Author Share Posted November 15, 2013 Thanks, I went to wyotech and got to play around on the dyno a bit. I know first hand the benefits of tuning, I'm just dreading the bill. Around here a good speed shop is not anywhere close to cheap. I'm laying the ground work for that to be next years xmas present!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ask92 Posted November 15, 2013 Share Posted November 15, 2013 Na2j nonvvti will take 500-600 all day bone stock with no complaint with zero issues. Its been done thousands of times. The key is in the tuning. Bone stock with ARP headstuds and a TT HG.... Generally NA-T setups are done instead of GTEs for no other reason than price. There are exceptions to this of course such as when you get up into the 4 digits with forged internals people will use GE blocks instead of GTEs because the GTEs oil squirters become obsolete due to forged pistons not having oil galleys. Regardless, most NA-T builds are done on a tight budget so corners are cut which ultimately result in failure. OP I am not sure how long you want the engine to last, or how you plan to drive it, but if you plan to keep it a long time and beat the hell out of it I would spend the extra few months of saving and just get a GTE right off the bat and not worry about opening it up or tuning or any of that BS. That being said I rode in a 600whp NA-T setup all around Vegas last week while attending SEMA and it was a blast due to the tune. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Merrill Posted November 16, 2013 Share Posted November 16, 2013 2JZ GTE Aristo engine are dirt cheap. Its whats going in mine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
72-s30 Posted November 17, 2013 Share Posted November 17, 2013 Honestly there is no point in building a GE engine unless money is no object, but even then there is no logic. Trust me once you get into building any swap you WILL be spending more than anticipated. So buying a GTE from the beginning is just a smarter choice, it is much more stout and can take a beating vs. the GE. There is a guy on my local forum who brings in GTE swaps; complete engine w/turbo, tranny, uncut harness and ecu for $3500 so say you want to put on a nice PTE 6266 or something there is another $750. Versus trying to build a GE with forged pistons, rods, new manifolds, ecu (N/A one wont work), charge pipes, fluids, mounts, wiring, turbo, waste gate, BOV and everything else you will easily spend more than starting with a GTE, if you don't cut corners. But if you start with a GE and do it cheaper by cutting corners it will come back to bite you.. I know this for a fact! The one corner I cut on my build was building my own engine harness and I cooked my ecu because of 1 wire being in the wrong place. So in my opinion, just get the GTE, it makes no sense to do things twice because you took the cheaper route, my little mistake cost me $2000.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avernier Posted November 17, 2013 Share Posted November 17, 2013 Has anyone in this thread other than me built an na-t 2jz? Anyone other than me had a jz swapped z car? Alot of people posting here are building 1000hp blocks to run 350whp. To me that seems pointless. Non vvti ge's have forged internals factory btw, so aside from no oil squirters and higher compression, they're nearly as capable as gte's. it seems like a bunch of people with zero experience chiming in on a subject they arent at all familiar with. Im on my 4th jz build, and have been working with them exclusively for the past 5 years. Some of the things said in this forum are mindblowing. Where do you guys get your info? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dexter72 Posted November 17, 2013 Share Posted November 17, 2013 Avernier, I have been reading threads from Supra forums for a few years now, You are correct. To me unless your tune is horrible running 500 hp with an Na-Turbo'd 2jz is very doable. My only issues have been finding the manifolds that will work with the engine. Modifying the na intake manifold is an option also.I will have to go over the saved threads i have from those forums again. I thought i read you can make the 2JTurbo manifold work on an na engine. Does anyone really need 600hp or more, on a street driven car??? Can that power be put to the ground???. I mean to me you would have a 10 or 11 second 1/4 mile street car. Win Win Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
new2Zs Posted November 18, 2013 Author Share Posted November 18, 2013 Thanks for everyones opinion. From what I have read, the stock bottom end of the NA engines are pretty decent. Mine is out of a gs300 pre vvti, so I think it should last. I'll be beating the piss out of it at 400-450hp normally, with occasionally bumping it to 600. Yea 600 might be a little excessive, but when you are in 3rd on the freeway and you want to blow by someone, 600hp helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ask92 Posted November 18, 2013 Share Posted November 18, 2013 Has anyone in this thread other than me built an na-t 2jz? Anyone other than me had a jz swapped z car? Alot of people posting here are building 1000hp blocks to run 350whp. To me that seems pointless. Non vvti ge's have forged internals factory btw, so aside from no oil squirters and higher compression, they're nearly as capable as gte's. it seems like a bunch of people with zero experience chiming in on a subject they arent at all familiar with. Im on my 4th jz build, and have been working with them exclusively for the past 5 years. Some of the things said in this forum are mindblowing. Where do you guys get your info? May I ask why you are on your 4th JZ build if the GE is so capable? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avernier Posted November 18, 2013 Share Posted November 18, 2013 Is300 na-t, cressida 1jz, 280z 1jz, different 280z 1.5jz. All sold except the 1.5jz build. May i ask why you feel the need to chime in on jz threads when you're building a 7m? Anyone with experience knows better than that. The sad thing is that is not an insult to you, your work is well thought out, and well executed. Im about to attempt pie cuts tonight and i hope they look 1/10th as good as yours. But all of your effort is wasted on that engine. It WILL blow the headgasket, and you will fix it, and then it will rod knock. Theres never been a 7m that didnt. Even the factory race team in jgtc had these issues. Thats why the jz was developed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ask92 Posted November 18, 2013 Share Posted November 18, 2013 Is300 na-t, cressida 1jz, 280z 1jz, different 280z 1.5jz. All sold except the 1.5jz build. May i ask why you feel the need to chime in on jz threads when you're building a 7m? Anyone with experience knows better than that. The sad thing is that is not an insult to you, your work is well thought out, and well executed. Im about to attempt pie cuts tonight and i hope they look 1/10th as good as yours. But all of your effort is wasted on that engine. It WILL blow the headgasket, and you will fix it, and then it will rod knock. Theres never been a 7m that didnt. Even the factory race team in jgtc had these issues. Thats why the jz was developed. You obviously have me confused with someone else as I am not and will not be building a 7m. They are torquey engines that CAN be made reliable if done right, but by the time you spend all that money it would just be cheaper to go 2jzgte. Sound familiar? I have owned 3 supras, and a Sc300 so I know my way around the jz and 7m engines just a bit. I see that you are condemning anyone that does not have a NA-T z, yet you have never owned or worked on a GTE? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avernier Posted November 19, 2013 Share Posted November 19, 2013 Firstly, yes i did confuse you. I apologize. Secondly, i've owned 2 1jzgte. Im not condemning anyone who has a 2jzgte, im frowning upon anyone who tells someone who wants <550whp that a gte is needed, or more affordable. It isnt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badjuju Posted November 27, 2013 Share Posted November 27, 2013 I'm planning on buying the thickest cometic gasket I can without jumping from $184 to $220 or whatever it is. Unless you're talking about making dookiepower, you don't need to worry about lowering your CR. the 7m and jz series have enough capability for high end abuse that even if you aim to just barely twist your s30 in half, you still have moderate "oops" space with your motor in terms of compression, etc. Also, stop fighting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Merrill Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Aristo 2JZ GTE's complete with harness and ecu's can be found for $1500 or less. You need a 1JZ pan or one of the non turbo pans and tap it for the return. Easy, simple, cheap, and you get a 2J Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avernier Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Or a mkiv gte pan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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