jaime240z Posted July 9, 2003 Share Posted July 9, 2003 Ok I haven't driven my 240 in a few months. It has a near new ( 6 mos) Optima red top battery. I went out to try to start it today and all I got was clicking from the starter solenoid..? OK I figured the battery was dead. I checked it and it was a LITTLE low ( 10volts or so ) but not dead. So I set it on the charger and let it simmer.. hours later voltage is OK. I checked all the circuits and everything is getting a good 13 volts. I go to start it and..... nothing! The starter isn't even clicking any more. I do hear a new clicking sound from inside the car. I traced it down to a relay of some sort near the pass. side kick panel. It looks like an original piece with a multi wire harness plug. Does anyone what this piece is? It's definitley clicking when I try to turn the motor and I'm thinking this is what is giving me grief! I looked in my Chilton's manual as well as VB and MSA catalogs to see if I could ID this part. Has anyone esle had problems with this piece? I'm trying to figure out how to test it but I'm not an elect. wizard so I'm thinking I should just replace it.....if I even knew what it is. I think I'm going to be dumpster diving at the local yards real soon. Any help would be great! Thanks in advance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaime240z Posted July 9, 2003 Author Share Posted July 9, 2003 OK I think I figured out what part that is. Accesory relay is what I'm thinking. However I still have the problem. 13v and no start. Only clicking from the acc relay. I don't remember it doing that before I parked it, but then again there was engine noise involved back then so who knows? BTW. Before I parked it I had the starter and soleniod tested at 2 different parts stores and they both said the parts were good. I was having a similar problem at the time that I now think is related to this. However when I had the parts tested I learned that I needed a new battery, which is where the Optima comes into play. The new battery seemed to fix the problem 6 months ago but the problem has popped up again and this time I'm stumped. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cbrunberg Posted July 10, 2003 Share Posted July 10, 2003 Wow! Talk about deja vu. I was having the same trouble. My new (7mos) battery was always going low. I'd jump start, drive someware and be stuck. I thought bad starter or solenoid. The dreaded chevy heat problem. I read posts about using a ford relay (solenoid) which isn't a bad idea. I tried a 24 hr charge on my battery and same results...it starts great once! The battery was only showing 10.5 volts while the alt was showing 12volts while running. I disconnected the battery turned on the lights and it still ran well. I think this means the alt is ok. I've read it's supposed to read about 14 volts but hey...I'll keep you posted if I learn more. As for the relay you hear click. My car, a 73 240 A/T has a couple of relays on the wiring diagram plus a seat belt switch,neutral safety switch, some kind of seat pressure switch...AAAAHHHHHHUUUGGGGG. I bypasted all of that crap and ran a new circuit for the starter. I also bought a book from amazon.com called "Hot Rod Wiring" it got here today. Maybe I'll learn something. Hopefully I can use this book to rewire this car right. A cool relay board like Tim did. Look for his post on wiring the picture is inspiring. http://www.centechwiring.com This is a cool site with great products and good tech help. They will make whatever you want in a harness. Tell em what you got and they make it for you. All soldered connections with heat shrink and factory plugs.... Thank you for letting me vent ....I'm ok now.... Carl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
innerware Posted July 10, 2003 Share Posted July 10, 2003 You've most likely tried this but I had the same problem before. It turned out to be my ground to my battery. It was on tight and all, looked good but must have been corroded or something. Anyway when the problem happened you could hit the negative cable with a wrench or something or loosen it and jiggle and reconnect. It would solve my problem. I later replaced the connectors with new ones and have had no problem since. I had the same click too......I think. Anyway good luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VRJoe Posted July 10, 2003 Share Posted July 10, 2003 Check all the battery connections. Check both power to starter and ground. Try cleaning the terminals also. - Joe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaime240z Posted July 10, 2003 Author Share Posted July 10, 2003 Yup, I did that. Actually I bought new batt. cables with the battery and cleaned the connections at that time too. I also double checked the cables/connections/ and grounds today but that didn't change anything. One thing did happen though. It happened a couple of hours after checking that stuff so I don't think the cables etc was the problem. The engine tried to turn over once. But it was brief and it didn't last the whole time I had the key in the start position...And it never did it again all. night. Battery is holding 12v. cables and connections seem to be good. As far as I know the starter solenoid is good. Checked the fusible links just for kicks...and nothing...? Does anyone know more about this acc relay? I have a hunch that's what it might be. I wasn't able to find one in the MSA or VB catalogs so I'm going to try to find a used one . Or maybe I'll call Nissan tomorrow. I'd hate to spend big $$ on a rare part and not need it though.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cbrunberg Posted July 10, 2003 Share Posted July 10, 2003 HI ME AGAIN Jaime240 what year and model is your car? Manual or automatic? What color are the wires? I have the wiring diagrams. Maybe I can help you figure out what that relay is. I can scan the right page for you. THIS TOPIC GETS ME SO WOUND UP. These cars have so many relays. That book I just got on Hot Rod Wiring is a 150 page add for the Painless Wiring Co. Not a bad company but I was hoping for a how to do it yourself book. Also I went out and started my car 3 times just to be sure things were cool. I drove to Autozone for a top hose for my Nissan P/U and wouldn't you know it "click" several times. I bought a new tester, an idiot one with led lights. It tests the battery and the alt. It said the battery was good at 12v. The guy in the store came out with a portable booster and it didn't help when connected to the battery, but did help when the ground was connected to the block. Go figure. New battery. new cables. I put the tester on the alt after we got it started, guess what no good. Also a new part. I'm going to exchange it tommarrow. Good luck, Carl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaime240z Posted July 10, 2003 Author Share Posted July 10, 2003 Carl, that problem you had sounds too familiar. I gat all those same new parts too with similar results. I found that relay in my chilton's manual. It's labeled as the accessory relay located near the pass kick panel (inside). It has four wires on it blu/red wht/red red/blu & blk. I don't know if the acc. relay is the actual problem. It's the only thing I hear clicking when I try to start the car though. Oh yeah, I also replaced the ignition switch thinking that was it. IT WASN"T Alternator and voltage regulator were replaced recently too. Oh yeah my car is a '72 240Z with a 5 speed. I did learn somthing new though: On the fuse box, with the key in th ON position, when all the other circuits show 12.5 volts, the IGNITION curcuit only shows around 6 volts ( the circuit on the left column, middle fuse ) I'm not sure what's causing this but that's probably a good clue..... Any electrical gurus out there got any ideas about this I'm going to try to scrounge up some acc relays from parts yards ( hopefully ) and see what happens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
innerware Posted July 10, 2003 Share Posted July 10, 2003 You can probably get a relay from the Z Barn. They have all sorts of stuff in stock used. There prices are good and low too. Ships quickly too. I th ink they are in Tenn or something. Good luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaime240z Posted July 10, 2003 Author Share Posted July 10, 2003 OK thanks! Boy, I sure hope this works..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mtj71Z Posted July 10, 2003 Share Posted July 10, 2003 i read somewhere that the prupose of that relay was to make sure the heat for the rear window defroster and the AC could not be left on while the car is turned off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spotfitz Posted July 10, 2003 Share Posted July 10, 2003 My first suggestion would have been the ignition switch(mine did the same thing once and it was the switch), but since you replaced it... Try checking the wire coming from the harness right beside the starter that goes to the lug on the solenoid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaime240z Posted July 11, 2003 Author Share Posted July 11, 2003 Well I know this is going to be a big surprise. I searched 4 local part pullers in the area and...no Z cars! Which means no replacement relay..which means dead Z Spotfitz. I think I will trace out the wiring tomorrow and see if I missed anything the first time around. I'm skeptical though beacuse the car was running when I parked it 3 months ago. this has been a little problem that got worse with time and now it's finally broken all the way. That's why I'm thinking it's going to be a switch or relay, as opposed to connections. But who know...? nno really, who knows? Anyone..? Oh well I didn't get out the the garage today because it was like200 deg. out there. Matbe tomorrow will be a little more productive. I really miss my Z. Even though my truck has A/c and the Z doesn't. A weekend cruise in the primred beast would be worth a little sweat though... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted July 11, 2003 Share Posted July 11, 2003 DELETE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaime240z Posted July 11, 2003 Author Share Posted July 11, 2003 Point taken Spirit! BTW I actually have been laid up in bed and I know exactly how my Z cars feels. Only it's a few years older than me! Well I hope I can fix this glitch soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted July 11, 2003 Share Posted July 11, 2003 DELETE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaime240z Posted July 11, 2003 Author Share Posted July 11, 2003 Thanks Spirit. What you said makes sense. If the relay is clicking that means it is possible it's doing its job internally. I think I'll try your technique today. I'm pretty sure I can get the cover off the relay. Here goes. nuthin' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted July 11, 2003 Share Posted July 11, 2003 DELETE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaime240z Posted July 11, 2003 Author Share Posted July 11, 2003 Yup! I got me one of them multimeters and two wiring diagrams for the Z incase I need to cross reference. Every circuit on the fuse block was getting 12.5 volts EXCEPT for the Ignition fuse. I still haven't gone out to the garage today. Too many other honey-do's today. I'll keep the post updated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaime240z Posted July 14, 2003 Author Share Posted July 14, 2003 Ding, ding, ding. I think I've figured it out and Spirit mentioned it days ago. I ested the acc relay and everything seemed to work OK. I tested the leads with the key in different positions. Seem good. I traced out all the wiring from the battery to the starter and to the ignition switch. The ignition switch on the back of the keylock cylinder is new so I figured that was doing its job. Then I tester the leads on the harness behind the ignition switch. It had the constant power ( wht/red, if I remember correctly) and the acc leads got power with the key in the acc position. The only lead not getting power was the one going to the starter with the key in the start postion. POS! I was pissed I had wasted so much time trying to figure this out and I was happy I had found out ( maybe) what was wrong. So now my focus is on the ignition lock. Not the small module that the harness plugs into, but the actual key lock cylinder. The only other test I could think of was to "tap" the lock cylinder with a hammer to see if that would "fix" the problem. And holy carp IT STARTED. It started right up on the first try like my car was saying FINALLY you dumb-ass. Anyways, I let the car warm up at idle. sounded good except for a header leak. I then shut the motor and waited a minute...tried to start it again and NOTHING! I tried tapping the lock cylinder again but this time I wasn't so lucky. Well I'm 95% sure it's the ignition lock. Now, has anyone else experienced a similar problem...? Did replacing the ignition lock do the trick? I looked up prices in the MSA and VB cats and this piece is around $100. I know used ones are less but in this case I want a new part. However I don't want to fork over the money unless I'm positive that's the problem. Can anyone out there help with this.....please..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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