Guest buschj Posted September 10, 2003 Share Posted September 10, 2003 Any ideas on how to get this Ford forum a little more lively? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jwink25 Posted September 10, 2003 Share Posted September 10, 2003 Send me a built 302 with about 400HP and a worldclass 5 speed, and I'll drop it into my Z. I'll post lots of updates and everything. Do this for me and I'll forget about the turbo swap. I'll post in the Ford forum everyday I swear! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
74_5.0L_Z Posted September 10, 2003 Share Posted September 10, 2003 The Ford forum is relatively quiet because there are only a few members with Ford engines in their cars. I could post a lot more, but I have been thrashing away getting my car ready for the SEZ event. Since the end of april, I have totally reassembled my car after wrecking it and building a full tube chassis. I guess the other reason I don't post much is that I hate answering questions that I have answered several times before. I post answers when people ask good questions that I haven't seen answered ad nauseum before. Good Luck, Dan McGrath Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest buschj Posted September 10, 2003 Share Posted September 10, 2003 Dan, I agree that there are less Ford Z’s and I know it’s hard to get excited over the same question for the 100th time. Before I decided to use a Ford power plant, I made daily visits to the Chevy forum. They have five posts a day, and we have a post every 5 days. Your gallery was very impressive. Should we post our progress on a regular basis to inspire others? John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trevor Posted September 10, 2003 Share Posted September 10, 2003 Yes please do. Need to be inspired once in a while Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
74_5.0L_Z Posted September 10, 2003 Share Posted September 10, 2003 John, I agree that I should post more on the progress to help inspire others. I try to be a team player, and I enjoy interfacing with my fellow HybridZ members (I am beside myself with anticipation of this coming weekend's SEZ event). Unfortunately, I have two things that keep me from posting progress. First, I am posting from work. So, I post only before work, at lunch, or just before I go home. Second, I don't have a digital camera. I have to rely on others to take pictures. Will there be any other Ford reps at the SEZ event this weekend? I would love to see another Ford powered Z. Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshB 240Z Posted September 10, 2003 Share Posted September 10, 2003 I will post some of my progress. I have a 5.0L engine, transmission/transmission mount and driveshaft are also installed. The EFI has signal to the fuel injectors and coil. All I BELIEVE theat I have left to do is install an alternator, starter, radiator and exhaust. I have chosen to upgrade the alternator to the later style Ford alternator that has an output of 130A, later starter with solenoid on the starter and an aluminum radiator. The only real issue I have run into is that there is no clearance between the EGR plate and hood. I am still looking into my options here. I have an early (87-93) style upper intake manifold as well as a later (94-95) upper manifold to play with. Each manifold has it's pros and cons. I will let you know which I decide to use. I have two questions: 1) Has anyone else heard that the later style upper intake manifold gives up 10hp to the early style? 2) Will there be any harm in machining 1/2" off the lower intake to get better upper manifold to hood clearance? Josh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drax240z Posted September 10, 2003 Share Posted September 10, 2003 A guy out at the shop I'm working at is in the process of a 351W into a Z31 300zx. I'll post some pictures as it happens, right now there isn't much to see except the engine is in the hole. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
74_5.0L_Z Posted September 10, 2003 Share Posted September 10, 2003 Josh, The tightest clearance that I have between the hood and engine is the breather fitting on the MAF that goes to the oil filler tube. Mine clears the hood by about 1/8". Clearance gets better as you increase the set back of the engine, and obviously as you set the engine lower in the car. My engine is set so that the back of the block is ~1" ahead of the firewall, the centerline of the front of the crank is slightly below the top of the frame rails, and at an angle of 2.5 degrees(transmission angled down). I have raised the rear of the differential to get the same angle on the diff. The engine is centered left to right. With the engine in this location the EFI clears the stock hood, and I can (just barely) get to the bellhousing bolts. With the stock hood latch I had about 0.030" clearance between the latch and upper manifold. I have since removed the stock latch. Oh, and the later (94-95) intake makes less power. That is why the 94-95 had less power even though they went to an electric fan. Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshB 240Z Posted September 10, 2003 Share Posted September 10, 2003 Dan, My clearance issue is with the breather that you mentioned and the two water passages on the top of the EGR plate. The EGR passages do not contact the hood but I would say they were in the 1/8" range just below. The breather does contact the hood just before the second latch. With only 1/8" of clearance between your breater and the hood you don't have any contact when the engine rocks? The height of my engine was already determined as I used the cross member sold by Alsil. It sounds as though our mounting locations side to side are equal and it's both my front to rear location and engine height that differ. The crank centerline is barely above the tops of the frame rails. I am also trying to determine if dual or dual to single exhaust is better. I currently have a 3" exhaust all of the way back that was left over from my turbo setup. Any suggestions or preferences? Thanks, Josh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
74_5.0L_Z Posted September 10, 2003 Share Posted September 10, 2003 Josh, What angle is the engine set at? If the angle is high, then the front of the engine will be raised. Try raising the tailshaft of the transmission and seeing if the clearance gets better. Then measure the angle (angle finder on the starter housing). Adjust diff angle to match. I am using dual 2.5" exhaust with an H-pipe and two flow master two chamber mufflers. I like the sound of mine most of the time, in fact, I get a lot of compliments. Sometimes it's just too loud. The hard part about running dual exhaust is moving the gas tank. I replaced my stock tank with a 16 gallon polyethelene fuel cell centered between the rear frame rails. If I were going to do it again, I would run a single 3" exhaust. If the single 3" exhaust is well made, it will flow plenty well enough to support 400hp. Other benefits are that it looks more stock(sleeper), and one muffler is cheaper than two. Oh yeah, in two years of driving the car the manifold never touched the hood(the motor torques the other way. Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest buschj Posted September 10, 2003 Share Posted September 10, 2003 Josh, Hood clearance: My motor is a 95’302 with the low profile manifold. I don’t think you can put this manifold on an earlier model because of the different EGR system. I went with the 95’ because of the hood clearance and the motor only had 37k original miles. Asil’s Mount: It’s great! BUT…. the stock steering rod cannot be used, and the motor sits a little higher than I like. Exhaust: I love the sound of a Ford small block with dual 2 ½ “ pipes and Flowmasters. With the stock gas tank, there just isn’t enough room to put two mufflers neatly and safely in the stock location. I am using Flowmasters Y-Pipe (Dual 2 ½ in > 3†out) to a single 3†muffler. What are you going to do for a steering rod? John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshB 240Z Posted September 10, 2003 Share Posted September 10, 2003 Dan- My engine sits at a 4 degree angle. It's easy to change and I may try adjusting it to see if the clearance issue resolves itself. John- The EGR system is different so I blocked it off initially to get the manifold on and the engine running. My plan was to circle back to the EGR once the car was running as I have been told that the ECU is tuned for some EGR and will knock if it is removed and all else left equal. I, too, enjoy the dual exhaust sound but couldn't figure out how to stuff the mufflers under the car without moving the gas tank. I went ahead and purchased the Flowmaster Y-pipe that mentioned and will use it for now. As far as the steering shaft I cut it and added a u-joint and support bearing to the system. I tried to figure out a way around it but determined that I was going to have header or motor mount clearance problems either way. The u joint allows me to use a fairly "stock" approach where I can use Al's crossmember, unmodified aftermarket street rod headers and standard late 60's Ford motor mounts. What type of system did you use to mount your engine? Thanks for the help. Josh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueovalz Posted September 10, 2003 Share Posted September 10, 2003 The importance of documenting any SBF swap with technical information (measurements, etc) as well as pictures, will go a long way toward offering future Ford swap considerations some solid information to help them decide what to do. Nearly all the SBF conversions (as far as I've notice) are using differing methods of installation (mounting, spacing, etc). In a way, this can be an asset in that it will offer many options to the potential swap. Anybody doing this swap needs to pass pictures and methods back into this forum for all to gander at. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest buschj Posted September 10, 2003 Share Posted September 10, 2003 I used Asil’s mount with 68’ Mustang motor mounts. I haven’t committed to bolting the motor in the final position yet, so I haven’t installed the steering rod. My plan is to use at least one u-joint with a support bearing (http://www.borgeson.com/Supportbearing.htm) to stabilize the rod. The 95’ motor is a wiring disaster compared to the Fox body years. I purchased all of the under hood harnesses from a 95’ Mustang and tried to splice everything into the Z harness (%^$#$%&*&). After careful consideration, I decided to get rid of all the 30 year old Z wiring and use a 95’ Mustang interior harness. The JTR manual is really against using aluminum radiators for street use. What did everybody do about cooling? John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshB 240Z Posted September 10, 2003 Share Posted September 10, 2003 I found with the 94-95 upper intake manifold that hood clearance was not a problem with Al's mount and the '68 Mustang motor mounts. The only issue I had with this setup was getting the last bolt on the intake manifold that will sit just under the hood latch. I had to install the manifold with this bolt before installing the engine. This is not a problem on the earlier manifold due to a shorter bolt length. I purchased my steering joint from Coleman Racing as recomended by another HybridZ member. http://www.colemanracing.com The earlier EFI is much easier. I had to wire in eight wires and I had the EFI working. The earlier harness is pretty much a stand alone. Lastly, I have been taking notes on the swap and will add them to the forum once the installation is done and running. I keep changing things everytime I work on the car. Josh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
74_5.0L_Z Posted September 11, 2003 Share Posted September 11, 2003 I originally put my motor in with the 87-93 stock intake. I have since gone to the '93 Cobra intake. The clearance at the hood latch is better with the cobra intake than with the stock unit. I am using Dynomax block hugger headers (for now). The dynomax were the only headers that I found to fit when I first did the swap. I was using fox mustang mounts initially, but during the rebuild after the accident have switched to a front plate/mid plate set-up. One of my next mods is going to be some custom full length headers (there is a ton of room for headers now that the motor mounts are out of the way). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueovalz Posted September 11, 2003 Share Posted September 11, 2003 What did everybody do about cooling? Aluminum Griffin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest buschj Posted September 11, 2003 Share Posted September 11, 2003 Terry, I always wanted to ask you about your radiator configuration. Most radiators have the coolant inlet on the top and outlet on the bottom. Did you reverse the water pump flow, or are you pushing the coolant from bottom to the top? John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueovalz Posted September 11, 2003 Share Posted September 11, 2003 Good observation. I'm am in the process of reversing these lines. As it is plumbed currently, any water loss results in a drastic loss of cooling efficiency. In fact, the water will not flow with the loss of even a small amount of coolant. When I reverse these (as was originally done when I first made the conversion) I could still keep normal operating temperature even without a full radiator, and trapped air in the system was not a problem. Hopefully, the tubing will be welded next month and I can get back to the original pumbing again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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