Mike kZ Posted May 15, 2001 Share Posted May 15, 2001 I also remember that the Versaille has a tapered housing which makes it hard to shorten. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Posted May 15, 2001 Share Posted May 15, 2001 You know the more I read here the more I am glad this forum has such an open minded group of people.... Try putting an aritcle about putting a Lincon rear in a Datsun anywhere else and they would slam you hard. Here we have enough people who are willing to think and use there mind. Not only do they take it and run with the idea, they look for ways to improve it. To bad we dont all work together I might actually enjoy going to work....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pparaska Posted May 15, 2001 Share Posted May 15, 2001 Ray, this is really more like the streetrodder.com forum (which is pretty good BTW) than a Z car forum. Lot's more ideas and info than on just Z's here - I love it! What about those aftermarket IRS units that use 9" pumpkins? Lot's o' money, but it'd be trick and pretty strong. But if I were doing drag racing in the 10s like Scottie, I'd probably just go to a solid axle too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeromio Posted May 15, 2001 Share Posted May 15, 2001 What's the URL for the Streetrodder forum? I tried the obvious, http://streetrodder.com, but could find no mention of a forum. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pparaska Posted May 15, 2001 Share Posted May 15, 2001 Oops. Sorry. www.hotrodder.com There is a bit of the usual Ford vs Chevy, and my rides the baddest nonesense, but there are some knowledgeable hot rodders there as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted May 15, 2001 Share Posted May 15, 2001 Thats what I like here as well, idea's are at least considered and not immediately scoffed. Like Pete said its more of a street rodder mentality. Open discussion of idea's without prejudice stirs really good idea's into excellent idea's. I'm personally glad we can refrain from the Ford vs Chevy, Inline vs V8 hyperbole that is so unnecessary because in the end its about what does it for the individual and not anyone else. I guess it comes down to, HybridZ rules... Lone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted May 16, 2001 Share Posted May 16, 2001 Holy Cow.. 2.49? Man you could take it out to Bonneville with those ratios... Lone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottie-GNZ Posted May 16, 2001 Author Share Posted May 16, 2001 Great thread folks. What you have posted and what I have found out about the Versailles rear probably rules it out. It most likely will not have an LSD and the ratios are 2.49 and 3.00. The "funky" brakes is the fact that the caliper is an oddity and the rotors are unidirectional, meaning if you put them on the wrong side, the vented rotor becomes non-functional. There seems to be a touch of Edsel in this car Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted May 17, 2001 Share Posted May 17, 2001 I found this page while in my voyage across the web tonight that lists all the widths of Ford 9" rear ends and what model to look for, how to identify etc. FWIW: http://dfwmotorsport.com/Fairlane/9inchrearends.htm Regards, Lone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted May 18, 2001 Share Posted May 18, 2001 Ok, I've been looking at some pictures of the T-bird IRS. I've been mulling some idea's around, feel free to poke holes, totally shatter and or mutilate them. Just brainstorming out loud here, if I get to loud tell me to shut up, no offense taken... In slide number 1 we have: A picture of the rear end with the a arms hanging down. Note how the rear end is supported. The next picture will show it better. This picture shows the halfshafts by Raxles (1.5 inch compared to the 1 1/16" on the other side). Nice pinion shaft flange looks made for a adapter... This picture shows the control arms. Ok, now to the point. It looks like if one could hang that cross member in the back of the Z, make some shorter and adjustable tubular control arms (with a mount on the bottom for a coil over shock not sure, possibly mustang, it would need to be a coilover with a eyelet or something on the bottom since it would have 2 control arms instead of one like the Datsun. Since Raxles makes the shafts anyway, make them shorter. It might be do-able. I'm thinking the best way to eliminate breakage of the 240-280z stub axles is to not use them. Disc brakes, better gears and posi available. Just food for though, the crossmember might well be entirely to big, but could probably be redone lighter and smaller in the Z. This is probably for the moderate horsepower set, you big guns probably need to keep looking.. Oh well, just thinking out loud. Fire away.. Lone PS: Duh, wouldn't need to make the control arms adjustable, they already are on the inside pivot point... [ May 18, 2001: Message edited by: lonehdrider ] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest John Adkins Posted May 18, 2001 Share Posted May 18, 2001 Just some more thoughts... The big Lincoln coupe (same platform as the T bird) has an aluminum diff case and could save some weight.... I was thinking about adapting a Corvette differential some day, but Corvette parts are priced like they are gold plated.... T-Birds are very common, so the price should be reasonable, plus gears and LSD units are the common 8.8 Ford... People are using the t-bird rear in Cobra kit cars running big blocks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest John Adkins Posted May 18, 2001 Share Posted May 18, 2001 Just some more thoughts... The big Lincoln coupe (same platform as the T bird) has an aluminum diff case and could save some weight.... I was thinking about adapting a Corvette differential some day, but Corvette parts are priced like they are gold plated.... T-Birds are very common, so the price should be reasonable, plus gears and LSD units are the common 8.8 Ford... People are using the t-bird rear in Cobra kit cars running big blocks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted May 18, 2001 Share Posted May 18, 2001 Yeah, I read that somewhere too. That would be pretty cool, because it is a heavy unit and any lightening would be a good thing. The more I look at this IRS the more I like it. Price is reasonable, I got a quote a while back for the Tbird unit of 450.00 disc to disc, everything. Lincoln might be a bit more, but even at that its relatively inexpensive. With the R200's becoming more and more used up, at some point that won't be a option without rebuilding one. The VLSD and R230 are both options, but it doesn't address the stub axle problem. Although I don't have the HP to kill a R200 at this time, I'd like something with more readably available parts and better gear ratio's. (a 3.63 or 4.08 isn't needed with a T56 tranny, first then just becomes a joke. Somewhere in the low threes would make the first gear usable). The posi and disk brakes are just icing on the cake. Regards, Lone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owen Posted May 19, 2001 Share Posted May 19, 2001 The T-Bird end is used on the Monster Miata too, I was asking around a couple of months ago but never got any replies... Sorry if thats been mentioned already, I just jumped to the bottom of the thread. Owen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest needwaymorespeed Posted May 19, 2001 Share Posted May 19, 2001 Originally posted by lonehdrider: The VLSD and R230 are both options, but it doesn't address the stub axle problem. lone the way I want to do the r230 does address the stub axle problem,Im getting rid of th stock one and using the outer cv joint from the r230 with a custom rear hub carrier, that im currently building. this way I also get the bigger rear discs that come on the 90-96 300 z tt. The 8.8 ford rear ends are great but the irs halfshafts break plus I think it would be alot of work to put one in versus the whole r230 rear end Curtis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest John Adkins Posted May 19, 2001 Share Posted May 19, 2001 quote: Originally posted by needwaymorespeed: the way I want to do the r230 does address the stub axle problem,Im getting rid of th stock one and using the outer cv joint from the r230 with a custom rear hub carrier, that im currently building. this way I also get the bigger rear discs that come on the 90-96 300 z tt. The 8.8 ford rear ends are great but the irs halfshafts break plus I think it would be alot of work to put one in versus the whole r230 rear end Curtis[/QB] Building a custom rear hub carrier is easier than adapting a whole rear end assembly attached to a subframe (t-bird)?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted May 20, 2001 Share Posted May 20, 2001 Its easier if your a machinist or have a good machinist friend. I don't think creating a new bearing carrier/knuckle could be considered easy. I'm not discounting anyone's effort with the R230, its definately suitable and definately strong, but going Nissan is not the only solution. The halfshafts would have to be custom (raxles) at 1.5 inches I don't think they'd break real easy for street applications. I guess its how you look at it, and what you feel comfortable having to fabricate. My own opinion is theres still the issue of gearing. Being as I can start in second gear in the T56 with a 3.54 (with a smaller diameter tire profile), going lower isn't a consideration for me. With my tires, something closer to 3.00-3.23 would make 1st gear more usable and cruise rpm's would be low but I'd still be able to pull them. Regards, Lone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottie-GNZ Posted May 20, 2001 Author Share Posted May 20, 2001 I agree with Lone. If you are considering a Corvette or T-Bird, why not use the entire subframe as designed. The factory spent $Ms engineering those designs, why cut it up and try to graft it to the Nissan parts? I asked this before and got no answer, so let me pose it a different way. Lets say the Z IRS is 57" hub-hub and I have an 8" wheel with 4.5" BS and everything fits just fine. MOF, I could go 5" or even 5.5" BS. Now I decided to do a Corvette or T-Bird IRS and lets say their IRS is 60". Without oversimplifying things, it seems the way to go would be to remove the Z rear-end completely, fab mount points and install the entire subframe. Now you are 3" wider than stock, so should'nt a pair rims with a 6" BS give a final fit exactly as I started with? Am I missing something? By coincidence, the Cobra R rims have a 5.9" BS and I will bet many of the new factory rims, and there are some nice ones, are probably close. The bottom line is, if the Z rear is 57", many of the options we have, Ford solid, Ford IRS, Corvette, etc are within a few inches, then instead of narrowing or modifying them in any way, just find a rim with the correct BS. Somebody please tell me I am missing something. [ May 19, 2001: Message edited by: Scottie-GNZ ] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest John Adkins Posted May 20, 2001 Share Posted May 20, 2001 quote: Originally posted by lonehdrider: Its easier if your a machinist or have a good machinist friend. I don't think creating a new bearing carrier/knuckle could be considered easy... Lone That's what I was thinking about the custom bearing carrier--lots of machining. Grafting the subframe would be easier for those folks who don't have machinist skills but don't mind fabricating. And, like Scotty says, the wider rear track would allow you to use positive offset wheels without an adapter! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLKMGK Posted May 20, 2001 Share Posted May 20, 2001 Most of the wheels I'm looking at in 17X8 have a MAX offset of 40mm. 25.4 to the inch so your calcs are close I thnk. I still owe you a measure on the 8.8, I just never remember when I'm out by the car (sigh). Are you looking at T-bird or Cobra primarily? I'm not sure that the T-Bird is stronger than the Cobra, just not raced as often. The aluminum carrier that I think the Cobras have can get chewed up too, not sure what the T-birds have for a carrier. Might be able to get some shots of a Cobra's rear for you if this is a serious consideration - measurements too possibly. All depends what's on the rack when I go over and if a brain cell fires to get me to check it out. I always seem to forget my camera! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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