gvincent Posted January 30, 2009 Share Posted January 30, 2009 I stumbled upon a guy who has a 4 bolt SBC freshly rebuilt all stock for $1200 or a 406 ready to assemble for $800. He will assemble the 406 but hasn't given me a price yet. Here is what I know so far: Engine came out of a 72 Chevy wagon with 70K and was going to be a school Auto Shop project but got canned Block was fully tested and machined and is now bored 30 over New cam bearings installed Stock 400 crank 10/10 10.5:1 Hypereutectic alloy pistons stock rods a big cam (he will get me specs off the box) new lifters, bearings, gasket set, timing gear and chain, oil pump, push rods, etc. basically everything in the two pictures so I think it will end up being a 406 with all stock internals except for the pistons and cam. If he assemblies it he will put on a used Performer intake and 750 Holly and has a freshly done set of 194 Fuelie heads complete ready to bolt on. He will run the engine on a stand when he is done. From the Pics I can see pretty clearly that most of the Boxes are from EngineTech IROC Thoughts? What do you think it would be worth when assembled Tough to tell power capabilities until I get the cam specs. Guesses?? If I decide to go this route I will be selling both of my LT1 motors Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jt1 Posted January 30, 2009 Share Posted January 30, 2009 The price sounds reasonable. I'm not familiar with Enginetech, but it sounds like it's import stuff and should probably be checked closely for clearances, quality, etc. The stock 400 rods are weak, and a stock crank is cast. So, you can't turn much rpm with it, but it would make a lively, somewhat hotter than stock motor. To build a real screamer you will use the block and not much else. Any flat tappet build is a little risky with today's oils, so keep that in mind on the build and break-in. Around here, good 400 blocks are hard to find. A good block with nice machine work would easily be worth $800, maybe more. jt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_hunt Posted January 30, 2009 Share Posted January 30, 2009 IMO the 400's are a better build than the 383's, you get more cubic inches and they breathe better also. I've never seen any problems with the cast cranks, circle track guys run them all the time making 500hp with no problems. The stock rods need to be match selected and have arp fasteners if your going stock, but why would you when eagle h beams rods are about $350. Go with a stock 400 length in the eagles and run the stock 400 pistons. A lot of people tend to run longer rods but with todays cheap gas that leads to detonation and the shorter rod makes for less dwell time as the main advantage that I see. If you run some dart iron eagle heads, 400 to 450 HP is relatively easy with a hydraulic cam and a victor jr, and makes a great daily driver even with 9:1 compression. Isky makes a great little hyd cam 236 duration at .050 and .510 lift 106LSA. I used that cam in my daily driver for years, put over 100K miles on that motor. A little lumpy but awesome power in my Monte SS, went 12.58 @ 110mph in the 1320 here at altitude with 9:1 dished pistons on alky, went 13.30 @ 104 on pump gas in my 3800 lb sled monte. In a z that would be low to mid 12's on pump gas. Yes, you read it right alky on a 9:1 motor. Don't believe anyone who tells you you can't run alky on low compression motors, they are full of it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gvincent Posted February 4, 2009 Author Share Posted February 4, 2009 Has anybody used any stuff from Enginetech/IROC? Experience good or bad? Doc, I just drool over your 400's, I wish I had enough confidence to build my own. I have saved a lot of good articles on different 400 builds and bookmarked posts from both you Grumpy and others on this site as well. I still may keep my LT1 and run that for the time being and get enough confidence and money to do a slow take my time 400 build in the future. Other than VW engines 30 years ago and a 396 BBC with a lot of help I have never built an engine. I can buy all the 400 parts above for $800 un-assembled as a starting point. Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyro Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 10.5:1 cr with what cc head??? makes a huge difference. old "1.94 fuelie heads" in stock form will not make much more than 400hp. They just don't flow enough. 10.5:1 cr will need a big cam to run with pump gas (290 to 310 degrees seat to seat duration). which would be a mismatch for a regular edelbrock performer intake. you need an edelbrock rpm intake. Plus the heads will need to be machined to hold stronger valve springs (1.5" od). you will also need the flywheel and balancer for a 400. (externally balanced). http://www.chevyhiperformance.com/techarticles/148_0306_chevrolet_406_big_block_torque/index.html check out this article Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_hunt Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 That is why I never bothered building 383's. But 400's are getting hard to find these days. I have a 4 bolt block sitting in the shop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gvincent Posted February 7, 2009 Author Share Posted February 7, 2009 Hey Pyro, Yeah I have that one in my favorites as well as a couple more I listed below. http://www.carcraft.com/techarticles/406ci_chevy_small_block/index.html http://www.chevyhiperformance.com/techarticles/148_0401_chevrolet_406_ci_engine_build/index.html http://www.chevyhiperformance.com/techarticles/0802ch_406_small_block_chevy_engine/index.html http://www.chevyhiperformance.com/tech/engines_drivetrain/cams_heads_valvetrain/0703ch_valve_spring_tech/index.html http://www.chevyhiperformance.com/techarticles/93863_500_horsepower_engines/index.html I emailed the guy back , waiting for cam numbers and head cc on the 194 Greg 10.5:1 cr with what cc head??? makes a huge difference. old "1.94 fuelie heads" in stock form will not make much more than 400hp. They just don't flow enough. 10.5:1 cr will need a big cam to run with pump gas (290 to 310 degrees seat to seat duration). which would be a mismatch for a regular edelbrock performer intake. you need an edelbrock rpm intake. Plus the heads will need to be machined to hold stronger valve springs (1.5" od). you will also need the flywheel and balancer for a 400. (externally balanced). http://www.chevyhiperformance.com/techarticles/148_0306_chevrolet_406_big_block_torque/index.html check out this article Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gvincent Posted February 9, 2009 Author Share Posted February 9, 2009 He finally sent me the cam specs, this is the info he sent. "The cam is sae dur 266 in - 298 ex -- valve lift 443 in - 465 ex Thoughts on this cam? What are is the cc of a 194 fuellie head? Thanks, Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZZZeee Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 Holy split duration, Batman!! That's adv. duration/lift, right? What's the LSA? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_hunt Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 He finally sent me the cam specs, this is the info he sent."The cam is sae dur 266 in - 298 ex -- valve lift 443 in - 465 ex Thoughts on this cam? What are is the cc of a 194 fuellie head? Thanks, Greg The stock fuelie heads are about 170cc intake port IIRC. The exhaust side doesn't flow well so the split duration and lift helps that. The heads don't flow well over .500 lift anyway but I'd get it as close to that as possible. 400's are big motors and that is really too small of a cam for that application IMO. I used to run a crower solid lifter cam with those heads. 244 duration at .050, .510 lift and 110LSA. Worked darn good! I've ported alot of those fuelie heads and you can make over 400hp with them on a 400 pretty easily. Stepping up to a dart iron eagle is probably the most cost effective route in terms of money and gains IMO. But it's your deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gvincent Posted February 11, 2009 Author Share Posted February 11, 2009 It seems from the responses so far that the block may be good to get but all the parts he has are not the best parts selection for a good decent build. He will only sell the complete short block and all the EngineTech parts for $800 un-assembled but I would have to sell off the stock rods, the cam, and the pistons and rings if I didn't keep those either, I would have to spend at least another 2K+ to get the right rods, Dart heads, cam, intake carb, distributor, Accessories, brackets, pan etc. so it is starting to not sound like such a good idea/deal. I'll keep looking, someday..... Thanks Doc and everybody all for the good advice. Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_hunt Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 Depends on what your goal is. 400HP in a z is quite a bit for a daily driver. Shop around on ebay and you'll find some dart sportsman II heads cheap, used intake, buy some eagle rods and a new crank and you'll be there. Or go poor boy and port the heads and do the same thing. Stock heads you can get 400HP, dart sportsman II or iron eagles you'll get 470+HP. I think that is more than enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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