Administrators RTz Posted March 5, 2009 Administrators Share Posted March 5, 2009 (edited) Gotta get some history out of the way... My first 510 exposure was retro-fitting a VG30DE into Dave & Sara Lum's Dime (1999-ish). Went for a ride in Gary Savage's VG30ET car (aka Strutless Wonder). Later, Dave convinced me to add a pair of turbo's to his 510, netting a tick under 400hp @ 2500lbs. Somewhere in the mix, took a spin in Kelvin Dietz breathtakingly clean VG30E powered car... A/C, power windows, et all. It would be an understatement to suggest I had no clue what a stock 510 was like. I decided to find out. I latched on to this '72 two door at the Canby Datsun meet in May, 2005 with 119K original miles. No test drive, just a verbal agreement... Purchased from Jason & Katie Waalkes, who purchased it from Chris Vonderchek (sp?). Originally an automatic car, converted to a dogleg 5-speed, Electronic ignition, dual carbs and a mild cam. This L16 positioned itself squarely on my list of slowest cars ever driven. I was expecting anemic when I picked it up. I was still shocked (or spoiled) I drove it almost daily, as shown, for probably 60K miles, occasionally trading with my wife. It didn't take long to decided the stock springs were horrid. A set of ST springs were swapped in within a few months. Eventually, Bart began needing 'stuff'. So, about a year ago, I freshened up the suspension with new ball joints/bushings/shocks, along with 280zx front struts and vented brakes. MUCH improvement. Still bloody tired though. Well, thats enough for one night. I'll sign off with a couple pics of Lum's TT Dime... "Bart" & "Red"... Edited March 5, 2009 by RTz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted March 8, 2009 Author Administrators Share Posted March 8, 2009 (edited) As I mentioned, Bart was getting tired. The engine was burning unreasonable volumes of oil, water pump and starter expiring, radiator not keeping up on warmer day's, etc, etc. It was time. Time to sell it, or get busy. My wife and I settled on the latter. Penciling out my options, it was looking like an SR swap would cost roughly 10-20% more than freshening the L-series. So I ping an old comrade, Michael Spreadbury, to let him know I may be in the market. Michael is known for his impeccable Roadster work, including importing and retrofitting SR's. It turns out he had a solid lead on a local motor... Originally sold to Neal Bibbler, and installed in a 510. Neal had an... um.... unplanned excursion, ending the life of his Dime. Therein lies the beauty... this drivetrain was previously installed in a 510, so it included some relevant 'extras'. The list was hard to ignore... Harness, ECU, sensor's, et all. Complete SS exhaust system (2 1/2" with Borla muffler) McKinney Motorsports top-mount exhaust manifold and associated plumbing Intercooler w/complete custom plumbing Greddy oil pan New ACT clutch Under 20K miles & Michael's word that its one of the nicest running SR's he's ever imported. A deal was struck with Neal, and four weeks of spare time later... Edited March 16, 2009 by RTz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted March 16, 2009 Author Administrators Share Posted March 16, 2009 (edited) Mechanically, this was a pretty low effort swap... most everything had been previously installed in a 510, I wasn't attempting anything fancy, and the SR fits so naturally. Starting with the mounts... Motor mounts consisted of 1/2" spacers. Yup, that's it. I machined 1/2" aluminum spacers and used the stock L-series rubber isolators. With the spacers, the SR bolts up to the stock cross-member. Well... kind of. The issue is not the mounts, so much as the cross-member itself. The SR being a front sump, created a bit of interference. This has been addressed in several different ways, but I chose to cut out the front biased offset and weld in a 'straight' replacement. I think a single 2" round tube would have been sufficient for any normal loads imposed, but I like to be able to jack the car up by the cross-member. This led to using 2"x1" box tube, one situated vertically, and the other horizontally. This seems to be plenty stout as jacking produces no visible deflection. The transmission mount is a modified stocker. It ain't pretty, but its stout. I cut out the center, welded in a 2"x1" box tube (horizontally) and drilled a single hole through the center. I used a GM transmission isolator, which fits the SR tranny nicely (Energy Suspension part# 3-1108G). Edited July 13, 2009 by RTz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted March 16, 2009 Author Administrators Share Posted March 16, 2009 (edited) Fuel Supply... I spent a great deal of time deliberating on what I wanted, verses what was realistic. In the end, I chose to 'git R done'. I adapted a Z31 fuel sump/baffle inside the stock 510 tank, along with a Walbro 255lp in-tank pump. What a noisy bugger! It's triple isolated and still obnoxious. Within the car, its only noticeable while idling, but open the trunk and people scatter for 3 blocks. New 5/16" SS fuel lines provide the supply & return duties, along with a firewall mounted '96 Q45 fuel filter. While I was at it, I inverted the fuel sender in anticipation of using VDO gauges (opposite read). More on that later. I haven't run the car low enough on fuel to have an opinion on the Z31 baffle. Time will tell. Edited March 18, 2009 by RTz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted March 18, 2009 Author Administrators Share Posted March 18, 2009 Driveshaft... I was a bit surprised to find the slip yoke of the original 510 driveshaft fits the SR transmission. Just a matter of having it shortened and freshened up. Final length ended up being 35 5/8", centerline of front U-joint to back of pinion flange. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted March 18, 2009 Author Administrators Share Posted March 18, 2009 (edited) Steering... Normally, the crosslink is a minor issue with an SR swap. There is some interference with the NVH braces at the back of the oil pan. The usual methods are to machine down the braces, or use a modified crosslink. However, with the above motor mounts, the engine sits a little higher than 'normal'. The only contact is right at full lock, the centerlink *barley* touches the lower bellhousing bolts. It's causing no trouble... just one of those things that whispers in the back of your mind "ya know Ron, rack & pinion would solve that problem"... Edited March 18, 2009 by RTz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted March 18, 2009 Author Administrators Share Posted March 18, 2009 (edited) Cooling/Intercooler... This is one of my least favorite items. In fact, it bugs me so much, I don't even want to talk about it. I used a '96 Volkswagen GTI VR6 radiator (same as the the VG30DETT listed in post #1) as well as an early (I think) Mckinny Motorsports intercooler. The short version is that everything is in the way of everything. This arrangement can be forced into submission by removing/plugging the two lower radiator passes (and a little cursing along the way helps, too). The result is a system with abrupt intercooler bends, a compromised radiator, and a cumbersome fill method. I added two Schrader valves, one on the high point of the engine, and one on the high point of the radiator. This purges the air satisfactorily, but its clearly barbaric. The intent all along has been to add a continuous bleed expansion tank. It's on the agenda... lest I get a wild hair and completely redo the whole shebang. With a front mounted intercooler, I prefer to run a mechanical fan. A couple of agreeable surprises surfaced... an S30 fan clutch bolts on to the SR water pump, perfectly. Bolt pattern and pilot are still same as the old L-series. Cool. BUT, the S30 fan sits too far rearward. Flipping it around positions it nicely (about 5/8" from radiator), but the blades face the wrong direction. We happen to have a VG30E sitting around, and bless Nissan's little heart, they cast that fan exactly backwards. It couldn't fit any better if Nissan had planned it. Maybe they did? So far, its been mostly cold and wet, so commenting on cooling performance is premature. I'll I can say at this point is... its 'doing fine'. Edited May 25, 2009 by RTz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted March 30, 2009 Author Administrators Share Posted March 30, 2009 (edited) I put Bart on a truck scale yesterday. Unfortunately I didn't realize it was a 'lo-res' scale until I got there... 50lb increments Every other scale in OR I've tried has been 20lb. So, you get to decide for yourself the value of these numbers Full tank of fuel... 2200lbs Me in the drivers seat (220lbs)... 1300 front, 1100 rear. Since my weight didn't push the scale over 2400lbs, I'm assuming the car is on the low side of the 2200lb increment. The car is fully assembled including interior with the exception of the instrument cluster/glove box removed (working on custom dash/gauges). No spare tire/jack. That'll have to do until I get access to a better scale. Edited March 30, 2009 by RTz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted April 13, 2009 Author Administrators Share Posted April 13, 2009 A 220 mile road trip netted an average 31.7 MPG w/3.90 butt's and 22" tires. Not bad... for a box. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted May 13, 2009 Author Administrators Share Posted May 13, 2009 (edited) I'm behind on the SR updates. You'll just have to forgive An interim update for now... Probably my least favorite thing about a 510 is the instrument panel. Can't really explain it. I just don't like it (see post #1). Since completing the SR swap, I've been running around dashless, with nothing more than water temp and fuel gauge dangling from the underlying dash frame. It's gotten OLD. Very old. Different ideas have been rattling around in my head for a while, and long story short, I finally settled on a fairly simple design. It includes seven VDO Vision gauges, and an Innovate G5 AFR gauge. Plasma cut and formed from 1/8" Aluminum... Much left to do... contouring/welding up the end panels, mounting, wiring, misc. switches & indicator lights, vents, finish work, etc. Gauges- Speedometer Tachometer Boost AFR Water Temp. EGT Air Temp. (serving double duty as both ambient and post intercooler) Fuel Edited May 13, 2009 by RTz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted May 15, 2009 Author Administrators Share Posted May 15, 2009 (edited) A test fit... The pictures really don't do it justice. It seems much nicer in person. I'm liking it, so far. Finishing the ends may be one of the more challenging aspects. Got a couple different ideas I'm kicking around. Edited May 26, 2009 by RTz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted May 25, 2009 Author Administrators Share Posted May 25, 2009 (edited) While Bart has been fun, quite honestly, it doesn't 'drive' all that civilly. The rear of the car is squirmish and unpredictable. The 37 year old bushings aren't helping much. The front, despite the new BJ’s and poly bushings, is darty and unstable. I’ve tried various adjustment's with some results, but it's so far from where I want to be, I've resigned myself to a clean slate... sort of. BRAAP and I have been talking about swapping in the front end of an E30 BMW. We finally got around to meeting up at a JY and taking some inital measurments. Comparing the BMW layout to the 510’s structure (and SR), it was looking doable enough to take the next step, acquiring the mock-up parts. Back to the yard we went and pillaged an E30. A nearby friend donated a wagon to the cause (thanks Aaron!). Vice-griping the crossmember in rough position confirmed that this swap is close enough to take seriously. Crossmember & front view... Steering shaft is looking yummy... The more challenging aspects are looking to be strut tower rework and capturing the rear inboard pick-up's (lollipop's for the BMW familiar). Approximate postition of the upper strut mount, netting 1.5 deg. neg. static camber and 9 degrees caster... Lollipop area... Installed in this oreintation, the geometry is very close to the original BMW E30 spec, with a bit more static camber/caster added. And the frosting?... it's looking like this contraption will fit very comfortably into the pocket between the SR's sump and bellhousing. There is one facet of this that I would like to see work out better. Track width. The BMW suspension, when used with as high a backspace wheel that will clear the strut (with 15x7 wheels), is about 2 3/4†wider (overall) than what I would like. I decided I would rather run flares than compromise the geometry (with a narrowed crossmember). I’m leaning towards ZG flares, like Anthony (Supra510) has done with his wagon... On the bright side, the 1st Gen. Miata's rear double-A arm suspension is only about a 1/2" wider than the E30 front, and the wheel bolt pattern is identical... 4x100. Hmmmmm. Edited May 26, 2009 by RTz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted July 1, 2009 Author Administrators Share Posted July 1, 2009 (edited) Progress! Crossmember and motor mounts welded in... Old lollipop... Revised lollipop... Boss extends through framerail and welded top and bottom... Steering shaft is also complete. Gotta mount the BMW pump, re-work the strut towers, and 68.5 small items. Edited July 1, 2009 by RTz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted July 4, 2009 Author Administrators Share Posted July 4, 2009 (edited) BMW pumps are everywhere, fairly affordable and, obviously, compatible with the BMW rack. Hence, I adapted the Bimmer pump instead of sourcing a Nissan pump... The drive pulley is 280zx, pump pulley is Audi 100, and the adjuster is a 280Z alternator adjuster. The mount is homebuilt billet aluminum. Edited July 4, 2009 by RTz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted July 11, 2009 Author Administrators Share Posted July 11, 2009 Drivers side strut tower roughed in... Apron and tower are 18ga, top plate 10ga, and gussets 16ga. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted July 13, 2009 Author Administrators Share Posted July 13, 2009 (edited) Every so often, I take a stab at bodywork, and I always come to the same two conclusions... I'm no good at it, and I don't enjoy it. I'm done fussing with it... it's 'race car perfect' One down, one to go... Stock vs. not... Edited July 13, 2009 by RTz 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted July 22, 2009 Author Administrators Share Posted July 22, 2009 (edited) Since I'm being brow beat by BRAAP (because he's a picture slut) about my lack of updates... Sealed/undercoated inner fenders... Engine bay painted and ready for SR (w/E36 M3 Rack).... SR reunited (this time with Nissan fluid filled mounts)... High pressure line for power steering, modified by Oil Filter Services in Portland. Datsun-to-BMW SS DOT approved brake lines, also by Oil Filter Services. All the challenging items are officially crossed off. Still have to finish plumbing/electrical, section/install coil-overs, alignments, fluids, etc. I don't expect to have it ready for this weekend's annual camp-in, but it shouldn't be long after. Edited July 23, 2009 by RTz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted July 29, 2009 Author Administrators Share Posted July 29, 2009 (edited) Bart went for his first drive with the new front suspension... twisty back-roads for about 20 miles or so. The first thing that hits you, of course, is the steering effort. The power assist makes for effortless steering even in maximum G corners. Steering feel is light years more advanced. The sensation of steering the wheels with giant rubber bands is GONE (although on center feel isn't as crisp as I had expected). Steering is also substantially quicker and the car has a noticeably tighter turning radius. Is there more grip? Tons more. Even with overly stiff front springs, the car rotates almost nasty like... but in a good way Is the darty-ness gone? I *think* so. I haven't driven it on my regular highway's yet, but looking good so far. The BMW front calipers are a small caveat. They're not as compatible with the master cyl. as I had hoped (master too small). A minor fix. I probably wont mess with it until the rear suspension is sorted. The most disappointing change has been the fluid filled motor mounts. They remove a slight amount of vibration and noise, but now the motor moves all over the place, and I mean to the tune of an INCH of vertical movement. I can feel the wind-up and the secondary bounce of the motor on rougher roads. They are ridiculously soft. I haven't installed the hood yet and I'm a little concerned about hood clearance.... and the additional stress on the plastic radiator. I discovered a worn ball joint on reassembly, so he's parked for now. I've got a small road trip planned this weekend. Hopefully I'll have made the repair by then and can report on general road manners. P.S. Thanks to Zbuff, MONGO510, skib, and datsunscom for chipping in some elbow grease in the blistering hot weather last weekend! Edited August 3, 2009 by RTz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted August 2, 2009 Author Administrators Share Posted August 2, 2009 (edited) Replaced the BJ the following day. Took it out for a drive... and completely lost the front brake circuit. Some digging revealed the master cylinder had gone belly up (pure coincidence). Swapped in a new 15/16" MC. Fixed. It 'needed' a bigger MC, but I may have gone too far... 7/8" would probably be 'just right'. Spent about 5 1/2 hours behind the wheel, mostly highway travel... Bart is officially a two-finger car. Yeeehaaaaa! Even in the nastiest of ruts, it no longer jerks the wheel out of your hand and requires only minor steering correction. It's sensitive to driver input, but no longer bullied by road irregularities. Just right for a 'sport car' It does have a somewhat numb on-center feel, but I have a couple idea's for that. The front pads need to be replaced with something aggressive to help with brake bias (and decrease pedal effort). And the soft motor mounts are causing a couple of contact points. A bit more fiddling and I think it will all come together nicely. Edited August 3, 2009 by RTz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted August 22, 2009 Author Administrators Share Posted August 22, 2009 (edited) Replaced the motor mounts with S30 parts and aluminum spacers. Not a permanent fix but they'll do until I find something that tickles me. In the meantime, the car drives MUCH better. From an NVH perspective, the only time they're noticeable is at idle. A little more of a resonant growl, but nothing I'm not happy to live with. The more I drive the car, the more I'm liking the front end, and the more I'm disliking the rear. I'll be parking Bart before long... time to start making some decisions. A few months back, a friend donated the back half of a Dime. Tipped up, it's in the perfect position for head scratching... Neal (the gent that I bought the SR from) had a 1st Gen. MX5 rear suspension sitting on his garage floor and offered to let me put a tape on it... These two are a little akward. There wasn't room to get 'straight on' pictures, but I think you'll get the idea... A couple misc. pictures... I've been interested in this suspension for a few reasons... Common/affordable Successful track history with DD friendly-ness Adjustable Tough enough for V8 applications Track width proportionate to the BMW front suspension Same wheel bolt pattern as the BMW front suspension Adequate disc brakes with upgrades readily available Factory available LSD's (both Viscous and Torsen) with complimentary diff ratios. Self-contained subframe construction BUT... at a glance, it's not looking like it will fit without some fairly invasive modifications to the Dime. I'll sleep on it and take another look this weekend. Edited August 22, 2009 by RTz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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