zedman240 Posted September 8, 2009 Share Posted September 8, 2009 Just about finished installing the V500 onto my L24 after the system was running with an RB25DE and ITB's and now trying to start the engine, sounds like the timing is waaay out. I thought the CAS from a RB engine and a distributor from a 83 ZXT would be just as easy as a re-wire but I'm wrong! While cranking, sounds as if the timing is way too advanced; pops / farts and cannon sounds as the fuel is burned in the exhaust and that's as far as it's gone. Can't take the zed anywhere as it's still on jackstands waiting for tyres! Just wondering if anyone is running a similar setup to mine and can email me a fuel/ign map to try. I will have to modify some parameters but it will be a good starting point. Running ITB's, 83ZXT distributor, wasted spark coil pack (3 coils). Appreciate any help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hughdogz Posted September 8, 2009 Share Posted September 8, 2009 Hi Zedman, 1) Have you verified ignition timing of cylinder #1 at TDC with the ignition lock ON? 2) Have your tried re-sequencing the ignition? (clocking the distributor electronically) Instead of going 1-5-3-6-2-4. try 6-2-4-1-5-3, etc. Cheers, -hughdogz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted September 8, 2009 Administrators Share Posted September 8, 2009 Do these things, in this EXACT order... 1) Verify timing. 2) Verify timing. 3) Verify timing. 4) Let us know what you find. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zedman240 Posted September 9, 2009 Author Share Posted September 9, 2009 Thanks for the help and you were right! I locked the ignition to 10' and rotated the distributor till it could start and run (barely). Took a pic of where the distributor ended up before it could idle. Didn't want to run it for too long as the neighbours wouldn't appreciate a zed running with only headers and no exhaust. When I have the next chance, I'll hook up a timing light and see where it's at and compare to the ECU timing. Another thing, found a write up on installing the Wolf on the zed, and was told not to use the pin 30 but pin 28. When I do that,there is no signal. Using pin 30 which works for some reason? I'll post a video on youtube when it's running later. Second pic is how it looks now. previous one was during assembly. Thanks again! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted September 9, 2009 Administrators Share Posted September 9, 2009 Thanks for the help and you were right! I locked the ignition to 10' and rotated the distributor till it could start and run (barely). Took a pic of where the distributor ended up before it could idle. Looks like you'll need to adjust Ref Degrees BTDC... Drop that number down until your timing light shows 10 degrees. I wouldn't go any lower than about 55 or 60 on a stock compression/street driven motor. If you cant get all the way 'there', you'll need to re-sequence your ignition, as Hugh mentioned. Another thing, found a write up on installing the Wolf on the zed, and was told not to use the pin 30 but pin 28. When I do that,there is no signal. Using pin 30 which works for some reason? You should be using Pin 28. I'm *guessing* the previous configuration was using both the hi-res and low-res channels of the CAS. If so, that needs to be corrected. You're using only the low-res channel, correct? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zedman240 Posted September 9, 2009 Author Share Posted September 9, 2009 You should be using Pin 28. I'm *guessing* the previous configuration was using both the hi-res and low-res channels of the CAS. If so, that needs to be corrected. You're using only the low-res channel, correct? The V500 has been set up to use a CAS from an RB25 using all four wires plugged into it when the RB was installed. I thought they were virtually the same sensor as the L28ET dist so I thought just had to re-wire and that should be fine. But things don't always work out so easy as you like! I'm assuming it's only using the low res input but I'm trying to find where you can setup the high res input in the Wolf software.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted September 9, 2009 Administrators Share Posted September 9, 2009 The V500 has been set up to use a CAS from an RB25 using all four wires plugged into it when the RB was installed. Most likely using a plug in adapter. Way different config for that. I thought they were virtually the same sensor as the L28ET Very similar, yes. I see you (or somebody) added a sync hole on the 280zx CAS. Is that how it was installed on the RB? If not, the config is wrong. I'm assuming it's only using the low res input but I'm trying to find where you can setup the high res input in the Wolf software.. Don't. It won't gain you anything. The low-res will work well for you, as long as it's set up correctly. Email me your map, and I'll have a look. PM with email addy on the way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zedman240 Posted September 10, 2009 Author Share Posted September 10, 2009 With the CAS sensor for the RB engine, I opened it up and drilled the hole into the trigger disc and never used an adapter. It happened to be the one that couldn't be stripped entirely so the hole had to be drilled with the disc still in the sensor! Yes, I had a friend help with the mods to both sensors but in the previous pic, the distributor isn't at the #1 TDC location. I'm thinking now I may have installed the distributor drive spindle slightly out. I changed it to the slpined shaft when I had the engine out. I made sure I lined up the pin punch on the shaft and oil pump housing marks.. With the high res input, as you said, I won't bother. I'll leave it as it is. I'll email the map when i get home; I pass the time at work on the forums! hahaha. Thanks again RTz. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted September 10, 2009 Administrators Share Posted September 10, 2009 I'm thinking now I may have installed the distributor drive spindle slightly out. Wolf doesn't care where the 'sync pulse' is relative to cylinder one. It can all be handled via the software. Just sequence the coils accordingly and the result is the same. The only real downside is when you disassemble things, you must get it back on the same spline or your timing will be off. On the other hand, if you start off with quill shaft clocked 'correctly', it makes it easier when it comes time for reassembly. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zedman240 Posted September 12, 2009 Author Share Posted September 12, 2009 Been playing with the zed again over the weekend, and thought about the sync hole I drilled into the trigger disk and if it is in the right location. I posted a pic before but I can show it again. Looked at others in the Wolf thread and mine looks like it's 60' out. If anyone has the same distributor with the Wolf and the hole in the same spot, I would love to know the REF BTDC degrees! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted September 27, 2009 Administrators Share Posted September 27, 2009 Posts deleted. Guy's I woke up in the middle of the night and realized what we've been doing is wrong for wasted spark. We've all made mistakes, and I'm the guiltiest party. zedman, I'm heading out the door for the day. I'll try to 'fix' this mess when I get back. It will be much easier for you to grasp whats happening, so hang tight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted September 28, 2009 Administrators Share Posted September 28, 2009 I made a sticky, using your situation as an example... http://forums.hybridz.org/showthread.php?p=1073457#post1073457 If I need to clarify anything, please ask in that thread. If you have a question about your specific circumstance, keep it in this thread. A combination of Wolf's ambiguous terminology, the information given, and having my head up my butt, caused me to get ahead of myself. Please accept my apology for steering you wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktm Posted September 28, 2009 Share Posted September 28, 2009 Doh, I read the sticky and see where I was off-base. I had the ignition sequence correct for channels 1 through 3, but like Ron completely zoned on the batch sequence. Of course channels 4 through 6 are unused and the pulse skip is critical as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zedman240 Posted September 28, 2009 Author Share Posted September 28, 2009 When I originally had the RB25DE installed, I had Wolf themselves wire up and tune the ECU. I'm confused now after reading the sticky, they setup the ECU to use 6 ignition outputs whereas I'm only using 3..Should the other 4-6 have the value of 255 to be turned off or left as they are? Don't worry about any appologies..Thanks.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted September 28, 2009 Administrators Share Posted September 28, 2009 When I originally had the RB25DE installed, I had Wolf themselves wire up and tune the ECU. I'm confused now after reading the sticky, they setup the ECU to use 6 ignition outputs whereas I'm only using 3..Should the other 4-6 have the value of 255 to be turned off or left as they are? Ahhh.... I think I see what's happening. Are you saying Wolf wired 6 coils, on 6 channels and now you've re-wired for three coils on 3 channels? If the answer is yes, you need to configure per the sticky I posted. If not, please clarify. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktm Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 Not only must the sequencing be changed but the pulse skip must also be changed. It is just as important as the sequencing. If Wolf setup the RB to be fully sequential, then the pulse skips will be 5. You need to change them to 2 as shown in the sticky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zedman240 Posted September 29, 2009 Author Share Posted September 29, 2009 They wired up the current setup I have with the 3 wasted spark coils. They used the 6 outputs to control 3 coils? maybe that's what's confusing the #$% out of me...All I have done is removed the RB and installed the L24 with the L28ET distributor instead of the RB CAS and have kept the 3 coil packs and 3 chanel ignitor. Let me know if I'm missing out any imoprtant details that you need to know..I may be making it harder than what it is. I think you all deserve a medal for all of this after were done... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktm Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 Not only you but us as well! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted September 29, 2009 Administrators Share Posted September 29, 2009 They wired up the current setup I have with the 3 wasted spark coils. They used the 6 outputs to control 3 coils? Are you absolutely certain of this? I can only postulate a couple of very obscure reasons to do it that way. PM me with the who you've talked to at Wolf, you're name, when the work was done, and any other identifying info and I'll give them a jingle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktm Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 I am sure that you've sent Ron your file, but could I take a look as well? My email is zadig_san@hotmail.com Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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