[Vette Powered]

I've got a 1972 240Z that's got no rust and is about 80% straight.(dents etc.) I'm trying to get an idea on how much it's going to cost to get a nice "drivers" paint job. I'm looking to get the car all straighted up and some nice paint on her. I've been to a few different places and have gotten quotes from $2000-$10000! I'm not looking for a show car but something that looks really nice. Anyone have any examples or thoughts to what this should cost?

[240zBoy]

Another option is try posting an add on craigslist for someone that has their own booth and experience. Tell them to send you previous work pictures. With this you can supply them with the certain paint brand you might want like dupont or whatever. Be sure to buy a quality primer. With your price range you will have no problem in getting it done (especially with economy) but you will have to do all the body work yourself before bringing it to someone most likely.

If you want to bring it somewhere definately do the body work yourself or else you will get rediculously high quotes almost 100% of the time and you will end up saving a bunch of money. Why spend 5k on a street paintjob is how I see it.

You can even try maaco but it varies on who is actually spraying the car's for a quality job and try to supply your own paint. I have heard of people being able to do that. and being right over a grand.

Just my opinion hope that helps. I had been researching to.lol

[piston]

i can say its going to cost alot of money unless your rich and don't mind spending the bigger bucks. it takes time to get it straight and smooth. its not just the paint that sucks up your wallet, its labor and hours of labor i should add to do the body work even a small ding on a hard to shape panel. that's where most of the money kicks in. if you do the body work yourself and have a shop paint it, it can cost anywhere from $1000-$3000 depending on paint quality and stages and door jams etc... all painted. besides that a single stage decent roll around paint job outside body only runs in the 600.00 range with decent tape masking and 200.00 if they paint your tires, grills and muffler along with it! lol but true.

[mr jdm]

Whater you do, do NOT go to maaco. Period.

And dont use a single stage paint.

[palosfv3]

I posted this on another paint thread . This should answer most questions.


January 26th, 2009, 09:39 AM #8 palosfv3



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Its interesting to listen to opinions of what a paint job should cost. The comments reflect personal standards , financial affordability, knowledge variables. Now add into the mix condition of the car, color , and region and you get some complicated data to sort out.



Lets look at some basics that should be considered.



Time study guides (flat rate book ) .There are posted times to paint each panel on a Z. These times are based on painting a new undamaged panel and are a good reference point to start from. If you had a new replacement fender for your car the book states it should take 2.5 hours to prepare and refinish the exterior of the panel and .5 hours to paint the inner edges. All panels of the car have a time assigned to them. Hood exterior (2.6 ) Door w/jamb (3.3) ect. There are corrections allocated for overlap and ad ons for getting exterior panels to the condition of a new part. Once the total time has been calculated industry standards apply a dollar amount per paint labor hour for materials and color. Flat rate time for painting all new condition panels is around 35 hours. This time also reflects a car that is apart and requires no masking. It doesnt include the engine compartment or other interior areas. Now add the time to remove the old finish , Many believe this is not necessary . This statement only shows ones inexpierience of the correct process. Any finish over 10 years old should be stripped. You're only throwing away good money and will jeopordize the lifespan of the new paint. Figure about $900.00 to $1200.00 to media blast the body. Be aware that this will not emove any rust.



Paint and material costs will vary depending on several things. Basecoat/clearcoat paints are more costly than single stage enamels. Reds are more expensive than whites and black. Pearls and tricoats are most costly than metallics. Good automotive paints ( DuPont, Sikkens , ect.) are significantly more costly than fleet paints ( Nason, Matrix. ect.).


We have seen reds and orange pearls on standard late model colors at $500.00 plus for a gallon of basecoat. Yes , many will complain that that is just way to expensive but that is the going rate , if that is the color you want.



I'm not going into what the body work would cost to restore each panel to new condition as that could take a long time to explain but plan at least 1/2 to 3/4 of the cost of painting minimum.



Quick recap



Refinish exterior panels 35 hours @ $$$.$$ per hour


Rates can vary from region to region ( $45.00 to $ 95.00)


Add labor for Clearcoat 10 hours @ $$$.$$ per hour


Paint Materials $25.00 to $40.00 )per paint labor hour .


Additional Clearcoat materials same as above.


Color sand and buff can vary depending on desired finish . Figure between 12 to 20 hours @ $$$.$$ per hour.



A quick add of the numbers runs a range of around $3500.00 for a quicky paint to about $9200.00 on the other side. This upper figure doesnt represent a show finish where the entire car would be water sanded with #1000 paper and recleared and buffed a second time to get an orange peel free finish.



If your talented , have a work area available for an extended time and have lots of time on your hands, you can do this yourself and limit your expenses to basically material costs and your time but you wont get a quality professional job for $3000.00.



Best Regards


__________________


Larry



http://picasaweb.google.com/wgmauto



http://www.wgmauto.com/

[piston]

10 hours to clear coat? took me only 5-10 mins to lay down clear on one panel!

[z-ya]

piston said:

10 hours to clear coat? took me only 5-10 mins to lay down clear on one panel!

Exactly, once you do all the prep for the color coat, then once the color flashes for 30 min or so, tack cloth it and spray the clear.

[palosfv3]

Refinish Procedure





Clear Coat/Two Stage Refinish


First major panel or soft bumper/fascia cover:
Add .4 per refinish hour (40%), then add .4 per refinish hour for jamb, jamb and interior, edge panel, and/or underside (when necessary).

Additional panel(s) and/or other refinish area(s):
Deduct overlap (if applicable); add .2 per refinish hour (20%), then add .2 per refinish hour for jamb, jamb and interior, edge panel, and/or underside (when necessary).
Included Operations
Included Operations
• Mix material
• Clean and tack surface
• Apply material
• Clean equipment
nnnnnnnnnnnnn NOTE: Some OEMs now utilize a matte clear coat on non-exterior colors applied to undersides, edges, and/or jambs.
• Clean and tack surface
• Apply material
nnnnnnnnnnnnn NOTE: For NEW, UNDAMAGED PARTS, a total of no more than 2.5 hours should be necessary to perform the four Clear Coat Refinish Included Operations listed above. This calculation DOES NOT APPLY to bumper covers, ground effects, special package equipment, interior edges, jambs, entryways, undersides and additional time that may be required for repaired and/or used panels. It DOES NOT APPLY to complete vehicle refinish. It is not intended to determine the quantity or cost of materials required for the application of clear.




Collision Estimating Guide (P-Pages) © 2008 Mitchell International, Inc. All Rights Reserved

Three Stage Refinish


First major panel or soft bumper/fascia cover:
Add .7 per refinish hour (70%), after time has been added for jamb, jamb and interior, edge panel, and/or underside (when necessary).

Additional panel(s) and/or other refinish area(s):
Deduct overlap (if applicable); add .4 per refinish hour (40%), after time has been added for jamb, jamb and interior, edge panel, and/or underside (when necessary).
Included Operations
Included Operations
• Mix pearl/mica toner
• Apply toner to test panel
• Mix clear
• Clean and tack surface
• Apply clear to test panel
• Repeat application to surface being refinished
• Clean equipment
• Apply pearl/mica toner
• Clean and tack surface
• Apply clear
nnnnnnnnnnnnn NOTE: With three stage paints, it may be necessary to blend into larger areas of adjacent panels or complete sides of vehicles, otherwise known as zone painting.
nnnnnnnnnnnnn NOTE: Some OEMs now utilize a matte clear coat on non-exterior colors applied to undersides, edges, and/or jambs.


These are the pages that apply to a C/C or tri coat clear application. The number for the CC aplication is an approximation of the calculation that would be derived from the formula. This number should be used a guide and is not gospel but in some circumstances could be realistic , especially with tri coat colors. While the CC page talks of limits of CC to 2.5 units, jambs and interior areas are not included and need to calculated separately.It also states 2.5 units is not applicable to complete or overall refinishes. CC aplications also need to take into consideration if the car is being painted assembled or apart.

To mix a cup of clear, properly clean the spray gun ,clean the work area and put the unused items away will take at least 15 to 30 mins. How could anyone mix and apply 2 to 3 coats of clear ( approximately 6 to 7cups of mixed clear materials) , with the proper flash times, to a complete car in 15 minutes .

[Vette Powered]

Cool! Lots of help here guys! I'm thinking $5000-$7000 would get what I'm looking for.

[datsun723]

Vette Powered said:

Cool! Lots of help here guys! I'm thinking $5000-$7000 would get what I'm looking for.

If that is your Z in your avatar, the orange one, your paint is already better than mine

[MAG58]

The majority of my budget for the rebuild was tied up in body work. Doing it all, probably there is 1200 in it. There are some definite defects (two pinhole size craters that I know of) but it does well for a daily driven car.

[piston]

well, if you got 5-7k to spend. you dont have to worry my friend.

also on the 20hrs clear coat process. i mentioned it takes 10-15mins to lay down one side panel off one coat or depends on clear products. not whole car. it still doesnt take a whole day to clear your car trust me on this. pros lay it down in 1-2 hours total with 15 min flash time between and heated booth for faster dry. time is prep! whats ther to prep after base coat? tac rag wipe and spray, clean gun, wipe and spray. materials, acetone and towels. whats else is there? actual labor to SPRAY is 10-15min max per panel on one coat. x's that by 3 and 30 minsx3 between each clean up and =20hours?

This post has been edited by piston: 04 November 2009 - 11:58 AM
Reason for edit: edit

[palosfv3]

How did ten hours become twenty?

[doohopark]

the posted times for labor hours just is not for actually shooting the clear. It includes all the prep time. Sanding, just scuffing can take up to 2 hours on a entire car, a good block can take days. then there is masking time also the materials involved in masking. Like my shop, our masking paper runs anywhere from 40-80 dollars a roll, good masking tape is 3 dollars a roll. You figure in average of 100 yards of tape and 30-60 feet of paper and it eats at the cost of labor pretty quick. Actually most shop will tell you the labor times in those estimating system is hookie.

[Vette Powered]

For me it's just easier to work overtime than do the work myself for now.

[piston]

oops, typo, mistype been reading too much. i mean 10 hrs. lol don't get me wrong but the above shows 10 hrs clearcoat @ $$$per hour. i read it as 10 hours to lay down clear is what it looks like. masking should only be from the first masking when preparing for base. it shouldnt be included in the clearing process. ther is no remasking or anything after base, as far as i know, tac rag it then clear leaving old masking material. am i reading this wrong or is this on clear coating only with no base spraying? then that would make sense. because i seriously dont recall any masking and preping for clear besides like what i mentioned above.

[doohopark]

yes you are right, don't need to re-mask to clear. Oh for got to mention most clear times are capped at a certain point and the P-pages are not relevant to complete paint jobs.Soo all those things at the top are not relevant when talking about full paint jobs. I think it mentions it either at the beginning or the end of the paint calculations in the book.

[palosfv3]

Please reread the P page info posted. It explains the what is and is not included. Is 10 hours heavy for an exterior refinish ? Depends on whats being cleared and the formula . Are you CC the inner fender aprons , the underside of the hood, core support. cowl , hinge pillars, hatch jambs , ect. 10 maybe heavy for an exterior CC of a Z, but you will spend at the least 4 to 5 hours. Heated booths do not affect flash times unless outside air temps are below 60 degrees. Flash times will depend on the reducer / activator used. When refinishing a complete you will want to use a slower speed reducer / activator ,so that the paint flows out nicer ( less orange peel ) and minimizes solvent entrapment.

All in all you can debate the issue as much as you like to , its a matter of what you want for a finished product and how long you want it to last.

[piston]

its cool...were all cool here, i was just saying. heated booth doesnt effect dry times? never knew that. reducing too much will only cause you to move faster. whats outside temperature have anything to do with it when the booth has a set temp with car inside booth with closed doors? might be kinda stupid but im still learning also!

i also did a valve cover job the other day, took me 20mins and got paid for 2 hrs. sounds pretty good if you ask me. j/k.

This post has been edited by piston: 05 November 2009 - 04:56 PM
Reason for edit: edit