Nigel
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Posts posted by Nigel
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nigel, By any chance, do you or your friends have a 16" watanabe wheel that you can test fit?
Shane was the only person who responded to my request for a 16†rim to test fit.
Regardless, I provided the caliper clearance measurements so people could check their own wheels and not have to guess if a wheel was going to fit. Just measure the ID of your wheel at the hub depth and the offset from the hub face to the spokes and compare that to the numbers I provided. It’s not hard to do. I can provide more detailed instructions if you’re not certain how to measure properly?
I was considering trying to come up with a mock-up of some sort that people could print out and glue to some card stock. Perhaps I’ll have some time over the holidays.
Nigel
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Shane, an Ontario Z Car club member, dropped by my place on Saturday to test fit his 16"x8.25" XXR 530 wheel. It easily cleared the aluminum bodied Jag caliper with the Mustang 11.8" rotor. It even cleared the wheel weights he has taped to the inside of the rim. We also tried it with the Jag caliper and the 12.2" two piece rotor. Much to my surprise, the wheel cleared that too. But it was a really tight fit. It looked like there was only about 1 to 2 mm of clearance to the wheel ID. Also, I don't have the right style lug nuts for those wheels, so the wheel was just sitting loose on the studs. Hard to say if the wheel would still fit when it was bolted down.Based on what I've seen, I suspect that some 15" rims would likely fit with the lower profile Lincoln LS caliper. But the bottom line is that you should measure your wheel first to see what will fit, since every wheel is formed differently. I published a list of profile dimensions for the various caliper and rotor options here (http://forums.hybridz.org/topic/113199-yet-another-rear-drum-to-disk-conversion-option/?do=findComment&comment=1062201) that you can check against.Nigel
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I've had an NRG slim quick release installed for more than a couple of years now. No issues with it. It still feels tight. I love being able to pop the wheel off when I'm working under the dash (seems to happen more than I would have guessed
). I had to make a 1/8" spacer ring to go between it and my Momo hub adapter though. The release ring was dragging on the rubber boot of the Momo adapter, making it hard to turn.Nigel
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1. 280zcar (w/ centering ring)
2. takayuki (w/ centering ring)
3. KyleG (w/ centering ring)
4. Ryan Merrill (w/ centering ring)
5. calpoly-z (w/ centering ring)
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7.
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10.
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BTW, it looks like someone may be dropping by my place on Saturday to test fit a 16" XXR rim with the jag aluminum caliper. I'll let you all know how that goes asap.
Nigel
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I'm pretty sure the $125 apiece included the core charge. Granted these are remanufactured calipers, but rock auto has the A1 Cardone for $61.79 + $65 core for each.
For my car, I'm fine with the cheaper parts. The car is not raced and only driven in the streets occasionally. I'm really only after rear disk brakes for the looks and ease of maintenance.
I would probably be fine with a 240sx set up but don't see much point in deliberately screwing up brake bias when you're set up will cost about the same. Seems like win-win to me.
I misinterpreted what you wrote as meaning that it was $125/caliper + $65 core. $125 INCLUDING core is a great price!
With my kit, you have greater flexibility with what you run up front. You can upgrade the fronts down the road if you desire, and at the most, only change the rear brake pads and adjust the proportioning valve to suit.
Nigel
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I went ahead and priced out the required parts to complete this kit assuming all parts are purchased from Rock Auto. I did not always choose the cheapest options so a few bucks could be shaved from the total.
Rotors - $18 apiece
Lincoln calipers -$125 apiece with $65 core charge each
Pads - $10 - $60 depending on material and brand
Hardware kit - $8
Altogether you will be looking at about another $325 plus shipping if you can't find cheap cores locally. Or $130 less if you can.
Overall it looks like a great setup with reasonably cheap, available parts!
Count me in for a set! With centering rings please.
Not that I want to discourage you, but ~$325 is what you would spend if you can find cores for free to send in. Otherwise, it'll be $130 more without cores ($190/caliper) from Rock Auto. I'm pretty sure that I've seen better pricing on the calipers, including the core charge, through other sources though. So you might want to investigate that further.
My target price range was $800 to $900 total with high quality (expensive) rotors and pads. Even so, I don't think you can find a kit of this caliber for less. If you're satisfied with less expensive parts, you can save yourself some extra money. I leave that decision up to you
Nigel
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Thanks. Would that be the Aluminum Jag caliper on there?
Those are the steel Lincoln calipers. The Jag calipers might fit in a 16" rim. I'll ask around locally and see if someone has one to try out.
Nigel
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Those sizes were chosen specifically to fit with the stock suspension. Search for the Rota group buy and you can read the whole history.
Nigel
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Its hard to find answers on this but i want wilwood brakes but i still want my parking brake to work.......datsun parts sells a rear kit that allows the stock emergency brake to work ....but you have to extend the emergency brake lines by 2 inches ....anybody know how this is accomplished?
There's another rear brake kit option that includes a brand new, high quality custom parking brake cable:
http://forums.hybridz.org/topic/113199-yet-another-rear-drum-to-disk-conversion-option/
Nigel
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Also, would you mind clarifying the parts us buyers would need to supply? I see the calipers are 2004 Lincoln LS (rears I assume), but rear Lincoln LS rotors appear to be 288mm. What 300mm rotors has this been designed to work with?
Thanks again
You'll want a 2008 4.6L Mustang GT rear rotor:
2008 4.6L Mustang GT rear brake pads. Choose friction level based on front brakes. I can make recomendations:
2004 Lincoln LS rear calipers if you need the lowest profile:
or 2004 Jaguar Vanden Plas rear calipers if you have the room and want a lighter, aluminum body caliper:
2004 Lincoln LS rear brake hardware kit:
For those interested in the two piece rotor option, you'd want Wilwood rotor part #160-0277:
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1. 280zcar (w/ centering ring)
2. takayuki (w/ centering ring)
3. KyleG (w/ centering ring)
4. Ryan Merrill (w/ centering ring)
5.
6.
7.
8.
9.
10.
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Glad to hear it went together well for you Ian! I gather cable and hose lengths are adequate? Is the parking brake handle travel to your liking? I know you were concerned about that.
I finally found some time to do a test fit of the 2 piece rotor setup. It looks like I got all of my measurements right. Everything went together perfectly.
(I need to paint those brackets!)
The caliper just clears the ID of my 17" Rota wheels. Lots of room to the spokes though...
Nigel
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I might be able to do an 11.5†(292mm) rotor, but I have my doubts that I can make it work without a significant rethink of my bracket design. I likely wouldn't be able to keep the bracket as two separate pieces, which would drive up the cost.
Regardless, I’m still having a heck of a time trying to find time to do a test fit of the two piece rotor option. Maybe this weekend, but I’ve already made the rest of you who only want the one piece rotor wait too long.
So, how about getting a group buy going on the OEM one piece rotor option as a start? As soon as I get 10 committed people for the OEM rotor option kit, I’ll do a production run. As per hybridz rules, no money required up front.
Price: $325+shipping for the first 10 people. $350+shipping after that.
Includes: Caliper mounting brackets, parking brake cable, DOT SS brake hoses, and all fasteners.
Not included: Calipers, rotors, brake pads, caliper hardware
Optional: Rotor centering ring: $10 for the first 10 people. $15 after that.
If you want the two piece rotor option, let me know as well. I’m going to try to do a test fit of the prototype this weekend if I don’t have to work, but I’ve only had one day off in the last 3 weeks and may not want to spend time in the garage. I'll have to go back through my notes, but IIRC, the brake hats were going to add ~$150 to the cost.
Nigel
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My replacement shock arrived this week so I should be able to finish off my rear suspension, brake and cv shaft setup late this week or early next week. I'll get some photos to you once I can of the setup fitted. I'll only be home for about two days now for the rest of the year and I don't drive my car in winter but I'm hoping to have it out again in February so I'll get a review to you then, sorry its a lot later than I had originally planned.
Interesting what you say about pads, I've only got cheap pads in at the moment, look like I may have to change them to better ones, possibly Hawk HP+ to match the pads in the front.
Do both Lincoln LS and Mustang GT pads fit equally as well?
I really want some independent feedback on the installation so I can be sure I haven't missed anything before doing a production run. Hopefully you can get to it sooner rather than later.
The Jag/Lincoln pads are slightly different than the Mustang GT pads. I designed the caliper positioning using Mustang GT pads, since there is a better selection of those. That's not to say Jag/Lincoln pads won't work, but I haven't specifically tested them to see if they still end up in the right location on the rotor.
Nigel
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Where are you in Toronto? I would love to come by and check this out. Is the bolt pattern a 114.3x5?
I'm in Brampton, just north of the airport. You're more than welcome to come by and check things out in person. PM me if you're interested.
If you have 114.3x5, then you can use the OEM rotor without modifications. 114.3x4 requires drilling new holes in the OEM rotor, or going with the 2 piece rotor option.
Nigel
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Hey Guys!
I haven't given up on this. I've just run into a delay with the two piece brake rotor option, and I really wanted to offer both it and the OEM 1 piece rotor option at the same time. I've had the prototype hats and Wilwood 12.2" rotors sitting on a shelf for a couple of months now. But in that time, my Z has been plagued with a seemly never ending series of issues, which I've had to fix first. The water pump went, then the rear transmission seal, followed by the alternator. While I was repairing those things, a terrible misfire under load showed up out of the blue that I've yet to be able to solve. So my Z is more or less undriveable at the moment. In the mean time, my garage is now out of commission while I have a new floor installed, so I've had to put any work on the Z on hold.
However! Before my Z decided it was going to be so uncooperative, I was able to put >1500 miles on my rear brake setup with the OEM rotors, including a trip to the New Hampshire Speedway for the track day during the convention. I'm happy to report that they performed flawlessly! The cables and brake hoses don't rub, pinch or bind anywhere. The parking brake actuation is tight and doesn't require excessive travel of the handle. I now have the TTT rear control arms, and I was able to find a perfect mounting point for the parking brake cable clamp. So, this setup will work for sure with the TTT and OEM control arms. I suspect they'll work just as well with other control arm options though.
For some actual quantitative performance numbers, I downloaded the Trackmaster app for my phone and did some G force measurements under braking. This is where things really get interesting. I have the AZC Wilwood front brake kit, with Wilwood street pads, and I did some brake tests with EE friction rated pads in the rear on the 11.8" one piece rotors. Even with full rear line pressure, I couldn't get the rear brakes to lock up, and I was only seeing about 0.75G's under deceleration. I then switched to EBC Yellowstuff rear pads which have a GG friction rating. I immediately had to dial down pressure to the rear brakes a few turns to keep the rears from locking up first. Once I got that set up, I did some more brake force measurements, and saw brake force climb to over 1G! This verifies what I've been saying all along about having a properly balanced brake setup.
Since it's likely still going to be weeks before I can try out the two piece rotor option, I may just go ahead with production of the one piece OEM rotor version. I did sell a prototype kit to EF Ian back at the beginning of July, and I was also really hoping for some feedback from him before doing a production run. But he's run into his own delays with his project, and has yet to fit my brake kit. So that hasn't quite worked out yet.
That's where things are at the moment.
Nigel
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The efi tank (and early tanks too for that matter) has zero baffling,
This isn't exactly true. There is a divider in the middle of the tank, starting as early as 1973, and the '75/'76 EFI tanks have a coke can sized shroud around the pickup. But if you're running a high flow pump, it'll suck that dry pretty quick in a sustained hard left turn with less than half a tank of fuel.
I have a custom sump welded to the bottom of my tank. If I were doing it again though, I'd go with an in-tank solution. Then you don't have to worry about packaging extra pumps, fuel lines and an added tank. There's also potential fuel heat soak issues. I'm curious if the new Aeromotive Phantom universal in-tank setup would work in a Z...
http://aeromotiveinc.com/products-page/stealth-fuel-systems/18689-phantom-200-stealth-fuel-system/
Nigel
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Here's a picture of the inside of the front housing after the bearing had worked itself part way out:
I stopped by a local alternator repair shop and they gave me the snap-on bearing clip for free! (Thank you R&D Auto Electric in Brampton, Ontario!)
Nigel
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I put my jack under the differential, towards the back. The crossmember is a PITA to get to.
Nigel
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Update #2
I've just had a second alternator fail due to the ball bearing coming loose in the front housing! There is a snap in retainer available (part number 46-1509 in the exploded view I provided in my previous post), but neither the OEM or rebuilt CS144 alternators I've had have one. I'm going to try to get one, and hopefully salvage the alternator I have now. It's only a $2 part. I'd advise anyone doing this swap to install one.
Nigel
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There's no weight listed that I can see. I wonder if it actually weighs less than the hollow steel OEM piece?
Nigel
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I doubt 1/8" is going to make much difference, and oil is only fed from one side anyway. Based on the picture of what I ordered, the Cobra Transmission bushing only has one hole as well.
But, it doesn't appear to have the channels like yours or the OEM piece does.Edit: I just noticed that the channels are not all the way around the inner surface on yours. It was only $4 though. -
Yep, that's the one. They do have cutouts in them for the oil; and are fed via the aquaduct in the tailshaft housing that is in turn fed by the oil funnel that catches the slingoff from the 1st gearset.
Thanks for the lead. I've got a couple on order now.
Nigel
). I had to make a 1/8" spacer ring to go between it and my Momo hub adapter though. The release ring was dragging on the rubber boot of the Momo adapter, making it hard to turn.
Prefab brake lines for 240SX conversion
in Brakes, Wheels, Suspension and Chassis
Posted
http://www.classictube.com sells DOT braided brake lines in a variety of lengths with female -3 AN fittings on the ends. They also sell a variety of -3AN adapter fittings, including M10x1 female inverted flare fittings for connection to the hard line, and 10mm banjo fittings for the caliper. Pick and play...
Nigel