Z2000

Nice work truly! but why a Z? You have smog exempt at your fingertips to build something crazy fast and you choose batteries... Dont take it the wrong way, Im not knocking the project in any way but why not do this to a civic or something like that? Gas prices do suck though, and once again, Nice Work!

I got mine for $3,400 with no ecu. You must use a stand alone unless you are planning on using the oem s2000 ignition cylinder and key with the "chip". Rumor has it the stock ecu won't turn on unless the chipped key is in the ignition. Kinda crappy but not really when you have a stand alone off the bat. I will be posting pics up for sure. Probably wont get deep enough into the project for pics until after my vacation in early june.

Well... I finaly got my F20C a couple days ago. Sorry for all the hype and no action until now, I had a really slow cash poor winter but things are rolling now. "LET THE FAB BEGIN"

As soon as my RB sells I can get the f20c and the project will be underway. Its not all talk this time... I will post pics as soon as I get started.

I think it will all boil down to what engine you want to use and how heavy your foot is. sounds like your looking to go the 4cyl route and your mpg's will be more dependant on the way you driver rather then what engine it is. And usualy the more torque the less mpg's but not always. I would recomend getting an engine with variable valve timing because they have a far more mellow low rpm cam profile which will help the mpg's and the high rpm cam profile will get you the power if you rev it up. I didnt read the whole thread... are you trying to go turbo or NA? or does it even matter?

It just seems hard for me to believe those Iron v6 engines would weigh less then the aluminum 4cyl. And im not trying to say there is no lighter 4cyl then the f20c, all im saying is that no other light weight NA 4cyl that can compare in power and reliability. Perhaps some of those numbers were'nt all gathered using complete engines with tranny. maybe its just block and head numbers for some of them and complete engine numbers for others. who knows anyway.

Nice catch! my bad I meant "FF" setups.

I guess Im used to the criticism since all the v8 mustangs and comaros used to hate me and my honda years ago. They deemed 4cyl engines worthless and made a big point to let me know about it too. I got them back one by one though. Each time they talked sh*t I insisted we raced and every time they found me waving back at them in 3rd gear as I was pulling away. 4 cyl engines got a little more respect in my town after those years.

Very good point, I was considering the 350z engine for quite a while actualy. I couldnt source one for less than $7g's so that one got shot down right away. For that much money I figured I could have the f20c, cams, itb's ect. On that note hytech has designed cams to run with Hayward performance ITB's and with tuning they have gotten 290+whp on a F20C with stock bottom end. Everyone swears that you cant get more than 10 or so hp's from modding the f20c but thats BS. It all boils down to air and fuel. Exhaust upgrades dont get anymore air and fuel into the engine, it just helps get it out if the engine needs help. Many upgrade their header and exhaust but they dont realize is that the stock ones flow as much as the engine needs (in stock form), but when you use a real set of cams and Itb's your engine is using much more air and fuel. and thats when you find that 15+hp from a good header. Its all about balance, the stock f20c wont find much power at all from a header until you do some serious mods. Its kinda my long run plan to have that setup. I know thats alot of money if you look at the total price but its not that bad over a course of time if your getting what your after in the long run.

I agree! my adiction for V-TEC started about 7 years ago when I got my first ride in a civic hb with a DOHC V-TEC engine in it. It drove very well in the low rpm range even though its a low torque engine because of its high gear ratio and mellow non v-tec cam profile, but as soon as we hit the highway, the v-tec cracked and roared loud as we blistered through the gears. From that day on well tuned v-tec engine have given me chills. Now I know you guys are wondering why im not on a honda forum and the answer is because I dislike FR vehicles. Next question is why dont I have an S2000 then? thats because I live in california and there's no way I would get away with a modded S2000 here. So after doing my homework I decided that the ultimate package "for my needs" would be a smog exempt 240z with some light weight goodies and of course the F20C! And like Iv said, Im not going for a 9 second car here. I just want something that drives like a normal car around town with good miles per gallon and RIPS when i crack it into v-tec and I can do all my crazy NA mods to and not have to worry about getting in trouble for my engine setup or worry about smog. You guys are really going to hate me when you here this one... I have a RB26DETT sitting in my garage next to my Z right now but Im getting rid of it for my F20C. Plus its sooooo hard to come across RB parts and trannys these days which would lead to long lengths of down time in the future. This car needs to be reliable and if something brakes I need to be able to get parts fast to fix it. so sorry RB lovers I have to back out of my RB plan this time. Im sure many more of you would agree with this setup if you have been in a fast car with a DOHC V-TEC engine.

The car probably wont be scca spec for a while if at all. The primary build will be for mountain runs with my local crew. As for the weight... Since this is a 240 the starting platform is in the 2300 range completely stock and with the Iorn inline six. Just swappin out the iorn six for an aluminum four should drop weight down between 2150 and 2200 lb range with nothing else done. So after mods I dont see any problem achieving 2000 lbs or even hitting sub 2000 lbs for that matter. The powerband... I have driven and rode passenger in many S2000's and their powerbands have all made good power and had a very usable powerband. I could see your complaint if you were trying to race from an idle because you need to rev this engine to get to the real power, but the reality is that we race in our engines powerband no matter which engine it is or what type of racing it is. With that said, if a car falls out of powerband in a race its usualy driver error or drivetrain not being setup correctly for the type of race. I do understand where you are comming from with all of this. But the F20C is very drivable at low rpms which will be great for around town and it screams from the crack of V-TEC all the way to the 9000 rpm redline. And on the top it all off lets not forget about efective gearing. I will be running 4.44's in the rear which will net me much better torque to the ground.

The CAS should only go on one way which means it cant be wrong if its on all the way. I think you need to start with the wiring. first, check your pinout and make sure all the wires that need ground have ground and the power wires have power when the key is on, and dont forget there is one wire that needs all time power to the ecu so it can store memory, it is sometimes labeled "battery" on your pinout. Once that has been checked you should turn the key on and find out if your ecu and ignition relays are clicking on. If not then you have a wiring problem and if they are clicking on then you still might have a wiring problem or it could be something else that was overlooked. Good luck

AGREED!!! Plus it will also scavenge the wastegate a little.

first off you shouldnt be seing 12 volts on both fuel injector wires, only one should read 12 when the ignition is on and the other should read nothing until the ecu sends it a 3ish volt signal when your cranking the engine over. Note the 3 volt signal from the ecu is very short so you will need a good volt meter to catch the pulse at all. Recheck your wiring because there is a big problem if you do have 12 volts on both injector wires. Possibly a bad ecu... but lets hope not.

Yes it is going to be built for road racing/mountain runs. Was just stating that it should also be able to pull decent drag times as well. I'd call it a well rounded car. As far as the expectations, you may be right about overshooting but i have ran the numbers again and again and at first I thought there was no way. I regained some faith in the numbers when I started comparing this project to previous cars I'v built and raced. And the truth is we can debate the project and the numbers over and over again but we'll never know until I get it completed. Once again I want to thank everyone for their two cents!

I too was a honda junkie back in the day. had several of them, the first one was a 92 cx model and i started off with swapping in a b16a engine with a 7lb flywheel and that setup got me 13.4 @ 102 mph 1/4 mile slips on street tires, then i changed out the bottom end for a b18c block with type r pistons and that setup got me my first 12.9 @ 105 mph run its first track day still on street tires, then my final setup for that car was cramming in a h22 with lsd tranny and that setup got me 12.6 @ 108 mph with 1.854 60 ft on street tires and 12.3 @ 110 mph on slicks with a 1.701 60 ft time. All track days were with a ram air setup. In 2002 the baddest beast I ever built for myself (I believe I was the first) was a 89 240sx with rb26dett setup. the stock rb engine with a little boost increase got me another 12.3 @ 118 mph on street tires and no tach... if i had slicks and a functioning tach would be mid 11's easy. so even though the Z's not gong to be built for drag racing i do believe it will be capable of a snagging an 11 sec time slip with its 50 hp over my 12.3 civic setup and rwd to boot. the Z's vehicle weight should be about the same as my civic hb as well.

You may be right about it being a little harder to hit 2,000 lbs. I dont remember exaxtly, but I read somewhere that the f20c full engine, tranny, ecu, wiring harness, ect. weighs 360 lbs all together. I dont know if thats correct or not but its what i heard. I also remember reading that the l24 weighs something like 385 lbs JUST block and head alone. Correct me if these numbers are wrong. That being the case I think the car would be somewhere in the 2,150-2,200 lb range just from the engine change. Other weight saved: subie lsd r160 -15 lbs??, aftermarked cv axle kit -10 lbs EACH SIDE, panasport wheels -?? not sure but they're friggin light, carbon fiber hood -20 lbs?? aluminum drive shaft -a couple lbs, Toda flywheel -15lbs, and getting rid of those chrome bumpers. Im sure i will come up with something else that needs change but i cant remember off the top of my head. and like I said, correct me if any of these numbers are wrong.

I wasnt trying to direct that back at you in a bad way bro. I was just pointing out a couple of technical specs that come to mind so often since I'm a cylinder head porter. Plus my outlook was from the N/A point of view and thats where the flow numbers are so curcial.

Agreed, a simple fact. The s2000 is already quick for its weight and the setup im planning to run in my z would be around 2,000 lbs give or take a little. Thats like taking a thousand pounds off of a car thats alredy quick, if you catch my drift.

Really it has nothing to do with wanting to be the first. The whole point is about a setup that performs good and gives a well rounded driving experience and is streetable. I do believe it would be a waste of time and lots of money to do your h22 idea and it still wouldnt make the power of the f20c that is rwd already. Plus I have ported many H22 heads in my day and in race trim they max out at about 320 cfm @ 28" water, and the F20c is well above those numbers right out of the box. Now that tells us something about power potental right there...

AAAA!HAHA!HAHA!HAHA!HAHA! WTF! Thats the funniest thing i heard all day. I bet you he had to ride his horse to get into that truck. HAHAHAHA Like Shrek says "maybe he's compensating for something" hahaha

I agree with LamboZ and Careless! I was considering the sr20 for a lengthy amount of time but chose f20c because of reliability and N/A hp's. "Example" It seems like any turbo car at the track making 400+ whp is putting down the same times as the N/A cars with 240-270 whp. Even though turbos make huge peak numbers and make chills run down your spine, the reality is that when your going through all your gears as fast as possible the turbo cars fall off pretty hard in between shifts and the N/A cars remain extremely snappy and keep full power between shifts. As for the high rev's, honda changed up the bottom end geometry a bit with a shorter stroke and better rod ratio and bigger bore. This keeps piston speeds down even at 9,000 rpm's and the better rod ratio holds better rod angularity and gives more desirable piston dwell times at tdc and bdc. So we have an engine that rev's to 9,000 rpm's but lasts like its only going to 6,000 or 7,000.

I guess the thought of $$ price hasnt really set me back yet because Im doing all the work myself. It would cost a fortune to take this project to a shop and then i would say its defenately not worth it. Like I said, I'll make sure to save all the fab specs and list of what the parts cost in case anyone chooses to go this route. Thanks for everyones 2 cents!

Well, if the outcome of this setup proves itself a worthy swap I will be keeping the motor mount and driveshaft specs handy incase anyone else wishes to go this route.

I know, it takes good rubber and extensive suspension work. Well, my point was that lighter is better when it comes to the road course as well as just about any racing for that matter.