Meph Posted December 22, 2012 Share Posted December 22, 2012 Hey Guys, I wondering if anyone here has come across a way to run a standard nissan r200 VLSD in their S30? I ask because for the last 3 years Ive running one in my Z without even knowing it. All this time I thought it was open diff, but in reality the Z31 Turbo axles do not enguage far enough into the diff on the drivers side to engauge the VLSD mechanism. Now I got to thinkning, would I be able to take a 240sx stub axle, and CV joint and install them onto my drivers axle and differential output? Maybe I can use pathfinder axles that are shorter, if the above combo is too long ( as the z31 axles are a super tight fit to start. Has anyone done this before or will I be breaking new ground? Thanks guys heres some pictures of the parts Im talking about My diff and axles (not an actual picture) the q45 stub axles that will engage the VLSD unit, I cant find a 240sx stub pic but same idea then swap the matching CV onto the z31 axle Any thoughts or experience? It would be nice to get it working as is, vs buying a 1000 dollar clsd which I know is better! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RebekahsZ Posted December 22, 2012 Share Posted December 22, 2012 (edited) I've seen Shiro Z31 VLSD axles on ebay a few times from $175 to $400, so be sure to check there. I have a Shiro R200 VLSD complete with axles that I'd sell VERY reasonably, perhaps for less than your machine work would cost-PM me if that would help you. I want to keep it all together: diff and axles. Edited December 22, 2012 by RebekahsZ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meph Posted December 23, 2012 Author Share Posted December 23, 2012 after pulling it all apart, I've decided the easiest and cheapest option is to lengthen my passenger axle input by welding on lenth of splined donor axle. I need about 1.5 inches more spline to engage the VLSD correctly so ... cut off end of another tapered spline, but the tapers together, align and build up a nice thick weld.then grind down any of it that interferes with the the spline engagement. Ill update with pictures Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewZed Posted December 23, 2012 Share Posted December 23, 2012 I just spend some time messing around with options for something similar and talking to people about it. You'll have a stress riser right at the most critical length of the axle due to the change in material properties at the weld. Read the thread on jmortensen's shortened CV axles and you'll see how critical the heat treatment is to get the steel properties right. Sounds interesting though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meph Posted December 24, 2012 Author Share Posted December 24, 2012 (edited) I was thinkning the same thing, worst case scenario I break the weld and and get an "I told you so". The vlsd is not a very aggressive LSD and the weld would only be effected by the resistance of the VLSD cartridge and the most resistance it can generate. Just street tires, no hard launches on slicks. I'd do my best to limit the tempature to the surrounding metal to not mess with the metallic structure. Are the stub axles hardened? heated and quenched? if they are I would assume the rapid cooling of the weld would produce a similar structure if I quench it when still red hot. What I'll try first, is to get a VLSD stub axle and axle at the junk yard (hopefully) and try to combine the CV to my z31 axle, and see if it's short enough to install. If not Ill try to combine the cv's onto a pathfinder axle, and make welding a last resort till I can get my hands on the right axle. Edited December 24, 2012 by Meph Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daz Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 I've seen Shiro Z31 VLSD axles on ebay a few times from $175 to $400, so be sure to check there. I have a Shiro R200 VLSD complete with axles that I'd sell VERY reasonably, perhaps for less than your machine work would cost-PM me if that would help you. I want to keep it all together: diff and axles. I've been looking for the axles for a while, if you decide to separate I'd be interested in just the axles. I already have the VLSD installed in my longnose R200 and the "shiro" axles make thing so much easier. I wouldn't have to make hybrid axles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RebekahsZ Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 Yeah, I understand. I don't want to make this into a classified, but if you add up all your time and trouble and find yourself interested, just PM me. Shipping on my diff/axles would be about $100, but the required money above that would be the best deal I've seen lately-I'd let you lead with an offer-the parts aren't perfect and I know it, but there is some value there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meph Posted January 14, 2013 Author Share Posted January 14, 2013 Ok, so this is what ive come up with. I tried Infinity Stub axles but they dont fit into my vlsd carrier, they are too big. maybe it was an r230 im not sure. I then moved onto a 240sx vlsd. and pulled the stub axle/input shafts and they fit the vlsd I had already, but didnt have enough spline enguagment, and the tripod CV's do not fit onto the z31 turbo axles. So, the only real option I can say is safe, is to try and find z31 ss axles :/ or a different lsd. Now, being that Ive been waiting around for stuff to get here in the mail to finish the rear end, I decided to go agaist the advice of the entire internet. So there you have it, my custom vlsd stub axle. Its the z31 turbo with part of the 240sx stub axle welded on. I followed my method for welding cast iron. ether pre-heat or keep the temperature as low as possible. Tapered both ends and did it in many many small passes. letting the metal cool before adding more weld. Then I used a grinder to bring the weld down below the splined section so it doesn't interfere when inserting the stub axle axle. I then stuck the thing into an oven at somewhere around 500 degrees F to temper the steel and help to remove some of the internal stresses. It should not have effected the heat treating of the steel done from the factory, but reduced chances of having issues around the weld. Do I recommend this? No. If it was tig welded with the correct rod, and heat treated fully again, I think it would be fine. Mig welded and stuck in an oven, is no guarantee for success. I do however, think its a solution for now. The VLSD is weak, and doesn't lock with a high percentage of the torque compared to other options out there, and if it does break, I will not loose my axle or anything catastrophic I just wont have engagement to my VLSD section of the diff. I made sure to keep it cool and not effect the section of the stub that normally engages the diff. Ill report if I break it next year! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RebekahsZ Posted January 14, 2013 Share Posted January 14, 2013 That's incredible! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meph Posted January 16, 2013 Author Share Posted January 16, 2013 (edited) I wasn't totally satisfied with the weld, so I had another go at it, built up more material. Edited January 16, 2013 by Meph Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erehemantresni Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 What is your lsd out of? I am looking into this as well.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meph Posted January 19, 2013 Author Share Posted January 19, 2013 (edited) It would be a 240sx, pretty common, even here in Canada. But, this isnt the best option. Id recommend, aiming to get the q45 infinity diff. It should be LSD with the larger 30 spline input stubs. get the axles aswell and you can install the CV BDO joints onto the z31 turbo axles. This would require no welding or messing about, in theory. Swap the gear carrier into a long nose r200, and replace the ring gear with your old one. You might need to shim the 12mm holes to 10mm. I used some copper pipe from home depot that was 12mm O/D 10mm I/D. This is a helpful post http://forums.hybridz.org/topic/70534-r-200-spline-counts-and-mystery-hlsd/ Edited January 19, 2013 by Meph Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erehemantresni Posted January 19, 2013 Share Posted January 19, 2013 So let me get this right. 90-96 q45 vlsd take it apart and bolt the center from the q45 in my longnose r200. use z31 turbo axles with the q45 inner portions replacing the z31? no adapters or welding or messing about? im not familiar with the term cv bdo? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meph Posted January 20, 2013 Author Share Posted January 20, 2013 Thats my theory atleast, if you check about swapping a vlsd into a z31 there is a pretty documented write up that talks about axle options any one of them is to combine the q45 axles with the z31' so I assume its possible. BDO is a style of CV (6 steel balls with races), the other being a "tripod" style, similar to a u joint. "METHOD 5 The fifth way is to combine the Z31 Turbo half shafts (BDO type) and the 92-E94 J30 half shafts (BDO type). Once again, the diff side CV is removed from the J30 half shaft, and installed onto the diff side of the Z31 half shaft. This is the method that I chose for my hybrid half shaft assembly. My VLSD was pulled from a 93 J30. BUT I have a 87NA2T...This meant I would need Z31 Turbo half shafts and 4-bolt axle stub companion flanges to install the hybrid half shafts into my 87NA rear end. Note that it would have been much easier to use the L94-96 J30 half shafts and follow method 1. Instead, I made do with what I could get my hands on. " http://www.xenonz31.com/vlsdInstall.html So in this case, get the diff as well from the J30, and install it into the r200 long nose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiff Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 I'm curious, how is your welded stub axle holding up? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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