ls240z Posted August 7, 2014 Author Share Posted August 7, 2014 I looked back thru your thread and saw your cracked dash. When you get to that point, just cap that thing. I see lots of guys "fixing" cracked dashes. I'm sure they will crack again. My cap took a couple hours to install 20 years ago and I get compliments on my new dash all the time. I won't be fixing this dash, it's too far gone upon closer inspection. I will look for one that is in better condition, but finding one in/near Canada for a fair price might be close to impossible. I want to install a 240 dash/console, I think it looks much better. It's definitely not priority though, like you said, I'm looking to get it running first. Yesterday I finished removing the toolboxes behind the seats, I made a separate thread on that if you want to know more. I also removed the last of the sound deadening and firewall insulation, for an overall total of 15lbs. There might be another pound or two in the middle of the floor pans, but as i'm cutting them out there was no point removing it. Interior is completely gutted except for the steering column and the clutch and brake assembly. I'm running out of things to do before I require a MIG welder. (Ignore the mess in the picture, it has since been stripped and cleaned.) Plan is to get the chassis checked for straightness at a body shop, build my rotisserie, install frame rails and floors, and work on patching rust. It's going to be a little slow until I get a job. Does anyone think that's a good idea to get the chassis checked before I start building a roll bar and stitch welding? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RebekahsZ Posted August 8, 2014 Share Posted August 8, 2014 (edited) Not an authority on this: but unless there are signs of major collision, I wouldn't bother with the frame alignment check. If you are really concerned, I would just get a 4-whl alignment check. All the welding will change things but it is only the wheel alignment that matters. My chassis is really tired with lots of broken edge welds in the transmission tunnel , so I know it is a noodle. That being said, I had trouble with my drivers door dropping a little and being hard to close. But after my 6-pt roll bar (main hoop with door bars and rear braces), the rear end of my door dropped a full inch! I had to replace my door hinges and the door barely fits in the door frame because of compromises required to get it to close. So, things may change after all the welding. Maybe less, if my car had been more stiff at start? But I've never had any problem at the alignment shop and the car runs straight, hands relaxed on the wheel at 120 mph. Edited August 8, 2014 by RebekahsZ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rturbo 930 Posted August 8, 2014 Share Posted August 8, 2014 (edited) I'm certainly no expert either - far from it, but if your door moved an INCH(!!!), and doesn't even fit in the frame anymore, I'd say someone messed up your cage install. No way I'd accept that. I've actually never heard of that happening to anyone on here, or on any other forum. As for checking your chassis for straightness, I'd go over it carefully and look for accident damage. If there isn't any, and the car never had serious rust issues, I wouldn't bother. But, since my car is missing a rocker with no bracing (I didn't know better at the time), I'm definitely getting mine checked. If you want it checked anyway for peace of mind, go for it. I'm curious what that would cost. Edited August 8, 2014 by rturbo 930 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ls240z Posted August 9, 2014 Author Share Posted August 9, 2014 (edited) I know the car was rear ended from the hack job of the repair to the rear panel/roll pan. It looks like there is some rippling of the sheet metal on the floor, that's why I want to get it checked. Wow, an inch?! That's a huge difference. At least everything that matters is in order. I had my Subaru thrown on the rack a while back to get one of the frame rails tweaked back to spec, I'm pretty sure it cost under $200. Edited August 9, 2014 by ls240z Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rturbo 930 Posted August 9, 2014 Share Posted August 9, 2014 That's not from an accident, it's from when the piece was stamped at the factory. You'll find that on any Z. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RebekahsZ Posted August 9, 2014 Share Posted August 9, 2014 My ass is starting to look like that. It normal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ls240z Posted August 9, 2014 Author Share Posted August 9, 2014 That's good to hear, I thought there was more damage than I originally anticipated. You can see here the rear floor support was bent in, this was when I was cutting out the spare tire well. I haven't seen on the site anywhere yet, but has anyone cut out the entire roll pan/taillight/rear hatch deck area and replaced it? Mine is really rough, I'm trying to figure out if I should fix it so it's in good shape or just try to live with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rturbo 930 Posted August 9, 2014 Share Posted August 9, 2014 Yeah, the tail panel has been done - not sure about the deck area though. You can drill out the spot welds on the hatch sill, and remove that. The tail light/roll pan area is all one piece, and you can remove that too by drilling out the spot welds. If you want to convert to 240z tail lights, that would be a great time to do it, and it would be a totally seamless conversion. If you want to fix the trunk area though, that might be a bit more work depending how bad it is, but it's a fairly simple piece, You could probably have a replacement made up at a fab shop pretty easily, if the damage doesn't spread too far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RebekahsZ Posted August 10, 2014 Share Posted August 10, 2014 "While you are at it," weld in the load spreading structure to be able to insert a sturdy receiver hitch. That could later be used for toting a trailer during Drag Week, or for a parachute when you exceed 150mph in the 1/4-mile or 175mph in the Ohio Mike or Texas Mile. Think BIG now-I wish I had..., Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ls240z Posted August 20, 2014 Author Share Posted August 20, 2014 So today I tackled the rest of the underside of the car. Wheels, suspension, brakes, fuel lines, everything in the rear/middle was removed. While I was under there I noticed a couple spots where the factory frame rails were squished in. I'll end up cutting out those sections and covering the rest when I install the Bad Dog rails. Tomorrow I'll drop the front crossmember, steering rack, and sway bar and removed the steering column. That will conclude all I can do until I take the chassis to get checked for straightness and throw it on a rotisserie. I guess I'll have to pull the glass, hatch, and hood, but I'll wait until I have somewhere safe I can put them. This is where she sits now. Since I've started removing pieces from the Z I've been weighing almost everything. I have quite a list that I'll post on here when I pull the last few pieces to get the chassis checked. I'll keep you all posted. Side note: Here is a picture of my younger brother's new ride: 2012 STi. It's quite nice, I makes feel sad since it'll be ages until I can drive mine... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ls240z Posted September 11, 2014 Author Share Posted September 11, 2014 Picked up this little beauty the other day for a great price. I can't wait to start playing around with it, I just need a gas bottle now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rturbo 930 Posted September 11, 2014 Share Posted September 11, 2014 (edited) I would cut out the rest of the factory rails. IMO installing the bad dog rails straight on top is asking for rust issues in the future. I'm not sure how tight a fit they are, but you might leave a little but of the original rails as something to weld to if the fit is good enough. Edited September 11, 2014 by rturbo 930 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ls240z Posted September 12, 2014 Author Share Posted September 12, 2014 I would cut out the rest of the factory rails. IMO installing the bad dog rails straight on top is asking for rust issues in the future. I'm not sure how tight a fit they are, but you might leave a little but of the original rails as something to weld to if the fit is good enough. As the rails are covered in undercoating, I haven't had at good look at them. I appreciate the suggestion. That's what I love about these forums, everyone is willing to help and chime in with useful info. Once I get the car on its side and strip it I'll have a better idea of what I'm dealing with. If they are rusty, or the bad dog rails fit poorly over top, then they will be removed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RebekahsZ Posted September 12, 2014 Share Posted September 12, 2014 Its easier for us to tell you what to do than for us to get off our butts and get into the shop on our own cars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjhines Posted September 12, 2014 Share Posted September 12, 2014 My floor rails were really bent up. Otherwise they were not rusty. The floor needed serious reshaping to install the new floor rails. It is easier to go ahead and remove them. Drill out the spot welds from underneath the car. that will leave little or no hole filling later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ls240z Posted September 12, 2014 Author Share Posted September 12, 2014 Its easier for us to tell you what to do than for us to get off our butts and get into the shop on our own cars. Ain't that the truth haha My floor rails were really bent up. Otherwise they were not rusty. The floor needed serious reshaping to install the new floor rails. It is easier to go ahead and remove them. Drill out the spot welds from underneath the car. that will leave little or no hole filling later. Was that with your original pans? Mine need replacing so I'm going with the zedd findings pans. From what I've read, they need some "persuasion" to fit properly. Cutting out the original rails and using only the bad dog rails, would that be enough strength/rigidity for a 500+hp V8? I was originally going to build a rotisserie out of 2 cheapo engine stands, but now I'm scrapping that idea. I'm building an engineered rotisserie that I know won't collapse under itself. I figured, "if I end up wanting to sell this, who is going to want some hacked up engine stands? If I end up keeping it (which I likely will), why not build it properly since it will be used again?" Plus these's also the added insurance of better materials being used. Here is the version I'm building, albeit with offset legs/castors: http://forums.vintage-mustang.com/vintage-mustang-forum/587251-my-finished-rotisserie.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rturbo 930 Posted September 12, 2014 Share Posted September 12, 2014 (edited) How bad are your floors? New floors definitely need a little massaging, so if you don't have to, I wouldn't replace the entire floor. 240Zs have an issue with the floors bending up when people use the subframe as a jacking point, but 280Zs don't really seem to have that problem. The rails under a 280z are much stronger, and so is the floor, so even though my rails look like they're caved/bashed in, the floor is pretty much perfect. But the reason I suggested leaving some of the original floor, is because bad dog's 280z subframe rails don't have a flange like their 240z rails do. I am certainly not an expert on the matter, but if you think about it a bit, having the flange there definitely seems like a good idea since whatever load/force the subframe rails put on the floor is more spread out. If/when I ever get to the point of doing my frame rails my plan is cut off the stock subframe rails and leave maybe 1/2" to an inch as sort of a flange to weld the bad dog rails to, using spot welds, vs just butt welding them to the floor. I don't know if that's the "right" way to do it, but it seems better than butt welding them. That's my take, for whatever it's worth. Edited September 12, 2014 by rturbo 930 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ls240z Posted December 28, 2014 Author Share Posted December 28, 2014 (edited) Between paying off debts and working shift work, I haven't spent much time on the Z. What I have been doing is building this rotisserie; it has been my first welding project! I bought the engineered pans off ebay, and they were a great help, especially at $14. There were a few things I disliked about them, the main thing being that the leg pieces use a very hard to source size of tubing anywhere outside of California (2.5"x1.5"x0.188" rect. tubing). I gave up trying to use that size and just changed the leg to all 3" square pieces. I will say metal fabricating is ******* hard/time consuming/annoying when you don't have proper tools... My 24' lengths of steel all chopped courtesy of my friend's bandsaw at his work, thank god (it took a long time for all those cuts). Taking shape... Close up of some of my welds. Some paint. All done! I wanted some sturdy front mounts that were bolted not welded, so I utilized the bolt holes from the factory tow hooks. I think they turned out great, albeit maybe a bit overkill... I have no pictures of the rear mounts, but they are pretty standard: 3" square tubing welded to an angled piece of flat steel drilled for bolting into the factory bumper mounts. Mounted and in the garage! Ignore the tow strap spreader bar, I have to go and buy a 14' length of 2" square tubing. They were all out when I went last time. She's sideways! I was really nervous at this point, I really didn't want her to come crashing to the floor... I haven't flipped her completely because there's a bunch of loose hardware inside rolling around haha. First thing I'm going to do is remove all the left over body panels, then I'm not sure if I should remove the glass yet or not, and then scrape off the undercoating to see what I'm dealing with in terms of floor pans. I know I'll be chopping the factory rails and installing the Bad Dog's over top. I'll probably do what rturbo 930 suggested and leave the existing rail as a flange and mount to that. As for the floors, it would be nice just to have to patch holes...we will see. I want to plan out all the chassis welding I want to do so I can finish the floors and not have to tear up the paint/Lizard skin by adding something later. I am thinking of welding in my flat plate roll bar mounts (on the rocker and on the rear strut tower top) because they can be MIG'd fairly easily. I won't be welding my roll bar until I know my welding is up to snuff . Lastly, in designing my fuel cell cage, I was going to build it all with 1" square tubing, but I have noticed quite a few are built with angle iron. I'm assuming there isn't much of a difference, unless someone wants to correct me there. Are there any things people wish they added in their design? Right now mine incorporates a flat floor in the interior and captive nuts underneath for ease of removal under the car. Edited December 28, 2014 by ls240z Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ls240z Posted January 3, 2015 Author Share Posted January 3, 2015 Houston, we have inversion. Already I'm seeing that this chassis has been abused and slapped with body filler, I'm scared to take it down to metal... The PO was a cheap bastard that's for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rturbo 930 Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 And that is why I absolutely hate buying cars. Such a pain in the ass, and so many potential problems. My car has a bit of rust, but no accident history or bondo issues, thank god. Hope it's not too bad underneath the filler. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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