Chunky Posted July 14, 2014 Share Posted July 14, 2014 Hey guys! I'm having some trouble. I've tried adjusting my clutch; master, cylinder, pedal. I've done some research, this is what my adjustments were based off of. Recently I replaced my clutch master cylinder and since then I've been unable to get the clutch working properly. Shifting into first is a little notchey, sometimes needs a little "persuasion" but it doesn't make nay grinding noises. Shifting into reverse it grinds, I test it out by slowly shifting into reverse. If I hear it starting to grind I back out immediately, I'm not going to try forcing it in. I'm not sure if it matters but I'm able to shift into all gears with the car off. Here's the weird part... sometimes I'll test it out and it works fine, reverse and all. I'm able to drive it around the block just fine. Then I'll park it and come back out a few hours later and it will grind again. Pedal: I read it's supposed to be about 8.75" from the firewall. I noticed mine was at 7.5". I tried moving it out to 8" and it seemed to work. I drove it around the block. I then parked it came back out a few hours later and reverse was grinding again. I set the mater cylinder rod to bolt up with the pedal then adjusted it some to remove the slop in the pedal. I remember the pedal not feeling very firm anyway when I first got the car. Unfortunately at this pedal height I'm at the end of the adjustment range on the clevis. Should I move it back to 7.5" like it was before? I'm thinking having it at 8 gives me more throw than 7.5. Master: As noted above, I installed the new unit. Then attached the rod to the pedal. Once it was bolted on I noticed there was some slop in the linkage. I went ahead and turned the rod to tighten up the linkage to the pedal. I did this by hand just until there was no more slop and then another extra turn, however, I'm now at the end of adjustment. I was thinking of measuring the amount of travel in the rod, How many inches of total travel should it have? Slave: I've bled the system numerous times. I've found that each time I get no air coming out, just straight fluid at this point. I have the older slave with the adjustable rod. Is there a good step by step for adjusting this? How much should the slave cylinder/fork move when the pedal is pressed? Here's what I did: -Bleed system. -Remove spring. -Push clutch fork out as much as possible by hand. Towards firewall, away from slave. -Adjust rod until it touches the fork. -Tighten it a few more turns. -Reattach spring. I've tried to research this and I had my helper push in the clutch and hold it. I watched the slave cylinder move it held it's position with the pedal pressed. So I'm thinking there's no leak. I'm hoping my adjustments are just off. I have a 71, so it's the older version where adjustment is made at the master and slave. I've read that it's kind of picky trying to get them both adjusted together properly. Sorry for the wall of text, I try to give as much information as possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewZed Posted July 14, 2014 Share Posted July 14, 2014 I had a slave cylinder once that only leaked in the middle of its travel. So it would hold pressure and seemed to move from start to finish of the pedal travel but wasn't moving the full distance. Got worse when it was hot. The sure sign that there was a leak was fluid behind the rubber boot. It should always be dry in there. Pop the boot off and look for fluid. I imagine something similar could happen at the master cylinder. The parts store hydraulics sometimes arrive from the manufacturer dirty with machining grit. So a new part can sometimes fail quickly. On adjusting - basically you want a small amount of play between the pedal and the actuating rod. And you want the slave cylinder piston to be starting near the bottom of its bore. But the slave is easy because if you have the rod to the fork too short the piston will just pop out or leak fluid. The first thing you should do is check the boot on the slave cylinder for fluid. It can hold quite a bit without leaking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chunky Posted July 15, 2014 Author Share Posted July 15, 2014 Thanks for the reply! I went out and checked the rubber boots on both master and slave. I peeled them back and felt around. I felt some grease but there was no fluid in the boots. I'm thinking of resetting everything back to zero; pedal, master and slave. Start over and adjust everything one by one. Pedal first to get the height set and master adjusted to that. Then I'll try readjusting the slave and re-bleeding it over again. From another forum... "Also, if you keep backing the nut inward towards the slave cylinder (towards the front of the car), with the spring off you should reach a point where there is play in the clutch arm. Keep going in several more turns. Now with the clutch depressed, you shouldn't be able to shift gears at all. Then, put the spring back on and work the nut outward, towards the back of the car a couple of turns at a time. Have your wife push in the clutch and see if she can change gears. When she gets the gears to change, you should be able to go a couple of turns further. Take off the spring, and see if you have play in the arm. If not, back off 1 to 2 turns and see if you have play. You need to have some play or your throw out bearing will be in constant contact with your clutch plate." I'm still open to other ideas though... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chunky Posted July 17, 2014 Author Share Posted July 17, 2014 PROGRESS! I decided to reset everything back to zero and start over. I Set my pedal a touch lower than before but still higher than it was, 7.75". I adjusted the Master push rod to take out the slop. Set the slave cylinder to have just a touch of play in it. Went back and readjusted the master again since it looks like the slave adjustment introduced a little more play in the master push rod. Drove the car around, and it felt great! I didn't feel any clutch slipping BUT I noticed that reverse is still a little picky. I have to slowly/gently put it into reverse. Sometimes it starts to grind, I just wiggle it around in neutral a bit then go in gently again and it will work. Sometimes it takes 2-3 tries. Forward gears work fine. Ideas? I'm thinking of trying to adjust the slave again to lessen the amount of play OR do I need to adjust the pedal outward to give it more throw? Not sure.. if either or both will work? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam280Z Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 Are you putting it in 1st before attempting to select reverse? This is good practice because you use the 1st gear synchros to stop the input shaft. Reverse has no synchros and will grind every time you quickly go straight from neutral to reverse if the clutch was engaged in neutral. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chunky Posted July 17, 2014 Author Share Posted July 17, 2014 Actually this is a habit I picked up when I was first learning how to drive. I've always gone into first then into reverse, for some reason it always "felt right" doing it that way, even in more modern cars I still do it. Last night I drove it to the gas station to fill her up, she'd been sitting near empty for a while. Just for the hell of it I decided to test reverse again, I went into first, then slowly tried to get into reverse. I could feel it was starting to grind so I didn't push. I drove it home. At home I wiggled it in neutral then tried to ease it into reverse (no first that time I wanted to try different things), it started to grind. So I tossed it into first, then I started going into reverse and it started to grind again. I went back into neutral, went into first again then I went for reverse a second time... this time I slowly & gently eased it into reverse and it went in! But it did take some finesse... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chunky Posted July 18, 2014 Author Share Posted July 18, 2014 Eureka!!! So I went back out today to give it another go. I think I got all the adjustments dialed in! My problem was I was adjusting for pedal feel, I'm used to having a solid pedal. I was trying to get a solid pedal and then adjust the rest to work. I found that with everything adjusted properly, my pedal actually doesn't feel all that great BUT it seems to work. Reverse is actually smoother than first now (which has me worried that something is going on with that but that's for another day). With everything adjusted my pedal feels "weak" but reverse doesn't grind, all the gears work and I don't feel the hesitation associated with clutch slippage. I tested it driving around the block a few times. I even tested shifting into reverse several times in a row and it worked each time, previously reverse worked the first time immediately after adjustments then started grinding on subsequent attempts. Fingers crossed. (I realize most of this thread is me talking to myself... so thanks for listening! Haha) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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