Web Camshaft

[luseboy]

Well I searched... and surprisingly didn't find anything.

I'm wondering if anyone is using a cam from Web Cams?

here's the link:

http://www.webcamshafts.com/index_blank.html?pages/vehicle_search.html

 

You have to search for the right cam for the L, but they're there (under automobile-datsun-Z). The price for a re-grind sounds great, and they have quite a few grinds to choose from. I've seen them mentioned in other places and they apparently hold up really well. For a street-driven N/A Z with some basic upgrades, and driven for fun, what would be the right grind? I was thinking the .450 lift, 260 duration? Seems like it would be a great street cam. I'm more interested in the "feel" than the numbers. So basically something that feels good on the street. Any insight on this? And when I replace the cam, I need new rockers and lash caps, correct? What size lash caps with this cam?

Thanks for any help in advance!

-Austin

[duragg]

I just went through this and got "scared away" from getting the real gnarly cam I wanted to something more people-friendly.

I now wish I had gone for the nasty stupid cam instead of the sensible mid cam.

 

I got an Isky L490 regrind which is fine, but pretty strong mid-range.

I wanted a lumpy stupid idle and a more wild top end.

Might even replace this one soon.

 

No way to say what lash pads you will need until you start to assemble and see how it goes.

I had a bunch sitting around and needed to buy a few. Nearly all of mine needed a 140 or 150 which is less than I thought.

Probably because the valve seats got recut a bit deeper?

But the wipe pattern was perfect with the ones I used and so it is..

 

If you (or I) go with a really tall cam I suppose I might need to run my tower shims.

 

Isky treated me well and quickly for what its worth.

Tj

[luseboy]

I just went through this and got "scared away" from getting the real gnarly cam I wanted to something more people-friendly.

I now wish I had gone for the nasty stupid cam instead of the sensible mid cam.

 

I got an Isky L490 regrind which is fine, but pretty strong mid-range.

I wanted a lumpy stupid idle and a more wild top end.

Might even replace this one soon.

 

No way to say what lash pads you will need until you start to assemble and see how it goes.

I had a bunch sitting around and needed to buy a few. Nearly all of mine needed a 140 or 150 which is less than I thought.

Probably because the valve seats got recut a bit deeper?

But the wipe pattern was perfect with the ones I used and so it is..

 

If you (or I) go with a really tall cam I suppose I might need to run my tower shims.

 

Isky treated me well and quickly for what its worth.

Tj

 

sounds like you and I are after different things... I want something for the low-end. Something that will pull from a low rpm, on up to a mid-range. Although top end is important to me too... So it needs to be a little more aggressive. I think I'll go with my gut and go for the second from mildest cam that web offers. How do I know when I have the right lash pads? Where's the best place to get lash pads?

 

Anyways thank you for your reply! I appreciate your input.

[duragg]

Doc510 taught me a trick to flip the pads.

Old fart knows his ****.

[Zmanco]

sounds like you and I are after different things... I want something for the low-end. Something that will pull from a low rpm, on up to a mid-range. Although top end is important to me too... So it needs to be a little more aggressive.

 

L engines don'thave variable valve timing so in general, improvements at higher rpm come at the expense of losing some bottom end torque. You might want to focus on a cam with less aggressive valve timing and overlap but with higher lift to help air flow. Otherwise you may be disappointed with loss of low end torque.

[luseboy]

L engines don'thave variable valve timing so in general, improvements at higher rpm come at the expense of losing some bottom end torque. You might want to focus on a cam with less aggressive valve timing and overlap but with higher lift to help air flow. Otherwise you may be disappointed with loss of low end torque.

 

now that is starting to sound more like what I want. so would the cam I mentioned be more on track with what you're saying? Its not too aggressive. I don't plan to ever race this car. I will probably do some track days and some auto-x, but no racing on the track, I'm sure. This is going to be a street Z, but I hope to make it a fun car!

[luseboy]

Doc510 taught me a trick to flip the pads.

Old fart knows his ****.

 

haha sounds interesting... is it as straight forward as it sounds? would you be able to (PM if you want) tell me how this is done?

[Zmanco]

Doc510 taught me a trick to flip the pads.

Old fart knows his ****.

 

How would that work with the L engine pads?

 

[Zmanco]

now that is starting to sound more like what I want. so would the cam I mentioned be more on track with what you're saying? Its not too aggressive. I don't plan to ever race this car. I will probably do some track days and some auto-x, but no racing on the track, I'm sure. This is going to be a street Z, but I hope to make it a fun car!

 

It sounds like you're trying for something that cannot be achieved with these engines. On the track you will likely never have the revs below 2500 - 3000 rpm so low end torque doesn't mean the same thing compared to driving on the street where you might be driving at 1800 rpm in third gear in traffic.

 

I would suggest you match the cam's characteristics to the transmission/diff combination you plan to end up with. For example, a late model ZX 5 speed with a 3.9 or 4.11 is effectively a close ratio transmission and hence you'd want a cam that makes more power at higher revs and not worry about low end torque. But if you are the type of person who DOES want low end torque, then go with a lower ratio diff and a cam that makes good low/mid rpm torque, but realize it isn't going to pull strong to 7k either.

 

I'm a fan of high reving engines, so dont' have experience with the other end of the spectrum. I've used both Delta Cams and Isky (Delta for NA and Isky for turbo) regrinds and both shops are great to deal with and give good advice. You might give them a call and describe what you're looking to do and see which of their grinds they recommend.

[duragg]

How would that work with the L engine pads?

 

 

Poor typing, sorry. "Flip" was the incorrect term supplied by Android OS.

 

Doc510 showed me a quick way to gauge the lash pads needed.

First bottom out the adjusting thing and then turn it out about 3 threads showing.

Put in a stock lash pad and measure the gap between rocker and cam.

Add the 2 and thats what you need.

 

When I did this most of mine had about .020 clearance + the .120 stocks = 140 pad required.

All my wipes are perfectly centered with this quick method.

[Tony D]

If you are driving at 1800 rpms in a Z-Car in ANY gear other than first moving from a stoplight or rolling to a stoplight (?) you need to go back to driving school!

 

This isn't a Chevy, don't drive it like one! You want bottom end grunt and want to drive it like a Diesel Jetta, install a turbo.

 

NONE of these engines has anything below 3000 rpms, don't make it something it was never meant to be. You want an industrial refrigeration engine, install a Toyota 18R...

[luseboy]

If you are driving at 1800 rpms in a Z-Car in ANY gear other than first moving from a stoplight or rolling to a stoplight (?) you need to go back to driving school!

 

This isn't a Chevy, don't drive it like one! You want bottom end grunt and want to drive it like a Diesel Jetta, install a turbo.

 

NONE of these engines has anything below 3000 rpms, don't make it something it was never meant to be. You want an industrial refrigeration engine, install a Toyota 18R...

 

well I wasn't saying I wanted it to have peak power there or anything... really just saying that I want it to at least be able to move the car without stalling at that rpm... I live in a pretty hilly place so its important to have enough down low to get you moving. I would never expect to be trying to drive it quick in that rpm range. 3k is about where I want the power to come on, in thinking.

[luseboy]

Poor typing, sorry. "Flip" was the incorrect term supplied by Android OS.

 

Doc510 showed me a quick way to gauge the lash pads needed.

First bottom out the adjusting thing and then turn it out about 3 threads showing.

Put in a stock lash pad and measure the gap between rocker and cam.

Add the 2 and thats what you need.

 

When I did this most of mine had about .020 clearance + the .120 stocks = 140 pad required.

All my wipes are perfectly centered with this quick method.

 

Ah that makes sense. Thanks for the explanation, I really appreciate it!

[Leon]

I don't know about you guys, but I'm having plenty of fun with the stock cam. I'm in a hilly area as well and have absolutely no problems. Take-offs are in second gear unless I'm on a hill.

[luseboy]

I don't know about you guys, but I'm having plenty of fun with the stock cam. I'm in a hilly area as well and have absolutely no problems. Take-offs are in second gear unless I'm on a hill.

 

what part of the bay are you from? in marin it's really hilly, well in the part I'm in. I'm having tons of fun with my stock cam too! It sits in my engine on it's stand waiting to be used haha. I've never driven a Z before so I wouldn't know. But since I'm rebuilding the engine anyways, I figure I will try and do it right the first time!

[Zmanco]

Poor typing, sorry. "Flip" was the incorrect term supplied by Android OS.

 

Doc510 showed me a quick way to gauge the lash pads needed.

First bottom out the adjusting thing and then turn it out about 3 threads showing.

Put in a stock lash pad and measure the gap between rocker and cam.

Add the 2 and thats what you need.

 

When I did this most of mine had about .020 clearance + the .120 stocks = 140 pad required.

All my wipes are perfectly centered with this quick method.

 

As I think about the geometry of the valve stem, adjusting stud and rocker across them, I just don't see this being accurate for all cams. What's special about 3 turns out for the stud? If you turn it 2 3/4 or 3 1/4 this method will tell you to use a different lash pad.

 

With the Isky turbo regrind I'm using (.490" intake, .480" exhaust), the adjusters are set much taller than 3 turns in order to get the proper geometry to keep the wipe pattern on the rocker. For a higher lift reground profile, the base circle is going to be smaller than stock, and under those conditions the adjusting stud is going to have to be set higher than 3 turns.

 

No insult intended to Doc510, but I wouldn't want someone to read this and think that it would always work to size lash pads.

[duragg]

He said some old time Datsun builder taught him the trick and he's been using it for age and showed me.

Every single one had a nice centered wipe pattern which I certainly verified about 10x over.

[duragg]

Problem is that lash pads were NLA from Motorsport and several other sources I tried.

6 month back order.

 

So I ordered what they had (.230"s!) and had my friend grind them down on his surface grinder.

 

Theres a thousand ways to do it I am sure. Point is to get a nice centered wipe one way or another.

 

With the "3 threads showing trick" his method got my setup done quick and easy.

I am an FNG with building L motors so I just followed directions.

[Leon]

what part of the bay are you from? in marin it's really hilly, well in the part I'm in. I'm having tons of fun with my stock cam too! It sits in my engine on it's stand waiting to be used haha. I've never driven a Z before so I wouldn't know. But since I'm rebuilding the engine anyways, I figure I will try and do it right the first time!

 

I'm on the peninsula and live on a big hill. Up the hill at 25-30mph in 3rd gear is fine, but I do have a 3.9 diff. No downshifts required from 5th gear commuting to Petaluma. I have plenty of torque and can take it to 6500-7000rpm although it doesn't breathe very well up there. Shifting around 6000rpm is perfect. This is with an L24 with triples and custom exhaust, everything else stock engine-wise.

 

If you want max torque to occur at higher rpm then you'll have to sacrifice it down low. I would recommend getting a ride in or driving a Z with a stock cam before you decide. It's hard to gauge any changes you make to the car without having a baseline, which is why I'm starting out almost stock and then progressing into upgrades.

Edited October 2, 2011 by Leon

[luseboy]

I'm on the peninsula and live on a big hill. Up the hill at 25-30mph in 3rd gear is fine, but I do have a 3.9 diff. No downshifts required from 5th gear commuting to Petaluma. I have plenty of torque and can take it to 6500-7000rpm although it doesn't breathe very well up there. Shifting around 6000rpm is perfect. This is with an L24 with triples and custom exhaust, everything else stock engine-wise.

 

If you want max torque to occur at higher rpm then you'll have to sacrifice it down low. I would recommend getting a ride in or driving a Z with a stock cam before you decide. It's hard to gauge any changes you make to the car without having a baseline, which is why I'm starting out almost stock and then progressing into upgrades.

 

If you're taking 101 to petaluma and you don't have to downshift... I'm impressed! That one hill on 101 in novato, I always have to downshift in my mini to hold speed. I'm excited for my Z .

 

Well yes, I realize there is a give and a take to it (just like everything else!). I know... I know. I keep kicking myself because I want to know what a bone stock Z drives like. But I don't really have that option because my Z is undriveable, and if I'm going to rebuild it, then I'm not gonna go back to a stock car! so unless another member from the bay area wants to go for a drive somewhere, I'm pretty much just going to have to trust that everything I did was worth it.