Manual versus Automatic: Coupe vs 2+2

[namz7791]

I have been doing a lot of research on the V8 conversion for a 280Z and it appears that most conversions recommend an overdrive automatic transmission. Apparently they are easier to complete and less expensive.

 

I have always enjoyed driving a manual shift vehicle and understand that the choice is one of personal preference in the end. However I am wondering what the members of Hybridz think of the way the V8 Z performs with an automatic versus a manual shift? Is there any benefits for one over the other when you take cost out of the equation? My car will be more of a daily driver than a racer.

 

Also, I have the option of converting a 77 coupe or a 77 2+2 is one better than the other?

 

Thanks!

[Kevin Shasteen]

.., Also, I have the option of converting a 77 coupe or a 77 2+2 is one better than the other..,

 

This is kind've a personal thing. I like the 2+2, my Z is a 2+2 and I chose it specificall with the intention (one of these days) to put a V8 in it. I like the fact that the 2+2 offers a longer wheelbase and is built slightly heavier-duty than the coupe...should handle the extra power of the V8 better than the coupe.

 

Keep in mind tho, when you put an engine in the Z whose power output is twice to three times that of a stock inliner and hammer it alot: it really isnt going to matter too much as you will tear up the coupe or the 2+2 unless you support the body w/some kind of a cage.

 

I personally like the 2+2...so I guess it just really boils down to what you like personally.

 

Oh yea, the back seat of the 2+2 makes it nice when the little nephews/nieces come to visit and the little nephew is a car guy -you can easily set them in the back.

 

Kevin,

(Yea,Still an Inliner)

[Mike kZ]

This is kind've a personal thing. I like the 2+2' date=' my Z is a 2+2 and I chose it specificall with the intention (one of these days) to put a V8 in it. Kevin,

(Yea,Still an Inliner)[/quote']

 

So Kevin, when is that V8 going in there? You've been a member since near the beginning! Come on man!!

[Phantom]

namz7791

Welcome to the forum. I have a 77 280Z Coupe with an LS1 and the T56 6-spd. The automatic brings three positives to the table. It is definitely faster if you are building a 1/4 mile racer and it is a lot easier on the leg in city stop-n-go traffic. It is also a simpler install. That being said - I wouldn't trade my T56 for a 4L60E for anything short of an amputation. I enjoy shifting and I like the gear selection control/shift timing that the standard gives me.

I also prefer the coupe over the 2+2. I think the early year coupe has a bit better lines plus it is marginally lighter which allows you to add more structural stiffness with less penalty.

These are definitely personal preferences and totally subjective.

[namz7791]

Thanks for the information!

 

What type of structural upgrades are required? Are we talking strut towers and bigger sway bars or full roll cages?

 

Also, does anyone make a kit for the required items?

 

Thanks!

[Kevin Shasteen]

.., So Kevin, when is that V8 going in there? You've been a member since near the beginning! Come on man!!

 

MikeZ: Oooh maaaaan...now the pressure is on

 

I admit the V8Z swap has not been on the top of the list; yet I am committed to doing it sometime before I die (lol), which is why I have pushed myself so hard in to researching what makes the engine tick. At least this way-when I do make the decision to actually doing it-I wont have to hesitate in making my component decisions.

 

Also must admit-the LS1 swap appears to be the way to go...its looking very intriguing w/every new day.

 

Namz,

 

If you want info on the body mods you may find more info in the "body and kits" forum.

 

Kevin,

(Yes MikeZ, I'm still an Inliner)

[Guest Z-rific]

Were typically talking about frame reinforcement or strengthening. Strut towers and say bars help keep things stiffer, but don't really make the suspension stronger. Roll cages, added crossmembers, etc will keep the unibody stiff when big torque is thrown at it.

 

However, most of us don't produce enough torque to really warrant such reinforcement. A stock Z can handle a pretty good amount of power.

 

I would chose a coupe or a 2+2 based on aesthetics. Pick which ever one looks best to you. I typically don't like 2+2's, although somebody here showed some pics of their white 2+2 with some nice wheels and it impressed me a bunch.

 

I have a built TH350 (3 speed auto) in my car. There are certainly times when I miss shifting, but I also love launching and shifting the ratchet shifter in a straight line. I have my 95 Eagle Talon TSi AWD with 5 speed that cures my shifting fix.

 

Automatics with shift kits get you down the 1/4 faster, but keep in mind an auto also robs more power from the engine than a manual. And picking the right torque converter for an auto is important, particularly when you get into higher power engines.

[Guest goldraven]

namz7791

The automatic brings three positives to the table. It is definitely faster if you are building a 1/4 mile racer and it is a lot easier on the leg in city stop-n-go traffic.

 

How is it faster? I've always found it much easier to launch off the start with a standard than an automatic. i cant see losing time with shifting? explain.

[Phantom]

Goldraven:

With a properly set-up torque converter you can come off the line with an automatic at the proper engine speed consistently which results in more consistent launches. Also, there is no way a properly set up automatic will not shift a lot faster than a manual. We're talking shift times measured in milli-seconds. It also is programmed to always shift at exactly the right upper end rpm for the motor. This allows the driver to concentrate on keeping the car straight and any necessary throttle control. THe new automatics aren't your daddy's automatic. Computer control allows wonderful things when it comes to straight line racing. Even the supercar folks are going that way now for F1 style racing. The only real reason to have a manual now is generally cost and that some folks (me included) just like to shift.

Others:

The LS1 for sure and probably the aluminum head SBC's pretty much eliminate the absolute necessity for any suspension upgrades. They just don't add enough weight to require modifications. That also means that for NORMAL driving there would also be no need for suspension upgrades.

However, because of the significantly higher torque generated versus the NA L28, a certain degree of chassis reinforcement is required to avoid excessive flexing. The amount of reinforcement required is dependent on the car model and the particular drivetrain installed. For example: A 280 will need a bit less reinforcing that a 240 because it has stronger subframe components. A supercharged LS1 making 420/420 HP/TQ would require more than a 250/250 SBC. Any Z, however, will benefit from strut tower braces. Reinforcing the subframe connectors is a good recommendation for the 240 and not a bad idea for the 280. A roll bar is common sense if you are going to compete at all or have a weakness for street racing.

Bottom line - do a bunch of searches, read a ton of posts and other sources of information, talk with your knowledgable friends, and then do what YOU think is right for your application.

And now, having said all that, I duck.

[ZROSSA]

Howdy,

I would not even bother with a auto. Dont like them and wouldnt buy a car with one. But thats just me. I live in the country and have great roads all around to play on. I also have a 2+2. In N.Z they are a lot easyer to get hold of as they were imported as used imports from Japan. I do like the look of the coupe better but as many have said before me the 2+2 s are stronger. They already have full lenght chassis rails so the only real chassis improvements are a roll cage. Mine had a lot of rust in the roof so when I was fixing it i changed the transition point from the roof to the hatch a bit. I now has a lot less of the hockey stick look and is more like the coupe. Wish the factory had done it that way. There are some photos in my gallery but they are pretty old now. The car is now a friends getting molds made up and the body work finished. I will take more photos when there is visable progress.

 

Douglas

[Brad-ManQ45]

Body style is personal preference.

 

As a daily driver - how much traffic?

 

I had a '72 351CJ Mustang, and the writeup in Hot Rod at the time said the automatics and manuals had the same time in the 1/4 mile. The torque converter plays a big part in this.

 

I personally have an '83ZXT that has been modded w/ a T5. The '75 that I will put a turbo'd V8 in will have a 4L80E in it because I'm tired of shifing in traffic. I'll probably give the ZXT to my stepson...but not 'till I'm done with the Z!

[datsunlover]

I for one like to shift the gears.. but in a small car with a big V8, I'd go with the auto. Just from my experiance with my SBC RX7, it was still a blast to drive, and yes, definatly an easier swap process. I chose auto for a few reasons: I got an engine and 3 speed auto attached for.... well, dirt cheep. I originally wanted a standard, and actually bought a B/W 4 gear but finding the proper bell housing/master and slave cyl's and figuring out how to make it work... proved difficult. I sold that trany for $100 more than I payed for it so it worked out good! Also, as a few ppl told me (and I believed it in the end) it would be a little hard to 'hang on to' as a standard shift. Full out throttle going into second gear (that was about 70KPH) would break the rear loose. On dry pavement. Even having both hands on the wheel was barly enough to keep the car in control! IMO, throwing a standard shifter in that mix is a little much, and possibly too dangerous for the street. Keep in mind I am 3 months away from 25 years old, and don't know everything anymore.. wish I was 18 again.