Guest Z2nr Posted November 29, 2004 Share Posted November 29, 2004 Anyone ever done this or seen it. I think this would be a really cool swap, really light, decent power, and a high 9k redline. Similar to an S2k engine for power, but has less moving parts. Turbos kill rotaries IMO, that's why Mazda started making the n/a again. I wonder how much the engines cost? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Magnum Rockwilder Posted November 29, 2004 Share Posted November 29, 2004 LOL, if turbos kill rotaries, explain why one of non-turbo my RX7's died at 114k miles, and the other died at 98k. Apex seals kill rotaries. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 73Turbo240z Posted November 29, 2004 Share Posted November 29, 2004 LOL' date=' if turbos kill rotaries, explain why one of non-turbo my RX7's died at 114k miles, and the other died at 98k. Apex seals kill rotaries.[/quote'] the wankel and the renesis are 2 different beasts, i'm interested in seeing how the renesis takes to boost... but yes, apex seals were the akeleies heel of the wankel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CruxGNZ Posted November 29, 2004 Share Posted November 29, 2004 Apex seals kill rotaries. Exactly. Detonation or poor tuning, kills rotaries. Otherwise they can live quite a long life. As far as the Renesis is concerned, it's pretty new, so I doubt anyone has had the opportunity to adapt one for use in a Z car. !M! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auxilary Posted November 29, 2004 Share Posted November 29, 2004 ......... sound like words of the uneducated, imo. There are plenty of 100k+ turbo2 series 4 and 5 rx7s running around. FDs had the issue with apex seals blowing because of US emission laws. And newsflash: the renesis engine is still a wankel motor with apex seals Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandonsZ Posted November 29, 2004 Share Posted November 29, 2004 Would they stop P**** Footing around sub 300hp production and come out with a 8 cylinder version of the Wankle for crying out loud! That would be insane! And please make it something like 4L + I can't take this 1.3L bs anymore from Mazda. Imagine a 9k redline on a 1000hp engine. WTF! Really, keep good gas mileage under 3-4K and then push it for those lazy suday drives. I'm sure there's some reason for it, and the bigger ones probably couldn't go 9k. Sad sad sad... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest unknownroadster Posted November 29, 2004 Share Posted November 29, 2004 Off topic sorry guys, My shop has a Turbo kit for the REN. motor, (New RX-8) the most we boosted on the rhing was 9lbs. Boy did that intake manifold expand. that motor is a slug stock base dyno was @ 176hp to the wheels, it seems the most performance parts so far decreased the HP when installed, all Ive seen so far was Cat-backs from HKS. @ 6psi we got 213hp ttw, but that microwaveable plastic intake man. is kinda scary looking under boost... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest unknownroadster Posted November 29, 2004 Share Posted November 29, 2004 At this point in time with Rotaries, an 13b or 20b whould be your best bet, REN. motor is waaaay to new for any one to make power out of it yet. Acosta racing has TK for the RX-8, but it cost $40,000, ( yes $40.000) cause they put a 20b in there instead. Greddy has a kit for it too but who'd want to pay $5,000 for 20hp???? $400+ will get 150+ for some NOS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auxilary Posted November 29, 2004 Share Posted November 29, 2004 brandon.... 1. rotaries don't have cylinders. maybe you're thinking of the 4 rotor 767b motor mazda used in f1/lemans racing, which is now not allowed. And it's technically 2.6 liter. Or 5.2, depending who measures it. On rotary forums, it's chicken vs. egg deal. 2. mazda has produced a 3 rotor version called the 20b, with sequential twin turbo setup that produced roughly 300-310hp and matching torque. These, of course, were underrated due to Japan's gentlemans agreement (no JDM production cars to exceed 287hp). 3. rotaries are NOT fuel efficient by any means. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NZeder Posted November 29, 2004 Share Posted November 29, 2004 There are a number of larger rotaries around - GM in the 60's even made a Wankel prototype Corvette with a 4 rotor = at least 2000cc in wankel size. There is the 20b from the Mazda Cosmo = 2000cc + twin turbo. Then there is the R26b (race only) 2616cc n/a Le Manns winning engine with 515kw and 609n/m. If you go by the FIA rules then a Wankel is 1.8xcc = normal engine size. So a 2616cc rotary = 2616x1.8 = 4709cc or almost he same as 302 ford. Now they say a 2 rotor wankel is equivalent of a 6 cylinder so a 4 rotor would be that of a 12 cylinder. And the sound of a 4 rotor is like an F1 car. I am looking into the cost of building a custom 4 rotor out of 2 x 13b = 26b using a custom Eccentric shaft (drive shaft), bolts, oil pump etc You can buy a 4 rotor kit here in NZ. I was thinking of the renesis engine but then I started talking to the rotary shop here and we talked about the 20b then I asked about their 4 rotor = hence the collecting of info for the budget. Here in NZ there have been a few renesis engines imported from Japan (from damaged Rx8) they go for about 2500USD including computer. Cheers Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Magnum Rockwilder Posted November 29, 2004 Share Posted November 29, 2004 Detonation or poor tuning' date=' kills rotaries. Otherwise they can live quite a long life. !M![/quote'] So why did my stock non-turbo RX7's die at 114k and 98k miles? LOL. They're JUNK! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auxilary Posted November 29, 2004 Share Posted November 29, 2004 Did you maintain them properly? How did they die? My friend and I pulled a 13b na out of his GTUs with 176k on the clock. It was a running motor pulled out to do a turbo swap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auxilary Posted November 30, 2004 Share Posted November 30, 2004 btw, 72nr, I don't know if you saw this... http://hybridz.org/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=38615 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NZeder Posted November 30, 2004 Share Posted November 30, 2004 Turbos kill rotaries IMO, that's why Mazda started making the n/a again. Latest rumor is that mazda will be putting a turbo on the Renesis Engine on the new 2 seater Rx7.....but given the JDM limit of 206kw I can only guess this will be the total power - other markets might get more kw. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrWOT Posted November 30, 2004 Share Posted November 30, 2004 I don't know anything about a new RX-7 model, but I'm definetly getting one of these http://www.mazdausa.com/MusaWeb/displayPage.action?pageParameter=mazdaSpeed6 when it comes out, I know people that make custom cranks for them (them 2.3 duratec) to take them to 2.7L.... easily over 400hp and ft/lbs on pump gas Check out the little video on it, it looks like it's going to be seriously bad ass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Magnum Rockwilder Posted November 30, 2004 Share Posted November 30, 2004 Did you maintain them properly? How did they die? My friend and I pulled a 13b na out of his GTUs with 176k on the clock. It was a running motor pulled out to do a turbo swap. I bought one of them from a Mazda service tech who bought it new, and it died on him at 114k. My other one I bought with 53k miles and did oil changes every 2000 miles with Castrol GTX. I drove it hard, but I maintained it well. A sports car should be able to be run hard, and rotary engines just have too bad a history to be used in sports cars. It's a novel idea, but pistons rule. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrWOT Posted November 30, 2004 Share Posted November 30, 2004 I bought one of them from a Mazda service tech who bought it new' date=' and it died on him at 114k. My other one I bought with 53k miles and did oil changes every 2000 miles with Castrol GTX. I drove it hard, but I maintained it well. A sports car should be able to be run hard, and rotary engines just have too bad a history to be used in sports cars. It's a novel idea, but pistons rule.[/quote'] Sorry man, going to have to throw a BS flag on that one, rotaries make EXCELLENT high performance engines so long as you tune them well and replace the apex seals at proper intervals. I know people who have 3rd gen RX-7s (3 turbo, 1 NA) with well over 200k miles on them, that are only on their 2nd (or 3rd in the case of 2) set of apex seals, with no other real troubles at all. One of them even has an RX-3 that's still kicking at 270k on the original engine with new seals every 80k. So long as you don't run them lean, they last quite a while, no valves to service etc... That said, give me pistons any day I like upgradability of motors with a crank and rods and pistons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(goldfish) Posted November 30, 2004 Share Posted November 30, 2004 I think any 1.3L motor will have longevity problems when make that kind of power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Magnum Rockwilder Posted November 30, 2004 Share Posted November 30, 2004 Sorry man' date=' going to have to throw a BS flag on that one... I know people who have 3rd gen RX-7s (3 turbo, 1 NA)...[/quote'] LMMFAO! You just called BS on me and then said you know someone with a N/A 3rd gen RX7?!?! ALL 3rd gen (93-95) RX7's are TT. When you know what you're talking about, feel free to argue with me, but in the meantime spend more time reading up on rotaries than arguing with a reformed former "rotard". I am the CURRENT owner of two RX7's, a Red 90 GTU and a black '91 base coupe, and BOTH of them are now sporting Granny's Speed Shop V8 kits due to the lack of power, reliability, and economy of the rotaries. I wish there were a solid statistic for the longevity of rotary engines vs different piston engines found in sports cars, like 5.0's, LT1's, and of course the good ole SBC, but instead we'll just have to rely on the oh-so-subtle evidence that 99% of RX7's are on their 2nd, 3rd, or 4th engine due to failed apex seals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrWOT Posted November 30, 2004 Share Posted November 30, 2004 whoops, meant 2nd gen, the one with the turbo II. Been a very long day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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