MusPuppis Posted December 1, 2006 Share Posted December 1, 2006 I poked around on the net and found some info but I'd like to back it up some. We have so much knowledge and information here I wanted to ask a couple questions of the Hybrid community.. Ok, first, the oddity. He claims its a '95 WS6. From everything Ive been able to find there is no such thing. It was introduced in '96 and consists of a handling package, ram air hood and (I think) something to do with the exhuast that boosts the power some, I dont think it adds anything else other than badges and a little body kit (was that kit available on regular trans-ams/firebirds? His car does not have a ram air hood, but it does have the body kit and Ive never seen that kit on anything but the WS6's. LT1 car (thats 275hp/330trq?). Sadly its an auto.. 4L60, but if I do get the car I can live with it until I put the money together to 6 speed swap it.. and if I get the car, I WILL swap. I know how much hell its going to be, but I dont care, if I get the car its going to be a long term driver/project and I simply cant live with an automatic car for any length of time. I'm only considering this one because he claims its a WS6 (I have doubts now but we'll see) and the price is pretty good, even if turns out its a normal trans-am thats kinda half cloned, the price is worth the car IMO. Custom exhuast, no cats, flowmasters, stage 2 super chip,fresh rebuilt tranny w. shift kit and he said something about Corvette parts used.. I dunno, not familiar with those really. 2000$ stereo. Nice car. Im still thinking a DSM, but if this car is still around or I can work something out for february I think its worth buying in to. Just trying to get some info so I know what Im dealing with! Thanks folks. Im still looking for a DSM more Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naviathan Posted December 1, 2006 Share Posted December 1, 2006 1982 In 1982, the 3rd Generation Firebirds were introduced: Firebird, Firebird S/E, and Firebird Trans Am. The Firebird was the base model, equivalent to the Camaro Sport Coupe, the Firebird S/E was a higher option level which could be loaded with more options than the Trans Am. The Trans Am was the highest performance level for the Firebird. The Firebird and Camaro got a new front end, with two pop-up headlights for the Firebird, and four exposed units for the Camaro. In addition to being 500 lb lighter, the new Firebird was the most aerodynamic production Firebird to date. Wind tunnels were used to form the body shape. The aerodynamic developments extended to the finned aluminum wheels with smooth caps and a functional spoiler. The Trans Am received a turbo bulge hood styled loosely off the earlier turbo Trans Am. Plans had originally been made to use the Pontiac 4.9 turbo, but it was scrapped at the last minute. The hood remained and was made fuctional for the Cross-fire injected 305. The S/E could be had with every option the Trans Am could, but didn't use the bulged hood. Leather seating was also available on all models. Firebirds were available with several engines. The standard fuel injected 90 hp 2.5L 4 cylinder Pontiac Iron Duke, a 102 hp 2.8L V6, and two 5.0L V8's. The first and most common was the LG4, a basic carburetor equipped 305 producing 145 hp. The other was a new fuel injected 305 using a fuel injection system similar to the 82 Corvette's 5.7L and producing 165 hp. The base Firebird came standard with 14" steel wheels. 14" aluminum and 15" aluminum wheels were available on the SE and Trans Am. Pontiac had also hoped to drop all the "Trans Am" badges from the new cars to save royalties paid to the SCCA for use of the name. Early promotional cars were marked "T/A" as an alternative, however the production cars came marked as Trans Am regardless. The WS6 option, available on the SE's and Trans Am's included 4 wheel disc brakes, P215/65R15 Goodyear Eagle GT radials with 15" cast aluminum wheels, stiffer springs, thicker front and rear sway bars, a high ratio 12.7:1 steering box, and limited slip rear differential. The Trans Am came with the two 305 Chevy V8s as Pontiac V8s were no longer being produced. The four-speed manual transmission came with the four-barrel carbureted version that put out a milquetoast 145 horsepower, while the Cross-Fire injected 305 rated at 165 horses came with the automatic transmission. With either drivetrain, the newest Trans Am was no match for the 5.0 Mustang GT that took the performance car revival by storm that year thanks to its High Output 302, which started out with a two-barrel carb, 157 horses and a Top-Loader four-speed transmission to move the muscle, but the Mustang was much lighter than the Camaro or Firebird and the 302 engine had a much better assortment of high performance parts than the Chevy small block forced on Pontiac. Its dimesions were reduced, wheel base was shortened, and weight reduced. It was also the closest in size to the 67 yet. Road & Track selected the 82 Firebird Trans Am as 1 of the 12 best cars in the world along with the Camaro. It won Best Sports GT category in the $11,000 to $14,000 range with the Camaro. It was also the 1st time a 4 cylinder was available in a Firebird. The windshield slope was 60 degrees, about 3 degrees steeper than anything GM ever tried before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naviathan Posted December 1, 2006 Share Posted December 1, 2006 Just incase anyone is unsure, basically what i'm saying is the WS6 has always been an option and started as just a suspension and braking upgrade, but has advanced to the body kit and slight performance improvements due to a beefier exhaust. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Posted December 1, 2006 Share Posted December 1, 2006 The WS6 option wasn't available until 1996 on the 4th gen Trans Am's so if it's a 1995 it's not a WS6. That was what my memory was telling me but I verified it here. http://www.f-body.org/faq/4/4_1.htm#ch4_1k The following is copied from the linked site. Q: What's included in the WS6 performance package? A: The package was available starting in 1996 on Formulas Trans Ams only. Included in the package were: Ram Air hood and air intake (like that of the Firehawk) The 1998s and up WS6s have a completely new hood with 2 functional intakes right above the standard non functional nostrils Freer flowing exhaust system Higher rate front springs (360 lbs/in) Variable rate rear springs (130-180 lbs/in) Stiffer front and rear shocks Harder bushings Larger diameter front anti-sway bar (32mm) Increased cooling 17 inch wheels with 275/40ZR/17 tires I have a 1994 Trans Am that started out life as an automatic and I converted it to a six speed car. It's not that bad of a swap and I had it completed in two days time with help from a buddy. Here is a great link outlining the conversion process. http://www.afrashteh.com/tranny_pics/T56.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naviathan Posted December 1, 2006 Share Posted December 1, 2006 The WS6 option wasn't available until 1996 on the 4th gen Trans Am's so if it's a 1995 it's not a WS6. That was what my memory was telling me but I verified it here. http://www.f-body.org/faq/4/4_1.htm#ch4_1k The following is copied from the linked site. Q: What's included in the WS6 performance package? A: The package was available starting in 1996 on Formulas Trans Ams only. Included in the package were: Ram Air hood and air intake (like that of the Firehawk) The 1998s and up WS6s have a completely new hood with 2 functional intakes right above the standard non functional nostrils Freer flowing exhaust system Higher rate front springs (360 lbs/in) Variable rate rear springs (130-180 lbs/in) Stiffer front and rear shocks Harder bushings Larger diameter front anti-sway bar (32mm) Increased cooling 17 inch wheels with 275/40ZR/17 tires I have a 1994 Trans Am that started out life as an automatic and I converted it to a six speed car. It's not that bad of a swap and I had it completed in two days time with help from a buddy. Here is a great link outlining the conversion process. http://www.afrashteh.com/tranny_pics/T56.htm That's what I couldn't figure out. The WS6 started in 82, but I couldn't find any info on it in the 4th gens until 97. Interesting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auxilary Posted December 1, 2006 Share Posted December 1, 2006 ws6 package was silent until 98. Almost the same as 1LE package for the camaros, it was a silent option until 98. In 98 SS/WS6 became an actual badging on the cars with introduction of LS1 motors into the F-bodies, and ws6 package got visual cues (double nostrils, etc). Another neat package you could order was the B4C package, which was the police interceptor package for 3rd gen camaros. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MusPuppis Posted December 1, 2006 Author Share Posted December 1, 2006 Ok, I LOVE YOU for posting that manual swap information, thats fantastic. If I do end up with the car this will be the FIRST thing that I do when I have the money. Oh yeah. If I get it.. anyone wanna paypal me 4500$? Ya know, like for christmas? Ha. Interesting... I need to figure out what this car actually is. He hasnt got back to me with he VIN yet.. That'll settle this whole discussion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Posted December 2, 2006 Share Posted December 2, 2006 Ok, I LOVE YOU for posting that manual swap information, thats fantastic. Ok easy with the "I LOVE YOU" posts. All kidding aside that was the guide I used for my swap and it was a great help. It's funny but the thing that scared me most about the swap was removing the steering column to swap in the new pedals. Here is a pic with the column and pedals removed. That was the first day by myself and I had the new pedals and steering column back in by the end of then day. The second day was when we actually swaped tranny's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MusPuppis Posted December 2, 2006 Author Share Posted December 2, 2006 I appreciate all the info. I'm going to look at the car tomarrow. I doubt I'll be buying it though.. I talked to the guy directly today some and hes a nut job. He was half losing it when I questioned him on the car.. Told him it wasnt a '95 WS6, they didnt exist. He argued with me for a bit then started to back-track and say it he didnt say it was a WS6 it just LOOKED like one.. Yeah.. Then I asked him about the VIN number. He sent it to me last night but the one he sent is 18 digits and gives me an invalid vin every time I try to run it.. I was under the impression it was supposed to be a 17 digit code.. I asked him about the VIN and if he could double check what he told me.. he started freaking out, asking why I wanted the VIN and why I was hasseling him, why couldnt I take his word for it and that I had to be wrong, etc etc. Then the looney went on to accuse me of bullshitting when i told him I wasnt buying the damn thing tomarrow. Told me to stop jerking him around.. Never once did I promise to buy it.. I simply said i was interested and wanted to get some info on it and take a look at the car. This explains why its been for sale for 2 years now, he gets PISSED if you ask him anything about the car. Like fighting mad. I'm thinking he expects someone to just hand him money without wanting to know anything about the car, and GOD FORBID you DARE to haggle or deal.. Good god. When I suggested 4500$ w.o. his stereo I thought he was gonna explode. Im still stupid enough to go look at the car, for no other reason than to see him face to face, make him look and feel a little stupid and get a laugh or two out of the whole ordeal. Gonna try to set up a race against the Festy to, he has such a massive ego I'll bet he'll bite for a few hundred, no questions asked! ha. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Some-Guy Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 When you go see it write the vin down and then check it out probly not going to sell it anytime soon if he is a spaz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MusPuppis Posted December 4, 2006 Author Share Posted December 4, 2006 It gets even more odd now. I went and saw it, test drove it to. Now, he has been touting this transmission for a while now. Saying its a fresh rebuilt 4L60E, very stout, shift kit, corvette synchros (I know little about auto's.. do they have synchros? lol). Yeah.. So, I take it down the road, blip the pedal, nothing happens. Like, the engine revs, the car doesnt do anything. I blip it a couple more times and get nothin, no lunge or anything. If I flatten the pedal the motor will rev, then the car moves but its sluggish to start and un-impressive. No responce. Auto or not, it should be responsive.. The worst was yet to come though. I stopped the car, and just stomped it from a dead stop, it cracked loose, got squirrely, felt nice, but it smacked the rev limiter and would not back out of 1st. I tried the same thing three times and the transmission refuses to shift out of 1st under hard pedal. I had to back out some to get it to shift. The 2-3 was fine under any pedal. Another interesting thing to note was how the car acted in 1st. It pulled to about 5k RPM's, then flew to redline, like it was slipping. Would that be bands or a valve body issue? I really dont know anything about auto's but something is flat wrong. His excuse? the transmission only had about 100 miles on it since the rebuild and it wasnt broken in. It also hadnt been driven in months or something. I think hes bullshitting. The car just didnt seem to pull all that hard either. I mean it was nice, but honestly, my SHO 'feels' faster and theres no excuse for that, lol. It was running rich as hell but I know it needs a tune-up. I dunno. The car was nice looking. Dirty, but in good shape more or less. Taillight is busted and it has a crack in a really bad spot on the dash, but the body is dead straight and everything seems to be in good working order. I'm still interested in the car but not at 4500$. Transmission troubles worry me, but hell, if I could get it for 1000$ or so cheaper I could go straight into the 6 speed swap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naviathan Posted December 4, 2006 Share Posted December 4, 2006 I think the guys full of it and there's probably a lot more wrong with it then what you've seen so far. I'd tell him to stuff it and go look for something else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MusPuppis Posted December 5, 2006 Author Share Posted December 5, 2006 Im thinking so myself. I'm gonna go back with some cash in hand if he has the car in a few weeks and make an offer based on the assumption the transmission is ♥♥♥♥. Thats of course if I cant find a reasonably priced DSM floating around here, and so far, that well is as dry as the rest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 I'm not sure that I would even give him $3,500 for it. That transmission is screwed and the LT1 cars are going cheap these days. Keep looking, you'll find something better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Some-Guy Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 yes if thats the case offer him 2500$ if he doesnt like that wait 2 weeks and do it again otherwise find something cheaper you dont want a lemon, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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