MrFancypants Posted May 31, 2007 Share Posted May 31, 2007 The stock Z brakes are all plumbed with 3/16 hard line. Is there any value in going to 1/4 or even 5/16 hard line? Im guessing that would make the brakes less responsive, but is there a reason to "upgrade" to a larger line? - Greg - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillZ260 Posted May 31, 2007 Share Posted May 31, 2007 I think what really matters in a hydralic system is the pistion size at either end and not really the size of the line between them. Guessing here, but your main benifit would be that there was more fluid in the system and would take longer to heat up, but that would have to be pretty minimal. Just my .02 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pop N Wood Posted May 31, 2007 Share Posted May 31, 2007 This has come up before and I think most people say there is no real reason to go bigger on brake lines. Especially with stainless steel flex lines. You're just not moving much fluid. I have read articles saying bigger line should be used for clutch hydraulics since they have to move a larger volume of fluid quickly. There is (or at least should be) a larger movement in a clutch TOB than in a brake caliper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nope Posted June 2, 2007 Share Posted June 2, 2007 as far as AN sizes go, i think AN-3 is the accepted standard for brakes and AN-4 for clutch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnc Posted June 2, 2007 Share Posted June 2, 2007 but is there a reason to "upgrade" to a larger line? No. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrFancypants Posted June 3, 2007 Author Share Posted June 3, 2007 I checked out all the fittings on Superlites and my prop valve and they are 1/8 NPT (3/16" ID). The outlets on my MC actually look a hair smaller than 3/16" ID. I was thinking of maybe going -4 from each outlet on the MC and then switching to -3 at the F/R tees, but I dont think it will really accomplish much. I looked at my '05 Frontier and it has 1/4" lines between the MC and ABS box, but then switches to 3/16" on the outlet side to the calipers. Thanks guys! - Greg - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrFancypants Posted June 5, 2007 Author Share Posted June 5, 2007 So after some price quoting, all stainless steel is not going to happen. #3 JIC stainless steel bulkhead fittings are over $70/EA Compare that to steel fittings at around $3/EA and you can see my concern! The tube nuts and sleeves for hard line aren't particularly cheap either. It will run me roughly $13 per tube end (parts and labor). Steel tube ends will be more like $5 per tube end. For me the important thing to keep stainless is the line itself. Is there any potential issue with using 0.028 seamless SS line with a steel tube nut/sleeve and steel fittings? - Greg - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nosms Posted June 16, 2007 Share Posted June 16, 2007 I am brand new to this site, but was told by some of my customers who are your members I should check this site out. I see from some of the user names more than just a few of you have been customers. Anyway my name is Mike Kenney and I own NOSMS or New Old Stock Motorsports we have been in the restoration business since 1987 and have been in business as NOSMS since 1996. A few months ago I was asked by a friend and one of your members (Andy Zimmierle) if I could make up stainless steel hardlines for his Z-car, like we have for other vintage race cars. We made up the parts and he was so happy we have gone into production on and now have in stock kits for most of the older Z cars. Kits included all Stainless Steel hard lines CNC bent and Flared with all the correct fittings ready to install. They make a weekend project into a hour or two install. Kits are in stock now. The kits run about $225.00 plus shipping depending on the model. We are also making the fuel pick up and return lines as well as clutch lines in Stainless Streel. You can reach me at mike@nosms.com or call me directly at 602-400-7725. Thanks you all for your time, Mike Kenney Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pop N Wood Posted June 16, 2007 Share Posted June 16, 2007 Have you considered the 90-10 copper nickle stuff? Easy to work with, cheaper than stainless and suppose to last forever. And you can use the standard brass flare fittings. many people have complained that stainless is a bitch to work with. Buy a good quality flaring tool and use a hacksaw to cut, not tubing cutter, to avoid work hardening the stainless. BTW, $225 for custom bent stainless doesn't sound like a bad price. Too bad I want to reroute my brakelines along my new engine cross member. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest DatsunGuy Posted June 16, 2007 Share Posted June 16, 2007 Hello all, I have seen the stainless lines from NOSMS on Andy Zimmierle's z car. WOW- I will definitely be purchasing a set of these lines for my 72 Z. I called NONMS and spoke to Mike today and thought I would also add that they are making billet lower control arms, bump steer spacers, and other stuff for Z's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrFancypants Posted June 16, 2007 Author Share Posted June 16, 2007 Decided to do the flaring myself. Here's the tool I got, Ridgid 377 ($97 shipped at Toolup.com): http://www.ridgid.com/Tools/458R-Ratchet-Flaring-Tool/. Very nice tool that has a ratcheting mechanism to prevent overtightening and also burnishes the flare. All the AN fittings, SS line w/ steel tube nuts will run me around $100. SS braided lines on all four corners will run me another ~$75-100. No more IF fittings for me! The CN stuff looks good but it's pretty pricey, and SS lines shine up real nice *BLING!* $225 does seem like a decent price but my final setup will be quite custom. It's difficult to build a line kit that works for everyone. - Greg - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrFancypants Posted June 20, 2007 Author Share Posted June 20, 2007 Ok.. next question.. Im not too impressed with the universal brake clamp options out there. Does anyone know of a source for the stock rubber clamps? Something in polyurethane would be best and I could get the metal brackets powdercoated. Has anyone cast their own clamps out of polyurethane (e.g. McMaster Carr stuff)?? - Greg - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IdfMF Posted June 20, 2007 Share Posted June 20, 2007 Greg, I just replaced my brake lines and went the 90-10 Cunifer copper-nickel line. I bought the line,fittings and rented an awesome flaring tool from Fedhill Trading Co. http://www.fedhillusa.com/ The line was pretty easy to bend. I did not need to use any tools to bend the lines. The rented flaring tool was extremely easy to use and every flare came out perfect. Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nosms Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 We have been taking obout machining the replace blocks and stamping the clamps for the brake lines. Just wondering how big the market would be. Also we have had some requests for CNC bent SS 3/8 fuel lines and I was wonder how much interesest there was. Thanks, Mike NOSMS www.newoldstockmotorsports.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrFancypants Posted July 7, 2007 Author Share Posted July 7, 2007 We have been taking obout machining the replace blocks and stamping the clamps for the brake lines. Just wondering how big the market would be. Also we have had some requests for CNC bent SS 3/8 fuel lines and I was wonder how much interesest there was. If youre referring to the clamping blocks that have brake, fuel feed/return and vent line channels, yes! Any idea on cost? I figured I would have to cast my own out of McMaster Carr urethane. For now I will just reuse the cracked stock clamps, but when I pull the motor and redo the undercoating I would be interested in replacing them all. I think the stock configuration is 5/16 fuel feed/return, 1/4" vent and 3/16" brake. I'd want 3/8" for the fuel feed and keep the rest the stock size. Cheers, Greg. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pop N Wood Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 If youre referring to the clamping blocks that have brake, fuel feed/return and vent line channels, yes! Any idea on cost? I figured I would have to cast my own out of McMaster Carr urethane. For now I will just reuse the cracked stock clamps, but when I pull the motor and redo the undercoating I would be interested in replacing them all. I think the stock configuration is 5/16 fuel feed/return, 1/4" vent and 3/16" brake. I'd want 3/8" for the fuel feed and keep the rest the stock size. Cheers, Greg. Yeah, the rubber on my 240 was totally rotted. Stock replacements would be nice. Altough it won't do much good for the V8 guys with larger lines. I am upgrading to 3/8 inch line so I decided to make my own to mount in the stock locations. I was able to make larger metal hangers that fit the stock on car mount out of stainless , then bought a stick of rubber from McMaster carr that I was going to cut and drill to fit the bigger lines. After making one by hand I am looking for a different option. What moldable urethane have you found? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nosms Posted July 9, 2007 Share Posted July 9, 2007 We were planing to machine the blocks from delrin. We will make sets for both stock and for the 3/8 line. We are also going to make a cnc bent 3/8 fuel feed line they should be ready in the next few weeks. The metal clips we plan to make in Stainless Steel. All this should be ready by the end of the month. I will keep you posted. You can also check out our web sit for updates. Thanks, Mike www.newoldstockmotorsports.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnc Posted July 9, 2007 Share Posted July 9, 2007 Personally I think your big market is the restoration folks and you would limit your sales by going with stainless and delrin for the line mounts. Duplicate the cad plated steel and rubber mounts and your market grows. Properly bent fuel and brake lines in stainless and cad plated mild steel would be a big bonus for the Z community. There are a lot of differences between and within model years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrFancypants Posted July 10, 2007 Author Share Posted July 10, 2007 What moldable urethane have you found? I was thinking of using the flexible casting urethane compound from McMaster Carr. It's a two part mix that forms like an epoxy and is pretty easy to work with. I've used it for motor mounts before and it works quite well. Should be able to make a mold and cast replacements for the stock parts! Delrin would be neat too, though. - Greg - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pop N Wood Posted July 10, 2007 Share Posted July 10, 2007 Wouldn't delrin be too hard? Durometer I think they call it? Would be easy to work with that is for sure Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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