Guest Anonymous Posted November 28, 2001 Share Posted November 28, 2001 loss is loss is loss .How much does it slip out the hole on a hard launch?? And 29 too 48 is the whole driveline loss .JUST WELD IT UP .Beleive me till I found it was The "V" I was gonna ask about the conversion Sorry for the scare but more loss ain't turnin the tires. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted November 28, 2001 Share Posted November 28, 2001 Well, I won't argue with you that loss is loss but the loss is only momentary. As soon as the inner wheel stops spinning and bites the tarmac again, the diff fluid will instantly cool down as fast as it heated up, which is a fraction of a second. To each his own, but I prefer an VLSD's no clutch feature and the handling edge it delivers, the R230 is probably the most robust VLSD you'll find. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavyZ Posted November 28, 2001 Share Posted November 28, 2001 I have to agree with you. I like the R230 in my Q45 so much, I'll LOVE it in a Z car. Shoot, it barely slips in the 4000+lb Q, so I think that a light Z will be no problem for the robust diff, plus it will be spinning a whole lot faster in my Z Just my $.02. Davy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted November 28, 2001 Share Posted November 28, 2001 dyno runs prove significant power loss through Vicious rears I got the lecture of loss .When I suggested one for myself.Just thought you would like too know!!Ain't life a BIATCH Sorta the same as a stall convertor when they slip they make heat . Heat =loss of power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pparaska Posted November 28, 2001 Share Posted November 28, 2001 I'm also having a really hard time believing this. It only slips when theres a different speed at each tire. Now if the tires are spinning on the dyno drums, yeah I could see that. But on the street, with the tires turning the same speed there should be no slipping. The gear carrier is spinning at a given rate due to the pinion turning it and the halfshafts will be turning this same speed (assuming no tire slippage), so there'd be no slip. Unless you're going around a corner. I'd want more info before I believe any of this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owen Posted November 28, 2001 Share Posted November 28, 2001 Hey Tim240z, didn' you grind those fins off??? Another question, is the R230 a 1-way, 1.5-way, or a 2-way diff? The difference, in my limited knowledge is how the diff acts under deceleration. Can the person with the Inifinity tech friend answer this? Owen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted November 28, 2001 Share Posted November 28, 2001 I will find out from larry where he gets ALL his #s.AS I AM CURIOUS TOO??I just sent off a e-mail so give me a day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted November 28, 2001 Share Posted November 28, 2001 Owen, Tim's website says that he thought that a little grinding on the fins would allow the clearance, but it wouldn't work, so he left them, it looks like he started to a little, but the new mounts he fabbed up don't come close to the fins, so they can be left in their stock form Kris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted November 28, 2001 Share Posted November 28, 2001 The LSD Brace page is my web page and actually the brace is for the R200 LSD conversion. Mark Icard whos car is pictured was the first to use the brace on a R230. Owen also bought one of the braces for his R230 conversion. The R230 VLSD heat issue is news to me. There may be something to it but I also think the % are too high. Dave... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim240z Posted November 28, 2001 Share Posted November 28, 2001 Cerberus, While you're at it, would you mind seeing if you can get any details on using different viscosity oils to change the lock up characteristics. I seem to remember reading somewhere that this is possible. Thanks, Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted November 28, 2001 Share Posted November 28, 2001 I'll try to get a hold of the tech or maybe ask Q45Tech from yahoo clubs, probably the next time I head over to get the CONSULT test. I've been over this plenty of times, but I just want to reassure the guys who have or are interested in purchasing the R230 diff that you will not experience any catastrophic drivetrain loss from the VLSD otherwise it would be an extreme engineering faux pas on Nissan's part. If that was true the 300ZXTT wouldn't be the succesful autocross that it is. I'll bring the straigh facts next time I post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted November 29, 2001 Share Posted November 29, 2001 Tim, The vicous fluid is sealed in what ever it is in, inside the diff. It is not replaceable, thats my understanding anyway. My very inaccurate seat dyno says 30% or so power loss because of the vlsd is inaccurate, I've driven my Z with R200 vs R230. Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owen Posted November 29, 2001 Share Posted November 29, 2001 Really? So what's all that fluid that dumped out in the back of my CRX? Do these things use two kinds of fluids or something? The drain and fill plugs are there for something I believe. I should open it up one day. What's the address to that Yahoo group? Owen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Modern Motorsports Ltd Posted November 29, 2001 Share Posted November 29, 2001 quote: Originally posted by Owen: Really? So what's all that fluid that dumped out in the back of my CRX? Do these things use two kinds of fluids or something? Owen Normal gear fluid Owen, think of them as all other diffs etc. Just a different posi mechanism that consists of a sealed unit (with it's own fluid/sealed/not serviceable, at least R200 viscous units aren't servicable). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted November 29, 2001 Share Posted November 29, 2001 Here, here! Here's what the good ole Q45Tech AKA Dennis had to say: "48% of 300 HP [1HP=12,000 BTU]= 1,728,000 BTU ....a home elec space heater is about 20,000 BTU --can you imagine how much heat 86 heaters would produce in a space the size of a differential? Don't think so the whole thing would melt instantaneously The viscous is just a clutch which engages when the fluid heats up then both the shafts lock so no more slippage in diff ......the whole process takes place in less than one tire rotation at 70F maybe 1.0-1.5 rotations below freezing. Remember the diff fluid is at ambient before you drive but it heats up pretty fast. Same with the 21.3% drive train total loss this only occurs when the TC is slipping so for 15 seconds in a quarter it is loosing 6-10% over and above cruise....luckily the heat generated by 20 HP for 15 seconds is controllable. Back to Physics: why not calculate the temp rise of 10 quarts of ATF at 176F absorbing 20 HP in 15 seconds less of course what little is dissappated by the rad heat exchanger and the tranny case. Idling stopped in traffic in gear the TC absorbs about 2HP see how the tranny fluid gets overheated. Any diff [LSD or not] loses 3-4% from the right angle power conversion so at a NASCAR speed of 150 mph in a Q about 10 HP has to be constantly dissipated....this is why it's finned and the air speed will cool it somewhat but racers and police cars have external diff coolers [similar to oil coolers]." One of the advantages of the R230 over the R200 is that is is serviceable, every year I drain out the old fluid and pour in about 3/4 quart of Mobil 1 75W90 gear lube. Tom, a buddy of mine has a '90 Q45: got a new engine at 230K, put in a new trans at 140K, runs 100-shot Jim Wolf Technology NOS system (which puts well over 430lb/ft of torque to the ground and it's really high-torque that tortures diffs) and is STILL on the original R230. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted November 29, 2001 Share Posted November 29, 2001 quote: Originally posted by Owen: Really? So what's all that fluid that dumped out in the back of my CRX? Do these things use two kinds of fluids or something? The drain and fill plugs are there for something I believe. I should open it up one day. What's the address to that Yahoo group? Owen I've been working on my neighbor's CRX for years and I never it even had an LSD, more or less a viscous-type. If it is, maybe it's the helical LSD. All the FWD LSD's I know about are the helical variety. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLKMGK Posted November 29, 2001 Share Posted November 29, 2001 No way to change the viscous fluid inside though huh? I know some of the AWD transfer cases can have their goop changed to different thicknesses and was also wondering aboout the R230. I want one - someone make a kit Seriously, I think it's a good rear and if all the bugs can be worked out (driveshaft adapter, CVs etc.) I'd be interested in slapping one into my car and selling off my clutch unit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted November 29, 2001 Share Posted November 29, 2001 I'm sorry to kill the suspense but for you expecting to find a chamber of special goo within the R230, but that's not the case It's the gear oil you pour in that handles the LSD engagement. Most 75W90 gear lubes already have friction modifying additives specialized for limited-slip use. I'm not sure if that applies to all 75W90's but I know the Mobil 1, Superflo, Redline and Motul ones have 'em. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted November 29, 2001 Share Posted November 29, 2001 Just found this while scouring the internet for info, though there isn't much... It's a guy selling the r230 brace for z's maybe somebody on the board? LSD brace for 70-78z Kris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owen Posted November 29, 2001 Share Posted November 29, 2001 "I've been working on my neighbor's CRX for years and I never it even had an LSD, more or less a viscous-type. If it is, maybe it's the helical LSD. All the FWD LSD's I know about are the helical variety." Sorry, I meant "while I was transporting my R230 home in the back of my CRX" Owen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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