Carburated vh45?

[Comrade_Charlie]

I don't think there are any manifolds to carburate a vh45, but could you get it to run without the ecu?... I don't know if it would be possible with the stock ignition, I know you can do it on a vg30 because it has a distributor, but I think the vh does not.

 

I was reading this thread, and someone on here talked about a dist. block off plate( It is the post at the very top ). And apparently some people do not like the idea of a carburated vh45, But thats fine I do not like the idea of a carburated l28, 280zs come wired up for the l28e so... I just do not like wiring. I am wanting to put the vh in a carburated vehicle.

 

http://forums.hybridz.org/showthread.php?t=91733&page=6

 

I dont think the stock intake manifold can be turned into a carburated manifold with the design of it. I guess you would have to go with a design like this, this is on a vh41. Looks like he has a separate ignition system.

 

http://www.turbo-infiniti.com/viewtopic.php?t=63&sid=d6ae9b257323442dbb0192cc83bdbcb1

 

 

 

So I guess the main things are Ignition, and the manifold. Maybe I think its just to hard to wire it up? Any good sites on wiring up cars for different engines, because it seems like a huge task for me,I love fuel injection, but I hate wiring.

[hoov100]

if you go the way they did with a stand alone ignition and a carb it would actually be kinda easy, but would be EXTREMELY time consuming if you where to keep VVT.

[Comrade_Charlie]

I would not even know how you would go about keeping the vvt without the ecu(assuming its controlled by the ecu). I just want to throw it in a 84 datsun truck fairly quick, nothing to be a dragcar, just the usual burnout, something to move engines around and to be fun. looks like the hardest part is the manifold(unless someone makes one). I guess this is kind of a waste of time, I guess Ill just go efi or not vh45, and just go with my first idea, which was a vg30i. I just dont want the z24 motor. I just love the sound of the vh45.

[hoov100]

you could always turbo a vg33 and have a sweet setup.

[Comrade_Charlie]

you could always turbo a vg33 and have a sweet setup.

 

nah the 280 is getting the vg33 turbo, already have turbo parts for it, bout to pick up a 33 soon, and I have a 2wd pathy trans. All I need is to make the mounts, custom drive shaft, and I need a turbo relocation pipe, and I think I need to notch out the frame rail for the altenator in the engine bay in the 280z. Ill probably remove the stock hood latch, and get hood pins(dont know, I think hood pins only look good on some cars), I want this thing all the way back in the car for 50/50 weight dist.

 

for the truck, I just want a driveable truck with decent power, my friend has a stock nissan 720 with the z24 and its sooooo slow. I think a vg30 will bring it too life. But I dont want a inline4 unless its a sr20 and id rather have the vh45 v8 sound(and power), if I spend over 1000. a vg30 would be cheapest for me since I have one and i have tons of spare parts for them.

 

What size carb would be good on a 3liter v6? 300-400cfm? I was thinking of trying a stock sbc350 carb.

 

Thats about as off subject as someone can get on here...

 

 

Edit, it seems that you need a Saudi Arabian dist from a carb nissan truck for the vacuum advance to run carb on a vg30... so im going to attempt to go efi with a harness from the junkyard, I still have a 1985 na ecu so...

[cockerstar]

Any updates on the project?

I like the sounds of a carbed vh45, but a carbed vg30 would be nice too

[Guest Widebodys30]

my friend has a stock nissan 720 with the z24 and its sooooo slow.

You haven't ridden in a fresh Z24, then, not one with 200,000 miles?

 

Those are actually an awesome motor, with huge amounts of potential.

A header, cam, timing changes, and two sidedrafts make awesome power.

Let alone if the are built up for it.

 

I had a 350CFM Holley 2 BBl on my 1986 720's NAPSZ24, as well, and would shame a BMW Z3.

 

From a $100 '90 FI motor, carbed.

 

But good luck with your VG30. My favorite motor, if you got the money.

[Orphan]

You certainly can but you have to run a stand alone ignition system. There is a motorsport category over in New Zealand called superstock and there are quite a few VH's running and by the rules they have to be carbed and 4L or less. They sleeve them down to 4L new rods and pistsons + cams and springs dry sump carb intake and headers port polish and rev them to 8-9,000 and make 450-500ish hp out of them, not bad for a 4L.

[AK-Z]

if you go the way they did with a stand alone ignition and a carb it would actually be kinda easy, but would be EXTREMELY time consuming if you where to keep VVT.

 

I would think that you can some how mod an old aftermarket vtec controller to do the cam switching. Don't know much about the whole variable cam systems. Wonder if fuel, in general, needs to be adjusted for the different cam timings

[tonycharger72]

You certainly can but you have to run a stand alone ignition system. There is a motorsport category over in New Zealand called superstock and there are quite a few VH's running and by the rules they have to be carbed and 4L or less. They sleeve them down to 4L new rods and pistsons + cams and springs dry sump carb intake and headers port polish and rev them to 8-9,000 and make 450-500ish hp out of them, not bad for a 4L.

 

I was reading through Lextreme and I think some folks on that site had gotten Megasquirt to work with the 1UZ - that might be a cheaper way around this?

 

But if all you need is a stand alone ignition ECU, chances are you could buy an old 2nd ECU which wouldn't be terribly expensive anyways!

 

I have a 1UZ and I actually really like the idea of a big 4-Barrel holley sitting on top of the engine - anyone can set one of those things up in a bout 15mins, they are great !

 

Its probably a little backward ditching the fuel injection, but still kinda like the idea!

 

Orphan - your in Canberra mate? So am I !

[Orphan]

Lol I just realised that was my first post, i've had an account for a while and just lurked now and then. Tony I was in Canberra until the start of the year and have since moved up to Brisbane. Speaking of the 1UZ thats what powers my soarer Do you know Neil out at rush imports? He has a S13 with a 1UZ in it, last I heard he was putting on a 2.3L whipple supercharger and going to push boost down it until it broke.

 

The VTC on the VH45 is controlled by two solenoids on the front of the intake cams, I'm not 100% up to date with how they opperate but I can dig up a pdf that explains how it works if you would like. It just runs off oil pressure so it might be tricky to get running without the ecu as when the revs go up so does the oil pressure meaning that less oil has to be let through to keep the same cam position. As it is just a solenoid it could be possible to have to run off a switch but then it would have to be manually activated and i'm not sure if the solenoid some how keeps the oil at a set pressure in the VTC system or if that was handled by the ECU. In short if your carbing a VH its not really worth the trouble to get the VTC working.

 

Do you have a S30 Tony? I was planning on putting together a manual VH45 260z but after working out all the costs I think going with a VQ30DET would be a much better option as the engine is much lighter has a factory manual that will bolt up to it, sits behind the mid line on the strut towers and has a CR of 9.0:1 so upping the boost a little or using a bigger turbo is an easy option for a little more power. The engine is 270bhp standard in the older models and runs around 6-7psi from memory so with a front mount and exhaust you could probably get a good 300 at the crank which is more than enough to push a 260z around nicely. And when the 3.5L sounds like it does the 3L turbo should sound quite good as well and be the perfect little classic sports car, not to mention the VQ30DET has a stroke of 73.3mm and a bore of 93mm which makes it perfect to rev up to 7,500-8,000 with just new springs and retainers. Check out the video link below for a 240z with a VQ35DE.

 

[tonycharger72]

Check out the video link below for a 240z with a VQ35DE.

That fellow does some very nice work!

 

That is Austin Hoke and he is on this site - he has a website documenting his conversion!

 

Do you have a S30 Tony? I was planning on putting together a manual VH45 260z but after working out all the costs I think going with a VQ30DET would be a much better option as the engine is much lighter has a factory manual that will bolt up to it,

 

Yes, I am currently stuffing a 1UZ into my 260z

 

http://forums.hybridz.org/showthread.php?t=143576&page=3

 

That sounds like my reasoning for going with the 1UZ - I was going to go down the RB30/25 path as I already had an RB30 turbo, but just couldnt justify the expense, the VQ is a great engine and can get half-cuts around $2k-$2.5K, which is pretty reasonable for what you get !

 

Would love to slap on a Supercharger, not cheap though and I could imagine the fun I would have rocking up with a massive cowl and supercharger sticking out my engine at the ACT pits

 

My 1UZ is non VVT, so not as tricky as the VH - I suppose if I wanted to run a holley with the 1UZ all I have to do is control the timing, bit boganish, but does appeal !

 

Lol I just realised that was my first post, i've had an account for a while and just lurked now and then. Tony I was in Canberra until the start of the year and have since moved up to Brisbane. Speaking of the 1UZ thats what powers my soarer

 

Hows Brisbane compared to Canberra?

 

I was going to buy a Soarer but decided I should put my Z back on the road, a friend has a Supra and it might just be, but the suspension on that and the suspension on the Soarer (ones without air shocks) look identical to the Supra - JZA80!

[Orphan]

I have his website bookmarked haha.

 

There is a fair bit of info on lextreme, soarer central and v-eight.com relating to supercharging 1UZ's. If you source a used supercharger and can do a bit of fabrication yourself it can be quite affordable depending on if you use an off the shelf intake manifold or make your own. The biggest issue is the 1UZ has something around a 10:1 CR which means you can't push as much boost into it without running an intercooler. I would honestly consider a front mounted single turbo on a 1UZ in a S30, there is heaps of room up there and you can easily intercool it but it obviously doesn't give instant response though with a well chosen turbo the 4L capacity is plenty to get good boost on by 2,000 rpm. Neil at rush imports did a basic twin turbo set up on a soarer with stock un-opened engine. From memory the turbos with a chinese knock off T28 and on a rough tune it was making around 400rwhp on lowish boost.

 

The reason I steered clear of the RB idea is the weight and length, while it sticks to the general Z idea of the straight 6 they are rather heavy engines due to the iron block, its also pretty hard to find an affordable engine in good condition. I still see RB26's + gear box going for well over 4.5k in very average condition and you still have to spend quite a lot fitting it and replacing parts etc. I'm still researching the VQ30DET as there is hardly any information around on it but as its lighter shorter and sits lower and is cheaper than or comparable to an RB set up it seems a good option. The 1UZ isn't really much bigger than a VQ either, mostly just a bit longer.

 

Haha the ACT pits are not fun at all for any form of modified car. I would suggest once you get the 1UZ in and everthing finalised and drivable get it engineered and take it over the pits and put the supercharger on it later though as long as its engineered I can't see there being a problem besides the look they may give you for beating them.

 

I quite like Brisbane there is a lot more variety and culture to the city but I do miss the roads in Canberra. Some areas around Bribane are simply shocking but the hills and twisties not far out of town make up for it, plenty of area to enjoy some driving and queensland race way isnt that far away either that said you do have wakefield near canberra.

 

I checked out your thread, amazing amount of work you have done on your Z. Can't wait to see it done Any ideas on what color you will paint it when its all done? I saw a Ford Territory today that had a really nice metallic almost gunmetal grey on it I wouldn't half mind, I have a long way to go before I'm anywhere near the painting stage haha. I will be down in Canberra later this year catching up with friends, if your not busy I'd love to come see your car if its running by then.

 

The suspension and subframes are almost identical, besides the shocks the only difference I have spotted is the JZA80 has two brackets on the front and rear subframe the soarer doesn't though in 1994 the soarer got the brackets on the front but i'm not sure about on the rear. Picture below.

 

 

Here is some eye candy, 1UZ Billet alloy block for a drag car. Will run you around 15 grand, too bad its not water cooled so its pretty much only useful for drag events.

[tonycharger72]

I have ventured into alluminium welding as yet, but certainly wouldn't mind giving it a try so fabricating my own manifold (using the exisiting 1UZ manifold) might certainly be an idea in the future - had a look at bullet cars and their prices aren't cheap for their manifolds, but they look to be of pretty good quality!

 

You ever heard of Adaptronic? I was looking at running this ECU - I figure that I will mostly likely be interested in going with some form of un-natural aspiration at some point, so moving to an ecu which can be programmed might be a better way to start!

 

Rush Imports appear to deal with Adaptronic and Haltech so at least there would be a tuner local who knows how to tune it!

 

The reason I steered clear of the RB idea is the weight and length, while it sticks to the general Z idea of the straight 6 they are rather heavy engines due to the iron block, its also pretty hard to find an affordable engine in good condition

 

I found my RB30 a really bugger to keep cool as well! Have you considered a 1jzvvti or the mighty 2jz? bang for buck they kill the RB's on value!!!

 

Yeah, there is no way I would wonder up to ACT rego with a supercharger or turbo slapped onto my engine , when I took the RB30 over (normally aspirated) they still knocked me back on a bunch of little things, then joked that no one makes it over the first time, they are pretty dodgy and do carry on as if they have power over life and death - it's very annoying have to deal with them at all!!!

 

Paying the engineer to have a quick look at everything isn't much fun either !

 

I was thinking of painting it British Racing Green - or possibly white with stripes, I am planning on flaring out the rear guards with metal versions of ZG flares and slapping on a ZG nose, with mods, so still lots and lots of work still to do!

 

For sure, when you get to Canberra or plan on coming down just send me an email - tonycharger72@hotmail.com - and come and have a look at the car, I think its still a long way away from driving yet!

 

I have been to Brisbane a few times and have always liked it, seemed like a big version of Canberra - still dosen't feel like a big nasty city like Sydney and Melbourne !

[DeleriousZ]

The VTC on the VH45 is controlled by two solenoids on the front of the intake cams, I'm not 100% up to date with how they opperate but I can dig up a pdf that explains how it works if you would like. It just runs off oil pressure so it might be tricky to get running without the ecu as when the revs go up so does the oil pressure meaning that less oil has to be let through to keep the same cam position. As it is just a solenoid it could be possible to have to run off a switch but then it would have to be manually activated and i'm not sure if the solenoid some how keeps the oil at a set pressure in the VTC system or if that was handled by the ECU. In short if your carbing a VH its not really worth the trouble to get the VTC working.

 

what about running an RPM switch or similar for the solenoid control? It'd be similar to the old VTEC systems on hondas, in terms of rpm's controlling cam profile.

 

If you have any specific info on any of the vh's specific systems I'd be more than happy to read up, I've got nothing better to do lol.

[Orphan]

I've seen the bullet manifolds, they are pretty decent but totally overpriced. All you really need is to get some laser cut flanges and you can do the rest with a welder and angle grinder haha. If your handy with cad and get a file for intake ports and location you could easily draw up a manifold and have most of it cust out via laser and just weld it together. If you don't want to fabricate your own I would just send Neil an e-mail at rush imports or check out soarer central and look in the supercharged section, I remember there being 2-3 cast manifold options floating around though all were pretty pricey for what you get.

 

I think a big single set up would be a bit more cost effective than a supercharger set up if you can do your own manifolds, even if you do a more log style manifold i've seen some very good response and power figures out of them - that said for back pressure reasons you'd be better off running two T28's or something of that size with 3" dump pipes and 3" cat back.

 

I indeed have heard of adaptronic and have fooled around in the tuning software which isn't half bad and the ECU's are quite affordable. Neil got his dyno not all that long ago and seems to be doing well, he had tuned adaptronics in the past and last I spoke to him he went to some haltech courses so he at least knows his way around them. I believe he also tuned the twin turbo v8 soarer that I spoke of before.

 

An RPM switch would be able to activate it I just can't remember if the ECU controlls it at all besides on and off. I will try to dig up the PDF about it.

 

1JZ's are great because they are dirt cheap, 2JZ's cost a fair bit but if you can get an engine with the 6 speed for a reasonable price you have a pretty much unbreakable combo but its still quite heavy in lighter cars and I don't like your odds of getting a 2J engine and transmission for anything under 4.5k in decent condition. I will most definately go with a VH or VQ engine, both are lighter than the iron straight 6's and shorter.

 

They do tend to play god at the pits. I thinks just because they are the only place that can approve stuff so they think they are big shots.

 

As for the engineers the prices they charge in Aus are rediculous, over in NZ its sub $500 to get a full car engineered for road use and the laws are laxer, its not so much you can have wheels up to 1" bigger than standard etc its based on if its safe on the road and structurally sound etc. I've seen people charge as much as $300 to item needing to be engineered in NSW, for what, 15 mintues of their time and ticking a box saying a intercooler meets requirements.. you can tell they are really working hard for that money.

 

Is the ZG nose that classic almost ferrari looking front end with headlight covers etc? I have to admit i've never been a big fan of bristish racing green on a road car but it will definately look like a classic with that nose on a Z.

 

I'll definately send you an e-mail next time I head down to Canberra. I totally agree it doesn't feel like a really overgrown city, so far I've been quite happy living here. We are actually looking for a new place at the moment and have found a nice 4 Bedroom place about 6 mins drive from the CBD and work for a reasonable price - I haven't really been experiencing the city all that much as I live a bit far north at the moment but I'm quite keen on the location as its walking distance to the largest food market in Brisbane. I love shopping at food markets, its so much better and cheaper than any supermarket and its a fun outing not waiting in line for 10 mins trying to get home.

 

Still looking for a 260, most around Brisbane are very over priced (ie restored haha) but i've been able to find a few out near my dads place up north that are well priced, next time I go out there I will have to check some out - I don't like my odds of getting one with minimal rust though, I really don't want to have to replace too much of the body if I can help it. A funny thing is my favorite part of the 260 would have to be the dash, I remember the first time I was in a 260 and saw that dash I really wanted the car haha.

 

Tony you don't happen to know how much a stock 260 weighs do you? I've heard all sorts of things and its obviously between the 1068kg of the 240 and the ~1300kg of the 280. I'm hoping its on the lighter side, most things I have read point to around 1100kg.

[tonycharger72]

what about running an RPM switch or similar for the solenoid control? It'd be similar to the old VTEC systems on hondas, in terms of rpm's controlling cam profile.

 

If you have any specific info on any of the vh's specific systems I'd be more than happy to read up, I've got nothing better to do lol.

 

I was going to do an RB25 VCT head conversion onto an RB30 - there is two ways can you do it, ditch the VCT or continue to use it, a friend was going to run very large cams so decided it wasnt needed as it wasn't going to do much good anyways - I wanted to retain it, but the RB30 block does not have a provision in it to mate up to the RB25 head, so you route oil from the oil sender unit up to the VCT unit on the intake side of the head,

 

To remove the VCT, you should just be able to block the oil feed! Check out SkylinesAustralia for how it is done with the R33 RB25 VCT Head when they do their RB25/30 conversions!

 

I have thought about it a bit over the last few days and am starting to really like the idea of twin turbo'ing the 1UZ - use two T25's or T28's and the Log style manifolds, there just wouldn't be enough room in there for equal length runners, I would modify the inlet manifold so it would have two throttle bodies and probably run it without an intercooler - for starters, I think running 6-9spi through each turbo would give me enough power for starters !

 

Wouldn't show up to Rego with two turbo's attached though, have my normal manifolds for that!

 

Who laser cuts things in Canberra?

 

I wouldn't pay Bullet car prices - or get anyone else to make me one I think, I would purchase a TIG and learn how , at the end of the day it would be a useful skill to learn and for the same price as purchasing a bullet manifold I could purchase a half decent 2nd hand TIG!

 

I indeed have heard of adaptronic and have fooled around in the tuning software which isn't half bad and the ECU's are quite affordable. Neil got his dyno not all that long ago and seems to be doing well, he had tuned adaptronics in the past and last I spoke to him he went to some haltech courses so he at least knows his way around them. I believe he also tuned the twin turbo v8 soarer that I spoke of before.

 

An RPM switch would be able to activate it I just can't remember if the ECU controlls it at all besides on and off. I will try to dig up the PDF about it.

 

1JZ's are great because they are dirt cheap, 2JZ's cost a fair bit but if you can get an engine with the 6 speed for a reasonable price you have a pretty much unbreakable combo but its still quite heavy in lighter cars and I don't like your odds of getting a 2J engine and transmission for anything under 4.5k in decent condition. I will most definately go with a VH or VQ engine, both are lighter than the iron straight 6's and shorter.

 

I am seriously considering getting one, bang for buck, nothing seems to come close to it! I have re-wired older cars, with points and electronic ignition, so I should be able to muddle my way through connecting up the adaptronic - but on their website they have reasonable detailed instructions about how you connect up the 1UZ, which is handy ! But also, having someone local who has tuned adaptronic cars before makes it seem even more appealing!

 

Have you though about the 1UZ or maybe even the VH41? The 41 because its basically the same motor but not as wide, the VH does fit, but things like your intermediate shaft might be an issue - I know the 1UZ fits and appears to have a fair amount of support, ie manifolds, manual adaptions for the gearbox etc, etc, etc - plus its cheap - but the VQ30, VH45 aren't that badly priced either, VQ35 can be pretty pricey though!

 

Tony you don't happen to know how much a stock 260 weighs do you? I've heard all sorts of things and its obviously between the 1068kg of the 240 and the ~1300kg of the 280. I'm hoping its on the lighter side, most things I have read point to around 1100kg.

 

When I weight mine with an L26 and a full tank of fuel it was around 1150kg's, when I had done the RB30 conversion it was 1183kg's - heavier than what I thought it would be to be honest, that was with a 60kg driver in it as well!

 

So I would go with around 1100kg's!

 

Still looking for a 260, most around Brisbane are very over priced (ie restored haha) but i've been able to find a few out near my dads place up north that are well priced, next time I go out there I will have to check some out - I don't like my odds of getting one with minimal rust though, I really don't want to have to replace too much of the body if I can help it. A funny thing is my favorite part of the 260 would have to be the dash, I remember the first time I was in a 260 and saw that dash I really wanted the car haha.

 

Have you considered a 280zx? I know the are not as pretty as the 2 seaters, but they do have their own charm, I have one sitting next to my car and the longer its been there the more and more I have come to appreciate it! and it does have benefits, its a much, much better made car, so things like road noise are much better - it has an inbuilt ZG nose, so aerodynamically it is better of - it does have pretty lousy rear suspension, but that can be righted - but they are cheap, they are really cheap to get!

 

As for the engineers the prices they charge in Aus are rediculous, over in NZ its sub $500 to get a full car engineered for road use and the laws are laxer, its not so much you can have wheels up to 1" bigger than standard etc its based on if its safe on the road and structurally sound etc. I've seen people charge as much as $300 to item needing to be engineered in NSW, for what, 15 mintues of their time and ticking a box saying a intercooler meets requirements.. you can tell they are really working hard for that money.

 

Apparently QLD is about the best place in OZ to get your car over the pits! Friend was telling me its more like how you described NZ and once you get it inspected and recieve your complicance plate you rock up to rego and someone behind a desk makes sure that you have the complicance plate, they don't sit there and go over the car!

 

I'll definately send you an e-mail next time I head down to Canberra. I totally agree it doesn't feel like a really overgrown city, so far I've been quite happy living here. We are actually looking for a new place at the moment and have found a nice 4 Bedroom place about 6 mins drive from the CBD and work for a reasonable price - I haven't really been experiencing the city all that much as I live a bit far north at the moment but I'm quite keen on the location as its walking distance to the largest food market in Brisbane. I love shopping at food markets, its so much better and cheaper than any supermarket and its a fun outing not waiting in line for 10 mins trying to get home.

 

Almost sounds as good as the Belconnen Markets , always wanted to move out of Canberra and live in Brisbane, just got to finish my degree first and at least start my CPA/CA qualifications or I won't get a good enough job and I will be poor,

 

Canberra is crazy expensive for rentals, have a mate up in Brisbane and as jokes would send him Allhomes rental properties in Canberra with the caption you could live for $1000/week - in Canberra overlooking Lake Berley Griffin, then he would send me property listings in Brisbane, for $400 you could be living on the 20th floor overlooking the Brisbane river !

 

Is the ZG nose that classic almost ferrari looking front end with headlight covers etc? I have to admit i've never been a big fan of bristish racing green on a road car but it will definately look like a classic with that nose on a Z.

 

Thats the one, makes the Z look more like the car it ripped off, well in my opinion looks like it tried to rip off - the Daytona!

 

I don't care for the Z grill that much so wouldn't to ditch it and fully enclose the front end!

 

I love white with racing stripes, but colour choice is a fair way away for me - still have to built the radiator support panel, wire the car, make fuel lines, wire it, remake the dash, etc, etc, etc - lots of work !