Have fuel and spark, engine still wont run, need advice.

[FiveSeventyZee]

So here's the deal, I fixed my distributor so I have a spark and its timed correctly for TDC. I know gas is coming out of the fuel line and I'm pretty sure its getting into the cylinders because I can smell it on the spark plugs. For some reason it won't fire up.

 

I had it going but it wasn't getting gas so I rebuilt the carb but after that it fired up for a bit, then sputtered and shut off. That was when I timed/dropped the distributor. Now it won't fire anymore.

 

Does anyone know what the issue might be? Its a 72 with a "89 350sb out of a camaro" according to the guy I bought the car from.

[grumpyvette]

drop back to basics, don,t assume you did anything correctly until you verify, its been done correctly.

first remove plug #1 and your valve covers and the distributor cap

stick a large ratchet/socket on the crank bolt and stick your thumb over the #1 plug hole rotate the engine until you feel compression building the rotor on the distributor should be approaching the #1 plug, now watch the timing tab and damper mark, it should line up at the TDC (TOP DEAD CENTER) marks , if its lined up with #6 and you get no compression on the #1 cylinder when the TDC lines up the engine needs another rotation,if you get compression on the #1 cylinder when the TDC lines up with rotor pointing at #6 the distributor 180 out) and the distributor needs to be pulled rotated 180 and re installed.

now verify you have 4-5 psi of fuel pressure, verify youve got more than 12 volts at the battery, and your getting spark at the plugs once the distributor cap and wires are installed, verify the firing order , use a timing light,and once it starts back off each rocker nut at idle until the rocker clicks than tighten slowly just to the point it stops clicking and then add 1/4 turn of preload.

verify the carb float levels are correct, and the throttle blades open fully,verify theres spark at all the plugs and verify the firing orders correct, and NO YOU CAN,T ASSUME ITS CORRECT UNTIL YOU VERIFY EACH STEP

 

this linked info should help

http://forum.grumpysperformance.com/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=609&p=810#p810

Edited September 9, 2009 by grumpyvette

[FiveSeventyZee]

Thats how the distributor was dropped. My dad and our mechanic did it while I was gone, they brought the engine to TDC for the #1 cylinder and the rotor was dropped pointing at the #1 cylinder. Then when I came home I personally did the distributor cap, wires and spark plugs. The firing order is correct as indicated on the engine block and there is a spark at the plugs.

 

I guess the fuel pressure may be it but I can smell gasoline on the spark plugs when I pull them. But I guess I'll get my hands on a fuel pressure gauge to figure that out.

[FiveSeventyZee]

Its been a while, does anyone know what my problem might be?

[jt1]

What kind of carb? When you work the throttle linkage, can you see gas squirt out of the accelerator pump nozzles?

 

Double check the distributor. It's easy to get one in 180deg off.

 

jt

[FiveSeventyZee]

I've tried two. I was using a Carter AFB when it ran for a short bit and I thought I'd give an Edelbrock Performer a try. When I work the throttle I don't see gas squirt on either one. But it ran before when it had no gas purely off starter fluid which it won't even do that anymore.

 

I can't switch the distributor. It's not 180 degrees off. The distributor I have has a notch on it so it can't be switched.

[jt1]

If you can work the throttle and don't see gas come out of the pump nozzles, you likely don't have gas in the carb bowls. You need to find out why and fix it. Fuel pump and filter would be the first place to check, second is a stuck float or stopped up needle & seat. Some carbs have a strainer right where the fuel line hooks to the carb.

 

You also need to check the distributor. I would make sure it was getting gas first, but I assure you the dist. can be put in wrong.

 

jt

[FiveSeventyZee]

I do have gas at the hose and when I took the Carter apart to clean and rebuild it there was gas in the bowls. But I'll look more into the gas.

 

I highly doubt that its the distributor because I have timed it myself multiple times thinking that I had just done it wrong last time but nothing changes.

[jt1]

Well, make sure it's getting gas and go from there.

 

Always keep a fire extinguisher and a old heavy towel or rag around when you're doing this kind of stuff. If it backfires thru the carb and catches on fire, smother it out with the towel quickly, and keep the extingusher handy if that doesn't do it. Watch for any fuel leaks, that's usually when you have a bad fire.

 

jt

[MaliceIntent]

my work truck is a Nissan pickup, which i know isnt in any way related to your v8, but i recently had a weird problem with it that i thought i would share just in case.

 

Truck ran fine for years, then just died one day while driving it. I first checked to make sure it was getting fuel, and it was.

 

I then checked to see if it was getting spark, and it was. ??

 

after many wasted hours trying to figure it out, i had it towed to the dealership and let them deal with it. Turned out to be a weak ignition coil...it was making visible spark, but wasnt hot enough to ignite the mixture.

 

Dont know it this will help, but like i said...Just in case.

 

-MIKE

[FiveSeventyZee]

I think my spark being too weak makes more sense than no gas because it also won't start with starter fluid sprayed into the carb.

[Scarab 155]

OK 570Z -- Chevy V8's are fairly straight forward engines ..

 

1. Are you getting fuel to the carb ? -- crank and if it pumps out -- the answer is yes -- if not, you have a blocked, kinked line somewhere

2. Are you getting spark -- on a dry engine (not after test #1) take off plug wire # 1 and see if you can get a spark to jump when cranking

3. double check the firing order - it's clockwise -- 1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2 -- make sure you know which post is #1

4. Make sure the engine is a TDC

5. Before you insert the distributor -- take a very long wide blade screw driver and make sure the notch in the oil pump shaft is lined up with

the # 5 intake rocker--

6. then insert the distributor with the rotor blade pointing toward # 1 cylinder -- if the distributor DOES NOT go in easily or with just a slight turn one way or the other, start over at step #4

 

The engine should start and allow you to set the timing

 

If the engine fires but runs so raggedy that you cannot get it to idle enough to set the timing, double check the carb -- I don't remember what carb you have but an Edelbrock is fairly easy to adjust. See their web site for a good video

 

Lastly, there are a bunch of Hybrid Z folks in the Bay area (I'm one) who will be more than happy to try and get you running. Keep in touch

[FiveSeventyZee]

I've done all of those steps and still nothing. I'm pretty convinced that my spark is weak at this point.

 

ps. where in the bay area are you? I'm in Marin and I've seen a really nice looking silver 240z not 200 yards from my house

[Scarab 155]

I'm across the bay in Contra Costa county. My Z is a real Factory Scarab -- VIN # 155-- You might have seen it on 101 when I go up North to visit friends.

 

Have you changed the coil and / or voltage regulator ?

[jt1]

570, did you ever get any gas coming out of the pump squirters?

 

If yes, pull a plug, put it back on the wire, lay it on the engine where it gets a good ground, make sure there's no gas around, and spin the motor over. It's best if you do this at night or in the garage with the doors shut and lights off. If you get a bluish white spark at the plug, you're OK; if you get a redish orange spark, you might have a weak coil.

 

If you've got gas at the squirters and a blue spark, check the distributor timing. Checking the damper to make sure the TDC mark is right is another possibility.

 

jt

[FiveSeventyZee]

sarab: no I haven't done either of those. and the z I've seen was at the corte madera library.

 

jt1: I'll check the spark color out. but I found tdc myself, I didn't use the timing mark I think it's a bit off

[Six_Shooter]

I would agree that a possibility is weak spark.

 

Another real possibility is fouled plugs, especially since you say you can smell fuel on the plugs. To me this means they have or had liquid fuel on the plugs themselves and would likely have a hard time firing off.

 

A quick test that can sometimes work to verify if the plugs are fouled is to pull all the plugs and heat them up with a propane torch, just so that they are warm, not hot, then re-install them, quickly, you don't want them to cool off too much and try to start it again, if it fires, go buy yourself a new set of plugs, and find out why your engine was so flooded that it fouled the plugs.

 

When you are testing for spark, either use a new or known good plug, or an actual spark tester, don't use the plugs from the engine, they are an unknown at this point and could show you a "waek spark", even if the coil is fine.

 

You can also check the plug wires, since that can also be a cause of weak spark at the plug. You can test by substituion, as in putting in a known good set, as in used ones that work, or you can use a DMM (Digital Multi Meter) and test the resistance of the plug wires, it should be a certain amount of resistance per foot, check with the wire manufacturer. Also a vehicle service manual such as a Haynes repair manual should have some general specifications for that as well.

[FiveSeventyZee]

ok well I got a new coil and it starts up now with starter fluid. I checked for gas and I no longer have any. I think that when I filled the tank it must have loosened up a bunch of sediment and clogged somewhere. any ideas on how I can fix the gas issue?

[Scarab 155]

OK.. so it appears that the weak spark was a coil issue -- let's hope you solved that one .. As far a sediment in the tank -- that hits all of us at one time or another -- If you do not have much gas in the tank , you can drain it easily -- there is a drain plug on the tank bottom. Get a funnel and a plastic 2+ gallon gas can and drain the thing. I know in Contra Costa County they have Haz waste disposal places that will take the bad gas. Just did this on a rust free 71 I picked up. Had not run in years -- drained the bad gas, new fuel filter, rebuilt the SU's and POW runs like a champ !!

 

If you have a lot of gas in the tank -- I'd put in a glass filter in between the fuel pump and carb -- This is not the end-state solution, but it enabled me to clean out the sediment a little at a time (each time the thing sputtered, I cleaned out the mesh inside the glass and ran some more) -- Did this until the tank was low enough to drain.

 

That should solve the issue. You can test by running a fuel hose from the pump into a gas can and by passing the fuel tank -- Be careful and don't blow yourself up !1

 

Keep me posted, you're getting close. P.M. me for my email address if you want.

[FiveSeventyZee]

Its funny i actually just finished testing by bypassing the fuel tank the exact way you described. but i think we flooded the engine because fuel spurted up out of the opening in the carb next to the metering rods. My dad and I are going to go try again later, i'll make a video to see if it helps you guys get more of whats happening better than I can describe.