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hachikid

cost for an LSx 240Z swap

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hello everyone. I'm a new member here, but I'm a long time Z fan. the 240Z has been one of my dream cars since I was about 13 or 14 (21 now), and I have about two years of college left till I get my RN. I was all for the idea of getting a Pontiac G8 GXP (because I LOVE that car, and it's the only trim level with a manual tranny option), but it's mega expensive. so, I'm thinking about the idea of compromising and getting a G8 GT, and doing an LS3 swap on a 240Z. can anybody clue me into on the costs of what I'd be getting into? I really have no idea on pretty much anything. not sure of the cost of a decent 240z chassis, any repairs needed (rust), suspension, needed aero mods (I know the Z produces horrible lift at higher speeds), LSx cost, etc, etc. I figure there is a wealth of information on this board, and many people who have done plenty of LSx swaps. I'm particularly interested in swapping in an LS3 (the one with 425hp), but not too hard up about it. I'm not too particularly picky with the engine, I just would like a 6 speed gearbox to try and get somewhat decent mileage. I tried searching, but "LSx 240Z cost" was too short, and didn't turn up any results. I also tried "price" and there was a whole bunch of other unrelated threads that came up. any help is definately appreciated, and again, hello! :mrgreen:

 

 

 

 

 

Joseph.

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I am at 22,750 right now. That includes engine and tranny too that we bought. That is not including the car $2K. Now car has been striped down already. Also new seats, big brakes and gauges and well about everything... The only thing left original will be the body. I estimate a few grand is still left. But it won't be a "cookie cutter, mass produced" car either. Also it won't have all of the creature comforts of a new car too.

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I have a bit more of an idea of how much I'm going to be spending. would anyone be able to tell me some good places that I'll be able to price out some chevy small blocks? LS/LT variants, that is. I've been poking around eBay for LS3's, and I think that may be a bit too much. if I can find one for a good enough price, I think I may go with an LS2 out of a GTO, or an LS6 from a C5 Z06. I'm looking for about 400hp, or maybe a bit more. also, is there a "preferred" or widely used transmission/diff combo that seems to get the job done well? I am trying to avoid the whole "which one is best" type thing, but I really am starting from square one. I've been scouring the internet for more information, and I'm just looking for someone to point me to some more popular options so I will have as much help as possible whenever the time comes to do this. I'm not a great mechanic, but I've done some wrenching (I work on my own karts), and I think this would be a good project. I just need to learn a bit more info. if anyone thinks they can help me and wouldn't mind letting me talk to them for a bit, pm me your number and I'll give you a ring.

 

 

 

 

Joseph.

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X2 on Juicy's response.

The trick will be finding a solid 240-280 foundation at a reasonable cost. I'll be into mine for about $8K and alot of labor, but that's before a paint job which I suppose will be another $5K or so, and wheels/tires at another maybe $1200.

Use a pullout LS1/T56 out of a Camaro/Trans-Am for lowest price of entry, unless you go with an iron block truck engine and piece together the clutch/tranny setup.

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It sounds like you are going to be driving this mostly on the street. If that is correct, I would echo what others have said about the LS1. I have an LS1 and I am running a much bigger tire than most here with LS1. I do have a 3.7:1 differential which may make a difference, but I can break the tires loose easily from just about any RPM in first and second without dropping the clutch. Granted, I have old rubber on there, but right now I am not looking for more power. I had a 100 shot nitrous kit and 273 heads that I had bought thinking about cam, heads, and nitrous but resold them on eBay because I was fine how it drives currently.

 

What I am saying is go cheap with LS1 and you can always do a cam/heads/reprogramming later if you are found wanting more. Now, if you can find as sweet deal on a larger displacement LSx, take it!

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yes, this is going to be a predominantly street car. I thought of a LS1, but it's only making about 350hp. are the costs that much higher for an LS2 or LS6 than an LS1? I'm looking all over google for places to buy LS engines, used or new, and I can't find any. can anyone give me a heads up on that? also, does the 240Z need any chassis strengthening? or will the chassis hold up to the extra power and torque?

 

 

 

Joseph.

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eBay, or search for salvage vehicles. LS1 on eBay can be had for $2K-3K+, LS2 for $4K-5K+, and LS3 $8K-$10K+ roughly speaking. If you are not planning on going over 400 hp NA, you don't need the displacement and can use the saving for heads and cam etc. and still save $1000. I bought a Trans Am with salvage title and parted it out. $4500 before LS2 ever came out. Parted it out and so I have less than $2500 into my LS1. The best way to go in my opinion. If $2K+ more is not a big deal to you, go LS2.

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Guest NESS89

I got my LS3 for $3200 from a 2008 Corvette and my T56 for $800 from an 02 Camaro, both from Craigslist, you just gotta be patient and look everywhere.

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the T56 looks like a solid transmission, and I think I may go with that (it seems to be the most popular option). can anyone give me any mpg tips? I've heard of the new Corvette's getting above 30mpg on the highway because of the way the transmission is geared. should I be expecting anything like this? also, because I plan to do just about a total rebuild (this is most likely the case), and I'm wondering if there is a preferred order. this will be the first "ground up" build. I'm wondering about an order I should do. should I should strip it down completely, replace any rust, get the shell repainted, then suspension/power/interior parts? or is there an alternate way to go about it?

 

 

 

Joseph.

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about the possible rust, as well. I've seen entire floorpans and what not being rusted out, and needing replacing (see this thread: http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/conversions-hybrids/889150-lasons-240z.html). is this somewhat common for 240Z's? I know rust is usual on 240Z's because of the thin sheet metal used on the Z, but how will I know exactly what to replace and how to replace it? I will try to not do this project alone (I have no experience in replacing rust, btw), and I see the guy in that thread was putting what looked like a new frame in it. it's not necessarily a frame, but it's bit metal bars that look like they are strengthening bars, or something of that sort. sorry if I'm wording this incorrectly, I'm pretty green when it comes to building cars, and I'm trying to learn. the idea of doing serious body work and sheet metal work is a little unnerving to me, but I think I can do it.

 

 

 

 

Joseph.

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On the subject of strengthening the unibody, for sure when you are more than doubling the power of a car, especially this one, you should look into subframe connectors at the very least. I bought some from these guys http://www.baddogparts.com/

and I think the time saved was worth the money. It was quite a bit of labor with a dead blow hammer to get the floor pan to cooperate, and then of course the welding, but the results look to be worth it.

061008 017_thumb.jpg

061008 023_thumb.jpg

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I had full length sub frame connectors welded to my existing 240Z frame rails. That and strut tower bars is fine for the street.

 

I got 31MPG on a 1000 mile road trip running mostly in 6th gear at 75-85 MPH. My car is turning 1850 RPMs in 6th at 80MPH with a 3.54:1 rear and 225-50-16 Pirelli tires.

 

My stock LS1 puts down 340 to the rear wheels. For the street you don't need more as traction is already a problem. Don't get hung up on the HP numbers. Find someone with an LS1 powered Z car near you and go for a ride. It will be plenty fast.

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Visit a few web sites from a few people who have done the swap and ask questions. Different people have different amount money into their Ls1 swaps. It also depends on whether you do the work or you hire someone else. For a starter I suggest you to keep it simple. Buy a complete and solid Z and drop the LS1 in and enjoy driving it. Email M1noel on here for the cost on his swap. Sometime I wish I took his route so I can enjoy driving my Z. Good luck

 

NESS89,

You got a heck of a deal for your LS1/T56 Combo.

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yes, this is going to be a predominantly street car. I thought of a LS1, but it's only making about 350hp. are the costs that much higher for an LS2 or LS6 than an LS1?

 

Uggg. You are way too caught up in stock numbers. And just so you know, car guys don't use flywheel hp numbers anyways.

 

Do you know the difference between an LS1 and an LS6? The quoted statement just seems ignorant. If you are worried about what GM said the engine made, than buy the LS6... The LS2 will make more power stock, as well as mod for mod, but it would not be worth the extra money to me. You can get 450rwhp out of an LS1 easily, and that is plenty for a street car that weighs less than 3000lbs. There are several people that have gotten 500rwhp out of the LS1 on a stock bottom end.

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yes, I am ignorant when it comes to the mechanical side of cars. I'm asking a ton of questions because I'm trying to learn and do as much research as possible before I start on this endeavor. I even admitted that I don't know a whole ton when it comes to this subject:

 

I'm pretty green when it comes to building cars, and I'm trying to learn.

 

 

the main reason why I was looking at an LS2 or LS6 is because I wanted 400 reliable horsepower. no I don't know the difference between an LS1 and LS6, I'd like to learn, though. also, I don't know how the reliability is affected if I start modifying an LS1. would it be cheaper overall to get an LS1 and modify it up to 400whp? and what do you mean about the LS2 making more power than the LS6? aren't they supposed to both have 400hp? I know the engines can be modified to a pretty substantial amount of power, but I don't want to sink a huge amount of money into the engine to get 400hp when I could have gotten a stock LS2, or something, that makes 400hp already. I'm just trying to find all this information out so I can decide which route is the most effective in terms of money and how much of a headache it will cause me. I'm normally just a driver, and while I've done a bit of wrenching on my MR2 and my shifter kart, I have never done anything like this, and I know very little about domestics. I'm learning day by day, though, and that's how I think I need to approach it.

 

and I will get on that VinhZXT. thank you.

 

 

 

 

 

Joseph.

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OK, I'll try to answer in ballpark figures you'll need to know... there are approximates and rounded numbers, which will also compensate for misc parts you'll need to find along the way

 

average price of LS1/t56 combo with low miles - $4500

 

JCI install kit + headers + driveshaft -$800

 

Belts, pulleys, hoses - $200

 

JTR radiator, vent T, and intake ducting kit - $450

 

custom welded exhaust, let's assume dual with X pipe, all parts provided by exhaust shop - $700

 

R200 diff, mustache bar - $100

 

If you're doing the harness yourself, you're saving a nice chunk. ECU reprogramming - $200 (vats, egr, o2 sensors, smog, speed governor)

 

Assuming you'll use a stock tank, you'll need a weld in AN adapter plate. Boiling tank, welding it on, cost of part, recoating/repainting - $300. Or you can get a camaro gas tank w/ pump (ie. i'm selling mine for $225).

 

Fuel lines, adapters, corvette pressure filter modification - $150.

 

Taurus 2 speed fan - $75

 

 

So far, this is at $7425. Not counting suspension, brakes, etc if you are planning on doing those.

 

 

 

In my case, I bought a running '02 camaro with 26,000 miles that was poorly damaged for $4700, stripped it, sold $800 worth of parts from it so far. So my LS1 (with LS6 intake manifold for that year) cost me $3900. I had most of the stuff already from over the years. I still have some camaro parts to sell off, basically if I get a grand for the parts, my motor/trans cost me $3700, and I'm happy with that number.

 

If you look at 240zprace's post about dyno numbers, he dynoed 346 STOCK to the wheels. only thing about his car was an ECU cleanup/tune. Don't forget that you lose the power steering, AC, smog stuff, exhaust restriction (camaros had 2 catalytic converters, really poorly designed exhaust, see pic below... you can see the flat Y pipe on one side)

 

exhaust1.jpg

 

This is why when people upgrade to true dual exhaust on fbodies, they see enormous power gains.

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Questions are fine. Just understand you are kind of getting the red carpet treatment here. Nobody has sent you back to the search engine yet.

 

Go here: http://www.hpsalvage.com/

 

Click on LT1/LS1 and read up on the motors. What was mentioned before about LS6 vs. LS2 is a displacement issue. You can basically turn an LS1 into an LS6 with a cam and heads, both are 5.7L. However, LS2 is 6.0L, LS3 6.2, and LS7 7.0L. So, mod for mod, there is no replacement for displacement.

 

But here, just bid on this and your problems will be solved. Maybe they have a low reserve. It is close enough you could probably pick it up. Then just zip tie a license plate on it and drive it home. I bet the cops wouldn't care. Its a project right?

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=300337593861&fromMakeTrack=true&ssPageName=VIP:watchlink:top:en

 

:)

Edited by maichor
My own typos annoy me

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So far I've got about 27k into parts labor upgrades and the car doesn't run. Did I intend on spending that much? No, did i buy while I'm at it parts? Yes. However with dropping as much as I have/did you don't have much left to upgrade or tune on the car. its not cheap, nor for the faint of heart.

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OOO! Maichor, that site is PERFECT! it has a TON of information about the LS engines, and it also sells them! that site is exactly like what I was looking for!

 

and thank you auxiliary, that does help me a pretty good amount. I'm starting to get somewhat of a figure to expect. this looks a good bit more affordable than it seems.

 

I believe I will just go with an LS1 since they seem to be cheaper and they are plentiful, and as maichor said, it won't take much to turn it into an LS6. I was most likely going to do a cam and valve spring upgrade, anyway, so might as well go with better heads to get a bit of extra power.

 

it's looking more and more like I'm going to take a welding class at the local community college next summer so I can learn how to do that. I definately want to learn so I'll know what to do when the time comes. I'm really feeling positive about this. I'm looking forward to learning how to do this, and of course, the end product. I just need to keep my head down and finish school so I will be able to pay for it all! ha.

 

 

 

 

Joseph.

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I did the '80's T-bird, swap, same basic rack as Mustang2 that all the hot rodders use with the stock Camaro pump. The racks can be had junkyard for $40 or new for about $200. Blueovalz had a nice writeup about his setup. There is also a Subaru rack and probably a few others that can be swapped in. Mine won't apply to JCI kits since I did not keep my crossmember stock.

 

I am surprised this site is still up. This was like 6 years ago that I did this.

http://www.geocities.com/maichor75104/mounts2a.JPG

http://www.geocities.com/maichor75104/mounts1a.JPG

Edited by maichor
added pics

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