PapaSmurf

Thanks sticky, I got the head bolted on, the timing chain and everything. I checked the wipe patterns and discovered that these brass valve seats are bad. This head is unusable. I wasted some time. So I suppose I get to start working on that p79. And while I'm at it I might tinker with the fuel injection. are there any good resources for cleaning up the fi system? The only thing I have is the manifold, injectors, vacume lines, etc whatever was bolted to the engine. This z came with FI originally but the PO removed the brain under the drivers side dash. I figure if I can't get my extra performance from higher compression perhaps I can get it elsewhere. So I'll port match the head and intake/exhaust manifolds and I'll be running the more modern electric distributor that came with the f54, and maybe FI - if I can get it to look clean enough with the stock manifold and wiring harness. I need to find an ecu and a FI wire harness. I get mad sometimes when I think about those 2 280z parts cars I had to get rid of. Every time I need a part I remember having at least 2 of them bah. I want to see what I can do to make a stock FI system look and operate better. 90% of why I dislike FI is the mess in the engine bay.

Thanks braap, This is an e88 from an l26 in my hurry to get it built up I forgot they came with brass seats, I didn't want to check the wipe pattern till it was bolted on for fear of bending or otherwise damaging a valve with it sitting on my cramped work table, I thought it might be slightly more accurate with everything together. Anyways I'm thinking this head is trashed till it gets new seats. It is using the stock lash pads, the cam and rockers are from my p79 though that shouldn't effect it. The valves are stock I know this because it took many hours to get all the lead deposits off them - now I wish I hadn't, that was probably the clearance I needed. I was hoping for a high compression head but there is no way I'm running this on my shiny new f54 block. I'll start work on the p79 I suppose. *edit - I just remembered where this head came from. I purchased the engine 2 or 3 years ago in oregon from an ass who scratched the 6 in l26 into an 8 so that it read l28. I wasn't fooled when I made the purchase, but when I got the motor home and got the oil pan off I saw a mangled mess of destruction, the block was bad. I saved the head, the head I have now learned is also bad. What a waste of money.

crap I finally got it all together, bolted onto the block, cam installed, timing chain everything. And I just went to adjust the valve lash and check the wipe patterns. I got the valve lash proper on all the valves but one, it's too tight, and I've run out of adjustment. The wipe pattern is all screwed up. The exhaust valves are fine but the intake valves are all wiping toward the front tips of the rockers, where the rocker meets the lash pad. Some are going past the pad on the rocker onto the unpolished surface by a tinsy bit. I'm thinking these brass valve seats may have slipped too far into the head. I have a new set of .180 solid lash pads from msa but that would just exacerbate the problem wouldn't it? Undersized lash pads would be what I want? Am I screwed here? Does this head need new valves and seats? Any recommendations?

I have a new set of lash pads that were for the stage 1 cam I ordered off the z store a long time ago. These lash pads do not have the recess at the bottom of them, they sit slightly higher than the stock lash pads. I was wondering if they were safe to use with the stock cam on this set up, the flat tops come up pretty high, I'm not sure how much clearance the valves will have. Any thoughts? these are .180 solid lash pads from msa, I'm thinking that they should work fine as long as the wipe pattern is alright, I'll have to test

Thanks sticky, I've already done that. I was thinking of taking it to the next level and matching the manifolds to the gasket too but my rotozip arm is tired. I installed the springs over my newly cleaned valves. I also removed a very very very small amount of material from each combustion chamber to try to keep compression lower. I also smoothed out the last few threads for the spark plugs that protruded into the combustion chamber, I heard somewhere that those could get hot and cause pre-ignition which is going to be my worst enemy. So compression on this head should be significantly lower than it was before I cleaned it up, and ever so slightly lower than it was stock. Now I just have to polish the cam and rockers up. I can't believe this head came off a running motor.

Well I've almost got the porting work done. I was going for quick and dirty but the ocd took over and I actually did a pretty good job smoothing it all down and removed quite a bit of material. It should flow quite a bit better. Now I was thinking of "molesting" this e88 -to use your words blue72. Just removing a small amount of material with the dremel from the combustion chambers. Any thoughts? I'm sure it's been done before. One final thing - I've been staring at this head for hours on end and I just realized that the combustion chambers are not perfectly circular. Not by a long shot. These can't match up with the cylinders perfectly, or the head gasket either for that matter. I was wondering if anyone else had noticed this and what the opinion is about it's effects.

I was going to keep them mated, but if I regrind them it won't matter. I just don't want the tick. I have like 30 old rockers I figure I can practice on them, rig up a way to get them resurfaced. I've seen people do it with belt sanders but I have to do more research.

Thanks braap! You tell me everything I want to hear! I usually get tackled when I hint that I want to save money and cut corners. I'll just finish up a quick and dirty port n polish and clean out that cam. I may switch to the other set of cam towers so I can run both internally and externally oiled. Just to be sure it's super lubed.

Thanks guys, I just don't have the money to send the cam in this month and really want to bolt this head on I'll just polish the lobes and rockers and see what happens. I've had drastic wear occur relatively quickly in the past by neglecting these things. I'm a bit gun shy, I rather like this new engine edit: I just re-read what you said. I've had offers from locals saying they would regrind my cam for me keeping the stock profile (which is what I want anyways) But that they couldn't do it if it was internally oiled. I'd imagine the holes in the lobes for oil might cause issues with their equipment. I'm certain a professional regrinder would be able to overcome this but my wife would murder me if I spent any money on my Z right now.

Hey guys, here is the situation. I have 3 cams. Two of them have significant wear on one or more lobes. One of them seems flawless. The rockers on the head that the good cam came from each have one horizontal line in them at the center from running loose lash. I know best practice is to regrind the cam and the rocker arms. I have seen first hand what happens when you don't. However I have also seen it magically work out alright every once in a while. The cam in question is internally oiled so it will not be able to be reground. The question I am posing is, since the cam itself appears to be in great shape, can I polish it, regrind the rockers, and install with any hope of it lasting for a while? Is there something I can coat the lobes in to raise my chances of success? I know that re grinders tape off the mains and dip it in a phosphate solution. Parco Lubrite-2. I've heard is used. I'm just looking at possibilities that won't break the bank.

also what does the plug look like in cyl 5? Compare it to the others. Is it fouled with oil? Possibly valve stem seals or rings/bore. When was the last time you adjusted your valve lash?

Haha that's what is known as a box of rocks

That would depend on a lot of things. First the cam rotates at half the speed of the crank. The crank is internally balanced and rarely needs to be rebalanced or journaled but if it's run dry a few times it may need it. Are the rings new? Is the bore good? Can you still see the honing on it? At 7700rpms the cam is really only at 3850 rpms itself. Honestly I'd be worried about the valve train at high rpms before the bottom end though.

You can still see the 3 angles on these valves and the head, but they are worn down in some places, rounded in others. I wish I had a machinist in town. I don't know if they could even re cut a valve that probably wouldn't help much would it.. oh well they should seal well enough. I'll have to start saving up for all new valves on the p79

Thanks blue72, that's good info! I was having trouble finding a good faq for the e88s different US versions. I'd heard there were 4 versions. So this particular e88 should get me lower compression than your earlier e88 would then. That's what I wanted to know! So I should be right around 10:1 with the felpro gasket. Dancing on the edge of premium here at sea level edit: It hurts to get bit by that grinder, these exhaust valves are just covered in lead deposits. Gotta get them clean though, every bit of material I remove from them means that much less compression. I'm also cleaning the tops of the pistons. ugh. Sometimes it feels like this hobby is all about cleaning. Clean the engine, clean the interior, wash and wax etc... it will all be worth it though

I'm not sure, I'm going to get the e88 built up, and bolted down. I found a nice soft brass wire bit for cleaning off these valves. It's working great. I've got the stem seals replaced etc. Once the e88 is done and the f54 is in I'll start rebuilding the p79 and look around for a good shop. I may have to mail it out to someone. The idea is this way I'll have a running Z, I'll get to experiment with high compression and see if I can tune it in well, and I'll be building the p79 up for slightly lower compression and the quenched chambers and slightly lower compression should make it a very nice head for street use once it's done. I'm going to get back to cleaning these valves - I let them soak in a pan full of carb cleaner for a few days and they look like charcoal now that they've dried out. But this wire bit is working wonders, the ones I've done so far look brand spanking new. I also compared the valve sizes between my e88 and destroyed n42, the n42's intake valves are only ever so slightly larger. I don't know if it's really going to make a significant difference. After I'm done cleaning these valves and ports up I think this e88 will flow very well indeed. pics: Flat tops come up just over the top of the cylinder walls is this normal Valves before and after: I'm having trouble identifying the version of this particular e88, I know there are several versions. This came from an l26 several years ago. It has the large E in e88 not the skinny one, but it also has the notches near spark plug hole in the combustion chamber. So I thought I would document it for you guys: I thought the 260z version of the e88 was the emissions version without the notch, and I also thought that the versions with the notches had the skinny E in the casting. Is this one of the mystical in between e88 versions?

Apparently the only machinist in the area wants to charge $500 just to shave the head. I'm thinking my money is best spent in other places. I can get a lot more power using that money elsewhere in the car. The suspension is already done, the brakes are pretty good with the 4 piston calipers and slotted rotors on front, still need the rear disk conversion which I could get, or I could upgrade the ignition system to something more modern from a zx, blah there are a lot of things I could do to this car for that much money that I would rather do. In fact $500 is a lot of gas money. I'm going to prep my e88 for installation. I will see how good I can get the timing on premium - mark a notch on the plate, Then I'll fill it up with something a little more expensive and time it, mark another notch. This way I'll be able to run premium when I want, and super duper when I want the power. I'm thinking it will be the best of both worlds. Maybe I'll put some of that 500 into a longer duration cam, I'm gonna need it with this compression. I could always use a standard head gasket rather than the felpro or even a 2mm gasket later down the road if I find I don't like this setup. That will get me higher than stock compression and allow the use of lower octane fuel. oh yeah my f54 came with an e12-80 dizzy too so that will be plugged in. Goodbye points, you've been a pain in the ass for far too long. I'm not sure if I can get this "new" dizzy clean enough for install though it is quite tarnished. It will make my shiny painted block quite ugly... I may have to paint it.

I appreciate his opinion and his point of view. Just not the way it was presented. I should have been more clear when I started this post my goals for this project are not to produce as much power as possible. They are to produce more power in an economical manner while keeping the system clean and simple. I have a perfect set of carbs that I have learned to love. I like the way they look on my engine, I like the way they work. I like that they require little maintenance and are easy to adjust. Perhaps on my next build I will go with fuel injection, when I have the money and time to do it properly. For now it would cost several hundred dollars and way more time than I'm willing to invest. I have a 9 month old son and I work full time. Which leaves me with only a few hours a week for the Z. I'm sorry if I offended anyone, but you guys have to realize that every once in a while other people have their own opinions and their own ideas of what they want. I appreciate the feedback though thanks

First of all, FI is for some people not for me get over it, I don't care. Secondly BlueDestiny was the one who reported he was using the e88 on the f54 with retarded timing. I am not going that route. Thirdly I will be as lazy as I want this is MY build

some paint on the block - I'm going to be replacing the front cover and the clutch, pressure plate, back plate etc. So I left them on. The head needs to be blasted too. I'm also going to be using my non-ac crank pulley so I wont paint this one. It's slightly lighter than I wanted it but it looks significantly better than it did

Update: I just found a stash of plastikote #208 pontiac blue at an obscure auto parts store sitting on a dusty shelf. I bought it all. It's not an exact match to datsun blue but it's pretty darn close for 3 bucks a can. I'm tired of having ugly engine bays, I'm gonna do everything right this time. F54 after removal of most of the accessories and manifolds paint test, looks good enough to me. The camera throws the color off a bit so the picture isn't quite the right color.

1. Those injector notches never caused a problem with my old n47 head and carbs, hell it might flow better, the mismatch between gasket and injector hole should hopefully just create a bit more turbulence keeping the fuel in suspension for a cleaner burn. That's just my wild optimism though it probably will make no real world difference at all. 2. I bought a complete engine with intake/exhaust manifolds, alternator, ac pump, even came with the hairdryer but the bastards dropped the motor while loading it into the truck and broke the hairdryer. I've never seen such wreck less disregard, I'm still angry about it

I just purchased a cheapo 10psi pump, I'll wire it to a switch in my cockpit (one more anti theft provision for the push button ignition) I figured a low flow pump would be easier on the carbs and yeah I thought about drilling out that fuel pump mount but then I decided it would be better to go electric - slightly less work for the engine, less noise, less vibrations. I always wondered about those mechanical fuel pumps, these engines were all carefully balanced and then they threw such a huge wobble into them on purpose?? So now I'm going p79 for sure, electric fuel pump, su's, ontop of the f54. ozconnection: 1. I apologize to the FI crowd, I know many of you have found ingenious solutions to make these FI setups cleaner and better but honestly if an intake manifold resembles a borg spaceship I'm just not going to mess with it. SU's flow fine they make enough power for me, I don't need to put 30 hours and hundreds of dollars into FI for a more crowded engine bay and 5-10hp. It's not that I don't respect your guys's work, it's that I myself am lazy. 2. My exhaust is set up for a round port exhaust manifold from an n47, it bolted up and worked alright with the n42 head though, it should fit over the oddball 6sided exhaust ports on the p79 too but I'm not sure I'll have to try it. I have the exhaust manifold from the p79 but like I said it's shorter than the n47 manifold and will require some modification to make it match the rest of my exhaust AND it has several sensors and a hose that was connected to the intake manifold that all need to be removed and sealed. I'm going to try the n47 manifold. It would make life easier. Now if I can get a hold of the ONLY machinist in town, and convince them that my cylinder head is more important than their current government contract I'll be able to get this thing shaved. In the mean time I think I'll start refreshing the head, and paint the block. Gotta find a close match to datsun blue.

Wow thanks for the link, I bought that f54 block today and ripped off the intake manifold and misc junk I refuse to allow on my motors. Fuel injection is for suckers. I have an e88 here that I could throw on. It would save me some effort because the p79 won't accept my mechanical fuel pump and it won't match up with my exhaust manifold. So I could run 92 octane with slightly retarded timing on that set up. Interesting. I wonder if the power would be about the same with smaller valves on the e88 and the mechanical fuel pump. By the way if anyone needs a fi intake manifold I got one, would trade for electric fuel pump and dampener. thanks for all the help guys, derek if I do end up shaving that p79 I'll let you know about the shims

I've found a f54 with p79 for sale finally, been looking forever for one of these setups. I was thinking I should shave it. I refuse to install a stock engine in my car. Now then the goal of this is to keep it running premium p79 should help control the detonation. I have a brand new headset from my last motor sitting in the shop but there are a few extra water holes right? It's felpro 1mm I believe so if I punch out those holes with the f54 flat tops, p79, 1mm gasket I'm looking at 8.71:1 to one before the shave. How much should I shave it to keep it on premium without pinging and what will be required of me parts wise? I have some valves from a 78, though one intake and one exhaust valve disintegrated. I've heard that if shaved longer valve stems are necessary to keep valve train geometry intact. I also have some over sized lashpads from the hotter cam I purchased from msa (sadly that cam is no longer with me rip) what about cam tower shims where can I find those? am I missing anything else?