HS30-H

Well, that's nice of you to say - but DO remember that my 432R replica project will be just that, a REPLICA. Only the Factory could make a 432 or 432R, and you can't make a real 432 into a real 432R either. I have got a real ( Factory ) Fairlady 240ZG, but the 432 and 432R were far more interesting and exclusive. Once the engine for the replica is in and running I'll try to post some sound clips on the web for everyone to listen to. With hotter cams, race-spec. exhaust manifold and the straight-cut gear-driven oil pump conversion it should sound pretty good. Alan T.

Here are some links to some of my pics: http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=56061 http://www.classiczcars.com/photopost/showphoto.php?photo=2762&password=&sort=7&thecat=526 http://www.classiczcars.com/photopost/showphoto.php?photo=2763&password=&sort=7&size=medium&thecat=526 http://www.classiczcars.com/photopost/showphoto.php?photo=2764&password=&sort=7&size=medium&thecat=526 That's a few to be getting on with. There are probably many others knocking around on the web. Its always worth searching for "PS30-SB" just as much as "432R". My replica project progress can be seen here: http://www.classiczcars.com/photopost/showgallery.php?cat=3069&ppuser=2116 Alan T.

I thought I had a doppelganger for a little while there..... Well, in Japan the 432R ( Factory code "PS30-SB", also nicknamed "PZR" in the Sports Option parts lists and internal Factory communications ) was the 'trickest' of all the S30-series Z cars. Essentially it was very similar to the Fairlady Z432 ( Factory code "PS30" ) - but it was what the 432R did NOT have that helped to make it special. Think of the American cars of the Muscle Car era, with long 'delete' lists, and you can kind of get the idea. The 432R was a Factory-built race car on sale to the general public. I guess most Z fans will have heard of the 432 - which was ( according to the Factory in their 1969 press releases ) "A Fairlady Z with the engine from the GT-R". The 432 and 432R used the S20 twin cam engine which was first seen in the PGC10 Skyline GT-R of 1968. This engine was a road-going version of the Prince GR-8 race engine first used on the Prince and Nissan R380 series Sports racers. There were thousands of differences between the 432 and the L-series engined Fairladies, but the 432R had hundreds of differences from the 'normal' 432. Difference No.1 was a quite different bodyshell ( although they both shared the "PS30" prefixed VIN ) with some areas strengthened and some areas lightened in comparison to the stock shell. Listing them all up here would be crazy - but for example the roof skin and rear quarters of the R had different part numbers to the normal 432. Big VISUAL clues to the differences between the R and the normal 432 were, for example: Deletion of the spare wheel well ( in order to accomodate the 100 Litre fuel tank ) FRP Hood, Tailgate, Front Valance ( different shape ) and Engine / Transmission covering belly pan ( very long ). All windows made from Acrylic, except front screen - which was clear ( no tint ). Cloth-covered FRP bucket seats with vinyl-covered head rests. Deletion of heater ( although some road cars had these retro-fitted for demisting help ) and blanking of the eyeball vents in the dash. In fact, these were not even cut out in the first place - so its wrong to call them 'blanked'. Deletion of the Console. The Ignition Switch was moved down to a bracket welded behind the gearlever, to make it easier to use when wearing a race harness. No sound-deadening at all, and just vinyl / rubber interior coverings on floor and cargo area. 100 Litre fuel gauge. 10,000 RPM tachometer. No Brake Servo ( Booster / MasterVac ) with bigger Brake Master Cylinder. Different Brake Pedal. Different Accelerator Pedal. Non-dipping interior mirror. Only one Sun Visor ( for driver ). The list goes on and on.................... Mechanically, the 432 and 432R were pretty much identical to eachother, with the earliest versions having the FS5C71-A five-speed overdrive transmission ( quite close ratios ). Both had the big R192 Diff ( known as the R190 in the USA ) with a 4.44 ratio and four-pinion LSD. Spring rates and damper rates were the same on both the 432 and 432R - but these were considerably stiffer than the Japanese domestic market Z and Z-L models ( which in turn were more stiffly sprung than the USA market version ). The R usually came with plain steel wheels from the Factory, whereas the plain 432 usually came with the Kobe Seiko "Mag" wheels ( which actually WERE Magnesium ). I could go on about the more minute differences but you will all fall asleep...................... The Factory made something approaching 500 432 models ( the number of 420 built is usually quoted by the Factory - but this is acknowledged to be something less than 100% accurate by specialists in Japan ). The total of 432 models built includes something between 17 and 35 "R" models, although it depends who you talk to. The Factory used up something like 10 to 15 cars in their domestic race programme, and there were around 17 sold to the general public in Japan - and not all of these were road registered. Interestingly, the Works ( SCCN ) team in Japan won their first L6-powered Z races in "PS30" prefixed bodyshells. Yes - you read that right. When they decided to step up in the capacity class from 2 litre to 2.4 Litre, they simply installed L24 engines in their old race 432R bodies................ I've been learning about these cars ever since I first went to Japan in the mid-Eighties. I've been lucky enough to drive a few, and have followed the strip and restoration of two genuine "R" models too. They are totally fascinating to me. Nobody should doubt that Matsuo and his team put a lot of effort and thought into these variants right from the very beginning of the design process. The 432 and 432R were a LOT more than just their illustrious engine - these cars were QUITE different to the L-series engined variants. In fact, ALL early Z cars ( whether "Export" or Domestic market versions ) carry details on them that are there purely because they needed to be there for the 432................. Don't start thinking that these are rip-snorting track terrors though. The S20 is indeed a high-revving low-torque and very peaky motor, which sounds faster than it really is. The thing that makes the 432 and 432R work so well is the combination of the S20 in a lightweight no-frills shell coupled to a nice close-ratio five speed and that 4.44 LSD rear end. Add in nicely stiff springs, dampers and roll-bars, and the high-ratio steering knuckles ( standard on the 432 and 432R ) and you start to realise what a great little package this is. They truly are a joy to drive. I'm building a 432R replica at the moment. Many of the details will be correct and genuine parts. I have an S20 engine ( now mid rebuild ) and a mid-1970 "S30" ( Fairlady ZL ) bodyshell to put it in. Drawings are complete for the accurate replica of the 100 Litre tank, and I even have a genuine R 100 Litre tank gauge. I have genuine Factory cloth buckets and R type interior trim. Tailgate and Hood ( Bonnet ) are in FRP and all glass except the screen is Acrylic with the "Nissan" heat-stamp mark. I have 6 genuine Works "Rally" magnesium wheels. It might be running mid-2004 unless cash-flow holds me up longer. That oft-quoted fact of the 432 being "most famous for" its use as a Highway Patrol car in Japan is a little annoying. In fact, only two cars were ever used ( they were both 'ordinary' 432 models, and not R's ) and they were not suitable to the use as a pursuit car - with long-periods idle and then a sudden thrashing from cold in pursuit of a speeding driver. This pretty much killed the S20 engines - which need careful warm-up and gentle use until up to temp. The 432R scored Nissan's first Z car race wins in Japan, and should be remembered for this as much as anything else. Apologies for the long post. These cars are my 'pet' subject................. Alan T.

So who's this "HLS30" character?

Well, those sources were wrong. This urban myth keeps popping up like a rubber biscuit bouncing around in an oil tanker. Please somebody put on a catcher's mitt and get a hold of it................ The story has been put to bed here on HybridZ more than once, as far as I can remember. To put it in a nutshell, The Prince Motor Company licensed some Mercedes patents for their "G" series engines in the mid-Sixties. When Prince merged with Nissan these licensed patents were carried across to the "L" series engines. Neither Prince nor Nissan COPIED any Mercedes engine, and the patents and ideas they used were confined to elements of the cam gear train. That scan of the Japanese magazine article about the O.S.GIKEN twin cam head contains a BIG typo; it was called the "T.C. 24 B1" - not the "T.G. 24 B1". Alan T ( rumour scotching department ).

Pete, You put your points very well. If you want to go for what is aesthetically pleasing to you, then that's a great set of rules to stick to. For myself, I too find that what is aesthetically pleasing to me is not necessarily what is pleasing to others. Yes its subjective, and with subjectivity being subjective - well, we are going nowhere! I actually LIKE the 'tacked on' look of the Factory Overfenders. Reminds me of details from race cars that I grew up with. I'm sure that's what Matsuo and his team had in mind. By the way, the proper Factory attachment for the Overfenders was with steel ( not alloy ) Pop rivets - not bolts. Even more 'rough'............. Your Fairlady expert got it right about the taxation class element to the placement of the Fender Mirrors, but missed the other consideration - safety. Japanese laws of the time stipulated that rear-view mirrors should not be a risk to pedestrians or cyclists / motorcyclists. Anything that could 'hook' the clothing of that category of road user ( yes - many small streets in Japan have no delineation between pavement ( sidewalk ) and road ) was basically deemed illegal. Hence the little rubber wedges between the rear bumper ends and the body. The fact that the Fender Mirrors don't require much head movement in the user is simply a function of their position so far away from his head. The ZG went up into a higher taxation bracket ( 33 number ) with its Overfenders and longer nose, as indeed did the Fairlady 240Z models when they were offered in the Japanese market from late 1971. You will notice that the position of the mirrors went unchanged, as safety was still a factor even when taxation class no longer was. Safety considerations sometimes contribute to form and function. I'm used to people telling me that the Fenders Mirrors on my car can't be as good or as easy to use as their door mirrors. Somehow they don't actually WANT to think that they might both work OK. All the best, Alan T.

Well then we at least are thinking along the same lines. However, don't throw the baby out with the bath water. Just 'cos the "JDM" ( God I hate that acronym ) freaks think some things are cool it does not make those things automatically crap. For example, I see people on here and elsewhere sometimes writing things about Hondas, and I find it hard to relate to them. OK - I'm from the other side of the Atlantic, but we have our equivalent of the 'Ricers' over here too - so I can relate to WHO is being talked about. What is dangerous is to tar the product and manufacturer with the same brush as you do these kids. They are not the same thing. Honda make a good product and they take very seriously what they do. They also have ( what I consider to be ) a proven record in competition. I think any car manufacturer that indulges in competition is to be applauded and taken seriously. Its a shame that a whole section of the performance-car loving crowd now associate Honda with these kids. There is always an element of the wrong-headed and poor-taste crowd in every scene. For my part, I don't want the fact that some dimwits have caught on to a 'look' and made it a 'fad' to diminish what I know and love. Hopefully they will move onto something else soon. I'll come across as something of an elitist I'm sure. However, I just want people to understand more of the Japanese side of the story. Like I said, roots are important.

Mat, your link was very useful - thanks. I've ended up with very similar SPRING rates to you ( mine are 180lb front and 200lb rear 10 Inch long 2.25 diameter) - mainly because I sometimes have to drive the car on torn-up urban roads here in London. Some of our country roads have some pretty nasty 'surprises' on them too. I've come down quite a long way on spring rate over the last year ( in three increments ) and ended up with these. I had the dampers re-valved by Bilstein's UK operation each time. Now I'm at 180 Bump-110 Rebound for the fronts, and 210 Bump-120 Rebound rear. I have Rose ( Heim ) jointed and adjustable TCA's and Tension Rods. Also have Uniballs in the ( solid ) top insulators / mounts that you can see in the photos of my set-up posted previously. I think these are not ideal for my needs and might try to find a way to go back to a rubber-bushed set-up in the near future. Interestingly, this very point was raised several times by some fine minds in your excellent thread. All the best, Alan T.

Those are SPRING rates. I'm talking about BUMP and REBOUND rates for Shock Absorbers / Dampers. I've seen good posts from John Coffey about this - but surely he isn't the only one here who knows what rates he uses? Alan T.

Not much mention of bump and rebound rates in this thread, or in other threads. What rates are people on here using? Alan T.

[quote="gramercyjam" Nice setup Alan. Do those Bilsteins screw on to the uprights? --John B That's a complete custom-made tube welded onto the original stub axle casting. It has a thread cut into it which the adjustable lower spring perch sits on. The gas damper unit feeds down into it, and the thin threaded rod screws into a threaded hole at the bottom of the tube. Its lock-nutted from underneath the tube. The thicker upper tube ( which contains the gas charge and the valving ) moves up and down in the new tube, and the thin rod stays still. Essentially, the inner unit is inverted in comparison to a 'normal' layout. The upper insulator is aluminium with a uniball inside it. Its not 'off-the-shelf' stuff - its all custom-fabbed. Pictures explain better than I can, so you can see an 'exploded' view of one of the fronts here: http://alansphotos.fotopic.net/photo.php?id=1239113 http://alansphotos.fotopic.net/photo.php?id=1239114 http://alansphotos.fotopic.net/photo.php?id=1239115 http://alansphotos.fotopic.net/photo.php?id=1239116 http://alansphotos.fotopic.net/photo.php?id=1239117 Alan T.

Those Bilsteins are mine. For anyone that does not know why they look so thick at the top - its because they are 'upside down'. The thin rod is inside the tube of the leg, and the bump-stop is at the very bottom. This is very much like you see on high performance motorcycles. Advantages? Well, the thicker and more stable the moving parts the better, amongst other things. Disadvantages? The price. Alan T.

http://alansphotos.fotopic.net/show_collection.php?id=42289 Alan T. ( PS - Don't you think you really need to concentrate on getting the work you are doing now finished before you get too involved with dreaming about this stuff?......... ).

I have two. What do you want to know? Alan T.

Hi John, Sounds like you have what is usually known as an "R192" in Japan. This was standard equipment on the PS30 Fairlady Z432 and PS30-SB Z432-R, as well as the PGC10 & KPGC10 Skyline GT-Rs. I have a full list of part numbers for the components on these diffs. Shoot me a PM if you need to know anything. Best regards, Alan Thomas. London, UK.

Hi shortyz, Don't be tempted to undo the gland nut! You'll let all the gas charge out. Don't take your strip-down any further than taking the springs off. They should rebound medium fast ( hard to describe it - but they won't SHOOT back up all that quickly if they are still charged and sealed properly ). Nissan tended to build these Option struts with pretty high bump and rebound rates, but with a relatively soft spring rate. That's kind of opposite to what people tend to run for hard street and track work these days. The Option struts echoed what Nissan were using for their track cars ( in Japan ) and rally cars in the early Seventies, and many people are surprised by the damping and spring rates they used to use. Added to that, the Option struts use a full-sized spring with a wide platform that does not give the clearance of the now common 2.25 springs with their wide choice of spring rates and lengths. Alan T.

Atsugi is indeed the name of a town - but so is Saginaw. These parts were made by a company called Atsugi, which is affiliated to Nissan. Its not unusual for a company to use the name of the local town. Sounds like these are indeed the Nissan Sports Option legs as I suspected. The number you have given is for just one leg ( the FRONT LEFT ) and the others will have different part numbers: *54302 - E4622 = FRONT RIGHT *54303 - E4622 = FRONT LEFT *55302 - E4622 = REAR RIGHT *55303 - E4622 = REAR LEFT shortyz, I have sent you a PM with more information. All the best, Alan T.

Hi Mike ( ON3GO ). Yes, the car in the pic has Overfenders that are wider than the genuine ZG Overfenders - so they must be aftermarket. A little-known fact is that the part numbers for the ZG-type "Overfenders" were actually the same as those for the Fairlady 432-R ( PS30-SB model ) which became available from 1970 - a full two years before the debut of the ZG model. They even had the same Nissan part numbers, so really its a grey area as to whether the Overfenders on the original ZG are actually the 432-R Overfenders or ZG Overfenders..................... The Overfenders on the car in the picture are wider than the standard ZG items - and are therefore aftermarket parts. The wider than stock Overfenders associated with the "Type A" and "Type B" Works /Sports Option aero package were NOT like those in the picture. Please do not confuse the wider "Type A" and "Type B" Overfenders available from the Sports Option lists in Japan with the ones that you see on the car in the photos. The ones on the car in the photo are NOT Factory parts, and therefore its difficult to pin down the supplier. They could have been made by any number of companies in Japan, and they even may be copies of copies. They are NOT replicas or versions of Nissan Factory parts - so its impossible for me to guess the supplier, Sorry. Please do not call them "ZG" flares, as they are NOT the same thing at all. I will have to look into the supplier situation of these parts in Japan for you. With respect, I have to point out a couple of other points too: The fender-mount mirrors that you see on the car in the photo are no different to the fender-mount mirrors that are seen on other early models of Japanese domestic market Z cars. There is no such thing as a ZG mirror; they are the same as those on the other models. The front indicator lenses on the early Japanese domestic market S30-series Z cars were amber. The clear or 'white' lenses were not correct for the Japanese domestic market models. This applies to the ZG model too. It had amber lenses from the Factory. The rear bumper on the ZG model was painted in the same metallic Gunmetal grey colour as the Overfenders, front Bumper and lower panel. It was not chromed. It also had an additional rubber trim in the centre of the bumper that joined the two corner trims. Alan T.

Hi dantm, Thanks to inZane 240 for namechecking me. First, a quick heads-up; ALL Japanese domestic market S30-series Z cars were called Fairladies. All the subsequent models too for that matter, but you seem to be interested in the S30-series of "Fairlady Z" - so we'll stick to that series for this thread. The picture that you attached shows a fairly well-known car ( at least its fairly well known on the Web ) and I believe that it belongs to a gentleman named Mr Miya in Japan. When you look at that car, you will notice the body differences between his car and the 'normal' shaped S30-series Z cars ( as were delivered to the USA / North American market - where I believe you reside ). The main differences are the extra pieces at the front of the car ( the longer 'sugar scoop' headlamp cowlings with their plexiglass and stainless steel covers, the Bonnet - sorry Hood - extension, the Urethane front bumper and the extended lower body panel ). You will also notice the fibreglass "Overfenders" that are pop-riveted to the wheelarches. What you cannot see is that this car also has different Bonnet - sorry Hood - hinges to the 'normal' bodied cars. In fact the car in the picture is a replica of a limited-edition model of Fairlady called the "Fairlady 240ZG". Its Factory model code was "HS30-H", and it is commonly called the "ZG" or "G-Nose". It was built by Nissan between late 1971 and late 1973, and was a special model intended to homologate aerodynamic body parts for Nissan's Group 4 circuit race cars in Japan. Once the Factory had built and sold a certain quantity of this model to the general public ( 400 examples were stipulated for Group 4 at that time ) it allowed them to use even more radical equipment - based on the standard production model - for their domestic circuit racing programme. Nissan also made these parts ( and the more radical versions of them too ) available to the general public, and to privateer race teams, through their "Sports Option" parts lists in Japan. These parts lists were a wealth of performance equipment not usually seen outside Japan. Some of these items were sold via Datsun Competition in the USA - but only a comparatively small proportion of them. However, the "G-Nose" panels DID make their way to Datsun Competition in the USA ( or at least a very few of them did ) and were sold to racers and street performance enthusiasts. Thereafter, fibreglass copies of the real ( 5-piece ) thing were taken and some companies ( notably EVA ) sold their own versions. These were, on the whole, not a patch on the excellent quality of the originals. It should be noted that attaching replica ( or even real ) G-Nose panels to a 'standard' model will NOT make it a genuine "ZG". Only the Factory in Japan could make a real ZG. Think of it as something akin to a Plymouth Superbird and you will get the feeling for what I mean. Of course I would say that, as I own a genuine Factory-built Fairlady 240ZG here in London, England. Its the only genuine one in Europe, as far as we know. There were actually myriad differences between the genuine HS30-H model and the other models - too many to go into here - and it takes a lot of explaining. If you are genuinely interested in them, then I would be happy to try and advise you if I can. Good replicas of these panels can still be bought in Japan - but they are rather costly I'm afraid. Shipping and taxes also hurt. NOS Hinges are in very limited supply with specialists and private dealers, as are the Headlamp Covers. Companies such as Motorsport Auto in the USA sell their own versions of the fibreglass parts, but I'm sorry to say that in my opinion they do not fit or look like the real thing. I believe their "Overfenders" - manufactured by Classic Datsun Motorsports? - are much clser to the real thing though. I'm also sorry to say that you won't find too much enlightenment on the Japanese domestic models ( or indeed any of the RHD 'Export' models either ) on zhome.com................. It seems to be an area that is something of a blind spot there. I'm always willing to help if I can. I spend a little more time over on classiczcars.com than here on HybridZ, but still look in from time to time as I think there are excellent technical minds here. You can take a look at some images of my own car ( along with many other Japanese domestic models ) in my Gallery at classiczcars.com - its listed under my User Name there of "HS30-H". Sorry to plug another site, but that's where most of my images reside. Best regards, Alan Thomas. London, UK.

SPOON are a Japanese tuning company / parts supplier. They specialise in Hondas.

That's not custom. The red G-Nosed car is fitted with replicas of the Works "Type B" Airdam and Overfenders. Nissan part numbers: *62605-N3020 AIR SPOILER - FR *63910-N3020 OVER FENDER - FR RH *63911-N3020 OVER FENDER - FR LH *78910-N3020 OVER FENDER - RR RH *78911-N3020 OVER FENDER - RR LH *98100-E8276 AIR SPOILER - RR ( 3 piece ) Combined with the 99090-N3075 UNDER GUARD KIT - FR full-length engine and trans belly pan, these made an effective aerodynamic upgrade for the G-Nose which was very effective in race use. These were the second version of add-ons for the G-Nose ( the first spoiler / airdam and wider Overfender kit was nicknamed the "Type A" ) and were JAF homologated for Group 4 circuit race use in Japan. Once the Factory had built the parts and made them available to the general public through the Japanese 'Sports Option' parts lists, it allowed both the Works SCCN team and privateer teams to legally use them in Group 4. Genuine original Factory / Works FRP body parts are now collectors items in Japan, and command very high prices when they come out of the woodwork. Its still possible to find suppliers of the replica parts in Japan - but you won't like the prices or the cost to ship them.............. Alan T.

The classic Japanese route ( back from the mid Seventies ) to a 3.1 stroker using the LD28 crank was always to use the L14 rods and Honda XL500 ( motorcycle ) pistons. They used to bush the pin bore and offset drill it for a 138mm centre-to-centre length. The XL pistons had a pin height of 29mm - leaving 0.5mm above the stock deck surface ( 41.5mm LD28 crank throw + 138mm rod length + 29mm pin height = 208.5mm ). I have been gathering parts for my own 3.1 engine project for far too long now. I keep selling the cranks because friends need them, so its slow going. However, I have a set of new Japanese-made rods with 138mm centre-to-centre and a set of forged 89mm pistons with 29mm pin height. This is a tried and trusted route in Japan. The Japanese parts are very well made but a little on the expensive side. http://alansphotos.fotopic.net/photo.php?id=1121032

The Prince Motor Company licensed some design details and principles that Mercedes had patented. This was for the Prince "G" series engines of the mid Sixties. When PMC were absorbed by NMC it gave Nissan a big boost in certain areas, and the licenses and agreements were part of that. The Nissan L-series engine was not "designed by Mercedes" - it just used some of the patent / licensed solutions that Nissan inherited from Prince. As you can see from the diagrams, the layout of the Mercedes engine was quite different to the Prince "G" series and the Nissan "L" series engines. It was just some of the parts that were similar. Respect to Tempe-Z for posting the link to the Mercedes drawings and pointing out the similarity, but I would have to disagree with his interpretation of how similar the designs are. In fact, automotive design ( just like most areas of engineering ) is full of this kind of patent licensing. I'd say that most of us don't realise the half of what is licensed and what is "original". It grates a little when companies like Prince and Nissan have been accused of being 'copyists' or at least plagiarising the designs of other companies, but in most cases they were doing what all the other automotive manufacturers were doing in the same period - licensing. Alan T.

Most ( if not all ) of the fibreglass parts sold by MJP Eastern Auto in the UK are sourced from suppliers and manufacturers in the USA.