RebekahsZ Posted September 9, 2013 Author Share Posted September 9, 2013 Yeah, my headlights suck. Bought the upgrade harness-maybe it will work to the top of the list this winter. I took car to Autozone and had them put the tester on it. Battery tested fine, starter tested fine (which the switch would work), alternator tested fine. Still have intermittent starting trouble. Car will just fail to crank sometimes. Swapped a junkyard switch into it (super easy job) and car now cranks every time, but will not fire and start! Switched back to old switch and fires and starts immediately every time it cranks. Only pissed me off three times at the track and I got it started by just continuing to try with the key until by some miracle it started. Got another switch from the junkyard to try tomorrow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewZed Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Are you replacing the whole switch (with key) or just the electrical part? The mechanical pieces can wear to where it won't turn the electrical switch far enough to make contact with the starter circuit. You can bend the rod from the key part to the electrical part to get more twist if that's the case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RebekahsZ Posted September 9, 2013 Author Share Posted September 9, 2013 Trying to do it with just replacing the electrical end of the switch. I'll let the posting rest until I try swapping it again. Some parts are in the junkyard because they belong there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewZed Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 I had a similar problem with the ignition switch. I just took a pair of pliers and twisted/bent the actuating rod so that it hit Start before it ran out of twist. The electrical component was fine. I tried two (had a spare) before I figured out what was happening. You can test the electrical piece with a flat blade screwdriver. Actually, if you wanted a fail-safe you could let the electrical part hang, carry a screwdriver, and keep the key for show until you get it fixed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RebekahsZ Posted September 16, 2013 Author Share Posted September 16, 2013 Second ignition switch didn't fix it. Well, it intermittently fixed it but I still get stuck in parking lots turning key on and off repeatedly until it starts. Will try bending the actuator as you suggest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted September 17, 2013 Administrators Share Posted September 17, 2013 ...And if you're like me running 55/100's or 80/120's on the 'night driver' relays become mandatory. Tony, I have a pair of nice E-Code's that I bought from H4lights. What brand/model 55/100's do you like? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RebekahsZ Posted September 18, 2013 Author Share Posted September 18, 2013 (edited) Electrical idiot here. I looked at the wiring diagrams and still can't figure this next question out. What do you call the relay that clicks just before the starter cranks? It sounds like it is under the dash on the passenger side. When it clicks, the stereo lights dim. I think i have been hearing this relay click and was thinking that was the starter solenoid. I have to turn the key a fraction of a turn further before the starter cranks. In the garage, it is cranking everytime with the switch taken apart. If it starts all day tomorrow I'm gonna chance twisting that tab up inside the keyed portion of the switch as suggested by New Zed. I'm just afraid I will break it. That old switch is mighty rickety. Edited September 18, 2013 by RebekahsZ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beermanpete Posted September 18, 2013 Share Posted September 18, 2013 You might be hearing the accessory relay opening because the accessory circuit is shut off while the ignition is in the start position. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RebekahsZ Posted September 18, 2013 Author Share Posted September 18, 2013 That sounds right for what I'm hearing. The purpose of that relay is to turn off any accessories that would compete for starting amps? Have I got that right in my head? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cgsheen Posted September 18, 2013 Share Posted September 18, 2013 Did you test the voltage you're getting at the spade that connects to the starter solenoid? Pull it off and have someone turn the ignition switch to start while you're checking the voltage. If it's not close to battery voltage, and changing switches hasn't helped your problem, you may need to run a new "start signal wire" from the ignition switch (Black/Yellow) to the starter solenoid... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beermanpete Posted September 18, 2013 Share Posted September 18, 2013 That sounds right for what I'm hearing. The purpose of that relay is to turn off any accessories that would compete for starting amps? Have I got that right in my head? Correct. Most cars turn off accessories during cranking to maximize power availability for cranking and a hot spark. Did you test the voltage you're getting at the spade that connects to the starter solenoid? Pull it off and have someone turn the ignition switch to start while you're checking the voltage. If it's not close to battery voltage, and changing switches hasn't helped your problem, you may need to run a new "start signal wire" from the ignition switch (Black/Yellow) to the starter solenoid... The voltage without a load on the solenoid wire does not matter. You need to measure the voltage with the solenoid connected. The best time to do this is when the problem occurs (the car is not cranking). Intermittent problems can be tough to find. Try disabling the ignition coil so you can crank longer without the engine starting. You might need a helper to turn the key while you take measurements. More than about 1/2 volt drop is too much and indicates one or more loose/dirty connections in the circuit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewZed Posted September 18, 2013 Share Posted September 18, 2013 . In the garage, it is cranking everytime with the switch taken apart. .... I'm just afraid I will break it. That old switch is mighty rickety. Starting fine with the screwdriver in the electrical switch is a sign that all of the relays and wiring are correct and working, unless there's a heat related problem. Really sounds like the key just isn't turning the switch far enough. Take two pair of needle nose pliers, grab the metal piece with both, and twist the part in between. That way there's no load on the connection with the keyed mechanism. Visualize first to make sure you're twisting the right way to get more action from the key. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RebekahsZ Posted September 18, 2013 Author Share Posted September 18, 2013 (edited) Thanks beerman and everybody. The car cranked fine today using a screw driver so I think NewZed is gonna have the answer. When it acts up, it usually just takes 8-10 tries on the key to start up. Just kind of embarrassing in the staging lanes at the strip. Last night, I checked Volts at the battery, both sides of my aftermarket firewall bulkhead connector and at the big cable on the starter (all12.64V). I will check the signal wire as instructed tonight with my wife on the key. I'm a good eye surgeon, but it takes a village to make me an electrician! Edited September 18, 2013 by RebekahsZ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RebekahsZ Posted October 6, 2013 Author Share Posted October 6, 2013 Twisted the metal tab inside the lock tumbler and reassembled. Got all excited and drove the car without trouble for 2 full days-key action felt great. Took it to the autocross and it was fine in the morning session. Drove car to Taco Bell on the lunch break and darn near didn't get back! The car wouldn't crank to get back from Taco Bell. Kept twisting key over and over (a variety of curses had no effect) until on about the 100th time, the car fired up like nothing was ever wrong! I never turned it off during the afternoon session, so I wouldn't cause a grid delay. Cranked right up when I unloaded it for the evening. I'm tired of this and am getting ready to buy a whole new tumbler and switch assembly for about $200 (not in love with having two keys, but I'm ready to have this behind me). From my symptoms (please read whole thread), is there any wisdom in trying to replace the accessory relay (if I can find one) before spending the big bucks? Thanks, guys, for dealing with this idiot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktm Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 (edited) Edit: I missed the part where the tumbler was determined to be a potential issue. Edited October 7, 2013 by ktm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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