2eighTZ4me Posted October 14, 2015 Author Share Posted October 14, 2015 Oil pump is basically brand new. There wasn't 500 miles on the motor. Brand new Melling pump for a turbo automatic - the high volume pump. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony D Posted October 15, 2015 Share Posted October 15, 2015 I just read this post. Low pressure could have been the oil pump. Make sure to change it out on rebuild. As far as oil, there is plenty of info on the web. Bobistheoilguy. How hard you push it on track and how much you spent on that engine should influence your decision. I stay away from additives and straight weight oils. Most damage happens on start up. For a severe duty L6 stick with a multi-grade at least 40w or more for higher temps and to allow margin for some degredation. 40W oil turns into 35W oil when contaminates are introduced. I can't think of a reason straight-weight oils would be detrimental. Multi-Vis oils were designed for frigid climates to pump up topside quickly and get out to bearings in arctic temperatures. Unless you're ice-racing at -40, and not running a pan heater there really is no advantage to multi-vis at operating temperatures especially with compounded dead dinosaurs. While a 40WT loses some viscosity at temperature, it it a 40WT base-stock and degrades from there. Multi-Vis 10W-40 is a 10WT Base Stock with compounding thickeners to ACT like a 40WT, and when it gets overtemperature it goes back rapidly to Base-Stock viscosity and degrades from there. This is not the case with synthetic, which can be compounded to do the opposite and thicken with temperature. Baker Neo has some 0W-50 that pours in like WATER but drains like thick syrup when hot. Amazing stuff. If you are in a stable climate, and warm the engine up in the pits (or use a sump heater) Straight Weight is fine, the lower 'fuel saving' features of low viscosity oil will not really pay much benefit. The lowest viscosity you can run to keep adequate oil pressure and protect the bearings from journal contact running is the oil that gives you the best power. Honestly we would run half ATF and Half 30 Wt in our Corvair Ice Racer for a super high detergent mix of about 20wt.... and yes, that's how it works with straight weights. I have had major oil companies suggest mixing ISO VG32 and ISO VG46 to get a viscosity in-between for customers that need more film strength than an ISO VG32 provides, but are unwilling to pay the power cost penalty that running an ISO VG 46 would entail (about 10% higher power costs...on something cranking 310 Amps, and power running around $3,500 per amp, per month....you can see why!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clarkspeed Posted October 15, 2015 Share Posted October 15, 2015 The lowest viscosity you can run to keep adequate oil pressure and protect the bearings from journal contact running is the oil that gives you the best power. Absolutely. I'm not a lubrication engineer by any stretch, but can only repeat what oil company reps and professional engine builders have told me. The oil cushion on start up is quite critical to bearing wear on both passenger and race cars. There really is no protection until the shaft is rotating and a wedge is allowed to form.in the bearing. A thiner weight oil provides enhanced protection during this period and is faster to form the wedge. That's why you see so many passenger cars moving toward the 0W-5W multigrades and most race cars running multigrades. Of course a sump heater would make a difference also. BTW, I was also told there were only 3 synthetic oil base manufacturers, Exxon, Chevron, and BP. And only 4 additive manufacturers. The secret is in the mix of course, but it is not that big a secret. It's more of blending for a particular market or application. Diesel oils, like your Rotella, are blended with higher detergent additives. Race oils are blended more with additives that resist fuel contamination and the degregation that comes from it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony D Posted October 16, 2015 Share Posted October 16, 2015 Passenger cars are doing it in a large part due to emissions requirements (a key part of elimination of Catalyst-Poisoning Zinc and Phosphorous--can't have that if you must warrant a catalyst for 10yrs / 100,000miles!), that's a whole different ball game. The accepted way to start a wedge is to make one before you crank the engine. A Canton Accusump is the standard answer to starting a high compression engine safely. Even SCCA realizes it and allows it in stock classes. I run a Canton and prelube while cranking with standard straight weight oil (and a sump heater.) Many people start cranking without ignition on, and then flip the switch once they see oil pressure. Many ways to make a wedge and get oil to the bearings to prevent startup cranking damage. 0W-50 doesn't do anything for you when the oil sloshes and you suck air in the pickup either. An Accusump, on the other hand will save your engine! Which begs the question, does this engine HAVE and Accusump? Multi-Vis dead dinosaurs is light oil made to act heavier, and when degradation starts you break down to THIN oil. Straight Weight oil is thick oil which breaks down to thinner oil over a greater period of time with much more protection. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2eighTZ4me Posted October 16, 2015 Author Share Posted October 16, 2015 Tony D - the engine does NOT have an AccuSump - but it will before it gets fired up next time. My problem was not bearing failure on startup. My problem was under extended high RPM runs, all the oil would go upstairs to the head, and I starved the bottom end. I have since put the factory oil restrictors back in the block, and have drilled 4x 1" holes in the passenger side of the windage tray to allow quicker flow back to the pan. John mentioned that earlier. I live in the South, and most of the time I got to the track, it's 70-90+ degrees outside. No need for a pan heater - plus, I let the car get up to temp on the grid before heading out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony D Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 Oil Operating Temperature is 180F minimum. Don't discount a pan heater even at 80/90. Plug it in trackside and it will semi-warm the water as well. The big thing is the oil is at operating temperature and viscosity at first crank up...giving you the same lubricity you want from a multi-vis when stone cold. The Accusump makes it somewhat moot. I still like the heater, for oil and water. No cold-circuit enrichment issues to sort that way for a lazy EFI tuner! LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clarkspeed Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 A tech article from Driven Race Oils by Lake Speed their Lubrication Engineer talking about using ATF as an engine oil. It depends on how long you want to use it and load conditions. http://www.drivenracingoil.com/news/dro/training-center/articles/oils-lubricatebut-long-conditions/ Also a good basic article on engine oils. http://www.drivenracingoil.com/news/dro/training-center/articles/racing-oil-101/ They also have plenty of info on zinc and why you need or don't need it in other articles. I heard Lake speak at the MSC expo last year and it was very informative. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2eighTZ4me Posted November 5, 2015 Author Share Posted November 5, 2015 I have gotten the windage tray drilled out. I'm hoping this should be sufficient per johnc's instructions. (I can always do more if anyone thinks there's any benefit to that.) Also put back in the factory oil galley jets to the head. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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