Guest Big Phil Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 I am looking to start a business next year and I want it to be automotive based. A partner and I are buying a portable dyno and plan on taking it to different car shows and club events thru out the southwest. In order to store the equipment, we need a building. While looking at buildings in San Diego, I had an Idea. We all have project vehicles but most of us lack the tools and space to work on them. My wife is constantly nagging me to clean out the garage so I am going to move my project vehicles into the new building. I know there has to be other people who need in a space to store and work on their pride and joy. There are two ways to approach this concept. One is to treat the center as an exclusive club for a handful of members, each with an equity share in the assets based on the size (square footage) of their suites. The other approach is to lease the suites to pre-qualified tenants, allowing approximately 300-350sq ft per vehicle (the average home garage is 200sq ft per car). Either way, equity or lease, each suite would be quite luxurious by typical garage standards. Each suite will be secure and accessible only to its tenant with a "common" area for minor service, inspection, and car care (ie, a dedicated car wash area). If I decide to lease suites, how much would you pay per month to rent a workspace to store and work on your project? Your monthly rent would include access to all the tools (air tools, jacks, wrenches etc), car lift, jacks and dyno testing equipment. Each space would be set up with lockable storage, lighting and connections for air tools. I plan on working with a consultant like the gentlemen at Ultimate Garage to design the facility. Below is a link to their website and pics of different workspaces. I plan on renting the spaces for $300 to $500 dollars a month or $3000 to $4000 per year. Is this a fair price? I'm not trying to make a ton of money and just don't want to lose money. The tax break alone makes it worth my time. How much would you pay???? http://www.ultimategarage.com/unitshop.jpg http://www.ultimategarage.com/HomePage1.JPG http://www.ultimategarage.com/opport.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvilRufusKay Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 Although I am nowhere near you I thought I might add my 2cents. It sounds like a great idea except for the sharing of tools portion. The sharing of tools would be a great asset to those that do not have them but as for you the owner of the tools you might see them disappear quickly. Unless you had a camera or an employee working the tool room you would never know who was using what. I currently share a garage with someone. I pay a reduced rate because I let him use my tools , compressor, etc.. Even though this person takes great care of my tools it is still a constant problem. At one time he even lost the keys to my box. Anyway the picture of the garges that you posted look awesome. If I could swing it I would pay $300 a month for a space. If I was allowed to bring in different cars at different times i.e. side jobs, I might pay $500. All that said, it seems like a very plausible buisness venture especially if they were to have all the emenities listed on the site you provided. Good luck, I will be interested to see what the other responses are. Rufus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Aaron Posted December 15, 2003 Share Posted December 15, 2003 Another feature you may want to include: get a large industrial air compressor, and have connections in each suite. That way, each tenant does not have to have a compressor, and you will probably save some money on your electrical bill. Also, you want to make sure your company is properly set up to shield you from any personal liability should some idiot burn the place down and destroy a bunch of cars. It would be great if you could get an old auto dealership, because the shop would be almost completely ready to go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim240z Posted December 15, 2003 Share Posted December 15, 2003 Great idea. I have thought of the same thing over the years. The prices you mentioned are very reasonable. Some of my thoughts: 1. Have each 'bay' set up with a complete set of tools (huge capital outlay) and have them inventoried. Have the 'tennant' lay down a deposit for any missing tools (like a hotel room with towels etc). Have a pre and post occupation meeting to ensure inventory. 2. Have only 1 set of 'specialized' tools that the tennant can 'borrow' if needed. (some of these tools are very expensive and seldom used) 3. Definitely have compressed air available to all. 4. liability waiver. 5. Have a certified mechanic available to assist the guys who can wrench, but may not be able to diagnose problems (these are the guys who would have to take their cars to the dealership due to lack of knowlege, but are willing to fix themself). You could also charge a supplemental fee for the mechanic to fix what the customers break ontheir cars. 6. Provide a safety orientation (how to jack up and support cars with jack stands correctly, how to correctly use pnuematic and power tools etc.) Liability issues are the biggest problem, especially here in CA, where there is really no way to have a 'customer' sign away liability. That is the reason, after some investigation, I never persued this......CA sucks....damned lawyers!! 7. Offer trailering or towing service to the facility. Make sure that they cannot remove their vehicle before paying for rent and confirming tool inventory. Good luck....it's a winner! Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillZ260 Posted December 15, 2003 Share Posted December 15, 2003 I have often thought that this would make a great business. A set of basic tools would be good for each bay but nothing elaborate. If you had the cabinet set up you show in your links I imagine $500 or so in hand tools would do the trick for each personal bay. Even less if you can get a break from the supplier or get an endorsment from them. I like Tim's idea of checking specialized tools out, or possibly renting them out as a additional fee. In the common area have a lift that could be reverved by day. Things like a press and shear, possibly a mill and lathe and some aluminum and steel billitts. If there was a place like that, I would have to be in! I think I could even get my wife's support. I am very interested in how this turns out. Although land here on OK is alot cheaper and plentiful than NY, dunno if it would work out all that well here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Big Phil Posted December 15, 2003 Share Posted December 15, 2003 Thanks for the input guys. I do plan on providing air connections at each bay and installing a monster air compressor. The specialized tools would be available for rent from a tool room. Each bay will have a set of SAE and Metric tools worth appoximately $500. The tools would be inventoried prior to rental and a credit card number or cash deposit will be required. You guys are right about the liability waiver and I plan on having a huge liability insurance policy since it is required for the Dyno. I will be able to offer trailering service since I have to buy a large trailer to haul the dyno equipment to various shows thru out the southern US. I am buying the Dyno early next year maybe I'll bring it to the next SoCal Hybrid Z get together. I am still working on the Garage club business plan. Hopefully I can generate enough interest to get the club up and running next year as well. When I was in the Navy, I loved the base auto shop and I just want to offer the same service to civilians. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim240z Posted December 15, 2003 Share Posted December 15, 2003 I am buying the Dyno early next year maybe I'll bring it to the next SoCal Hybrid Z get together. COOL!! Sounds like time to plan another BBQ!!! Whoo Hoo Good luck with the plans, Phil! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gramercyjam Posted December 15, 2003 Share Posted December 15, 2003 Not bashing, just my .02. $300-$500 /month would be too high for me. I could build a brand new shop up for that that I wouldn't need to share with anybody. I started a similar business about 20 yrs ago. Painters wanted to rent the paintbooth, but most folks who came by just wanted to know if we could fix their car for them cheap, or weld something up. Maybe that's the angle you need to work for the business. Similar to beauty shops that rent stations out to beauticians. You rent bays out to self employed mechanics. If I had a lathe or mill or shear and brake or tubing bender, I wouldn't let anybody else use them. In my experience, that type of machinery needs experienced operators or they will be jammed up in quick order. You maybe able to put a lien on their car if it is in a bay to pay for damages, but what if the damages far exceed the value of the car? A brake lathe and a small hydraulic press is about all I would trust the average DIY person with. There are a group of guys here that rent a shop out for their race car projects, they are all friends and they pay about $70 a piece a month. I wouldn't mind sharing shop space and tools with guys like that people that I know well. But not with strangers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
280Zen Posted December 15, 2003 Share Posted December 15, 2003 I've been looking for a place like this for my project car. I don't have a garage to work in, So my tools get stored in a spare room and I have to drag them all out when I want to work on my car. $300 would be a bit expensive since I have most the tools I need. Sounds like a good venture. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Big Phil Posted December 15, 2003 Share Posted December 15, 2003 Gramercyjam, I know to some people $300-500 may seem high but real estate prices in Southern California are outrageous. I just sold a 1700sq ft 3 Bedroom house with a 2 car garage for $400,000 in less than 10 days. Many of us would love to have our own personal shop but 99 percent can't afford it. The average houses sits on a 8000sq ft lot, so there is no room to build a shop out back. The only option is to rent a building. The problem is the average 4000sq ft building leases for $3500 to $4500 per month. That's a large enough building for 10 bays and a dyno cell so I think the price is fair. Remember I not trying to make a ton of money, I just want to cover the rent and equipment cost. I'm doing it because I'm a avid car guy and I could used the tax break that a business offers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
280Zen Posted December 15, 2003 Share Posted December 15, 2003 just sold a 1700sq ft 3 Bedroom house with a 2 car garage for $400,000 in less than 10 days HOLY Sheit Batman! I've been looking at buying a 1500 to 1700sq ft for 130,00 to 150,000 MAX... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim240z Posted December 15, 2003 Share Posted December 15, 2003 I gotta back up Mr Phil on the pricing. You guys in the real world (outside of CA) will have a hard time appreciating the property market out here!! It's insane. In my neighborhood, houses just don't sell for the asking price.....usually 10-30k more! My realtor recently told me of a house which sold for $689k sight unseen...all by phone because the buyer kept losing out on the bidding....the asking price on the house was $675k!! I am embarking on an addition to my house.....adding another 990 sq feet, to my 950 sq foot 2 bed, one bath house. For loan purposes the house was valued at $540k......but due to location, my realtor says $550-560k would be no problem! It's completely insane....I can't afford to buy my own house now!!! Anyways......it gives you guys an idea of the kind of prices things go for in CA.....plus insurance, property taxes etc etc are all very high. If I didn't have a garage....$300 per month would be do-able, but I would certainly not procrastinate on the project!!! Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillZ260 Posted December 15, 2003 Share Posted December 15, 2003 That is exactly why I am not sure that it would work here. Everyone here pretty much, just builds their own shop, but OK is definatly not CA. About 9 months ago we got our spread, 2000 sq ft, on 18,000 sq ft of land in the middle of town for $130K. It's nice, when we went to CA for our honeymoon, I could not belive how much houses go for. Anyway, good luck on your venture, would be alot of fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest livewire23 Posted December 15, 2003 Share Posted December 15, 2003 Sounds good to me. I know I'd jump on it in a second if I had my job and was nearby. $300 would be approaching my upper limit, but money ain't exactly plentiful with me. He's right about the costs though. In my home neighbourhood, one bedroom apartments ran in the $1500-2000 range, and I just signed the lease here for a one bedroom apartment for $390 a month. Alex, DavyZ, and all you other people who are up in N. Cali, you all know how insane it is to be renting for under $500 a month.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gramercyjam Posted December 15, 2003 Share Posted December 15, 2003 Maybe people would just rent for the bays, park an RV in there an live in the RV! I just don't know how y'all can make ends meet out there on the left coast with crazy prices like that. I guess the pay is a lot better out there or money must grow on trees or sumthing. I moved from a new neighborhood with the small 2 car garage on the front of the house to an old neighborhood with big houses on large lots and a detached garage out back that is big enough to hold 5 cars so I could have more room to work, more room for my cars. Now what I'd really like to do is to move out to the country and put up a huge metal barn on 100 acres and live in the barn, 1/4 for cars, 1/4 for music, 1/2 for people, or maybe the whole barn for music and cars and put a trailer next to it to live in. Help! I think I'm turning into a redneck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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