J__ Posted February 28, 2006 Author Share Posted February 28, 2006 on the original thread ppl have been using 8/2 paint to mineral spirits to thin it for rolling. what ratio have you guys been using for spraying? and do u spray it layer by layer (spray 1 layer, let it dry, spray another)? or just 1 thick layer? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metallicar Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 I spoke with Tech Support at Rustoleum and the person there told me if I was to spray, I would have best results with Acetone. So I went about 4:1. I also had good results rolling it. See my post, http://forums.hybridz.org/showthread.php?t=108495 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J__ Posted February 28, 2006 Author Share Posted February 28, 2006 mineral spirits dont do well in spraying? anyone use mineral spirits as a thinner for spraying this stuff? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Z-TARD Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 I used mineral spirits for spraying. No problems to speak of, although I didn't compare it against spraying with acetone to see if it was better or not. My only concern with using acetone would be the fumes, since it flashes to vapor much faster than mineral spirits. Using the mineral spirits, I can almost spray without a respirator, although I wouldn't recommend it. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Z-TARD Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 Hmmm! do you think this method could be used whatever is the base colour of the car, mine is metalic green and I would like to use orange... Would the colour be consistent on the already green painted body and the new fibergrlass wings ? Should be okay provided you put on enough coats. I beleive the procedure in the original moparts thread was for applying two coats, then wet sanding, then two more coats followed by wet sanding and then polishing. Four coats of rustoleum should cover just about any base color. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony240ZT Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 I've sprayed with the mineral spirits. Two coats and then sand seems to work nicely. With the white it covers well after the first coat, you can't tell what was behind it. Like any paint if you don't spray it fine enough you will encounter fish eye issues. Wonder if the acetone would help. I sprayed one layer on top of another that wasn't fully dry and there was a small amount of wrinkling that occored, but I've haven't had it eat into other paints that were dry. It doesn't even want to pull up edges of the other paints that were on the piece I sprayed on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metallicar Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 I found the Acetone did flash fairly fast, but not too fast. This I think is a benefit. Spraying the hood with the Acetone mix made for some quick action in order to keep a wet edge. I would have thought as slow as mineral spirits dry, the paint would take too long to flash. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kaz Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 I'm "testing" this rolling method out on my hood at the moment (not entirely sure I'm actually going to keep it on the car, so I figured if I messed it up, oh well...). Anyway, I tried doing a 4/1 ratio (20%) of mineral spirits and I was getting excessive air bubbles when I'd roll it to smooth it after applying the paint... for the next coat, I added another part paint and stirred it up, and had far less bubbles, but I've still got uneven application, despite going over the area a few times with just the weight of the roller as recommended on the Mopar forums... I can vouch for its resiliancy... I mean I just put a coat on Saturday night, and meant to put on another coat Sunday night before wet sanding, but didn't get the time (was laying laminate wood flooring in the kitchen). I did however walk out and check it in an inconspicuous area to try and scratch it with a fingernail, and I couldn't even scratch it in a THIN area... the Rust-o-leum Stop Rust is some hard core stuff... I'm just hoping I can get it to even out on the next coat after I wet sand. I tried "Palm Green" which "looked" rather dark on the color chart (I was trying to get somewhere near British Racing Green, but not as dark, sort of a Fern, or middle of the road green... hard to say... probably close to ON3GO's L28T Z... anyway, its coming out REALLY BRIGHT... I mean like KERMIT green... lol. I'll definitely have to go a shade or two darker in paint when I buy a full car worth (I just bought the $7 can from Home Depot as a test). A quiet question though... I am a complete amateur when it comes to painting/wet sanding... I tried to wet sand the first/secondish coat with 600 grit wet sand paper, and soaked it as recommended and tried to do it by hand as the Mopar forum recommends, but the paper kinda disintegrated on the edges where it curves around my hand, and left a little material here and there... it also continually slipped out of my hand (I started with bigger squares of paper and cut them down as I went, trying to keep a hold of them). I didn't really want to use a block because the Z's hoods are so curvy (especially around the center hump, and I also have hood vent holes, which add an extra dimension/curve to that area of the hood, which is also where I did the worst job smoothing the paint, d'oh!) Any suggestions on the wet sanding??? I've also got 800 and 1000 grit for the next two stages, but I don't really want to try again until I get a few suggestions that might help me with the process... Thanks, Kaz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
innerware Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 Sounds like you aren't using a good wet dry sand paper. It should hold together well if it isn't too cheap. Also look at getting those sand paper sponges as they work pretty well too. If you use a block get a hard foam sanding block at your auto paint store. They are nice too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kaz Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 Well... I did what I should have done and googled wet sanding... I just took the statements too literally... when I read "by hand" I took it literally... lol. Most sites recommend using a foam or rubber block and wrapping the sand paper around it to give yourself a uniform service that is plaiable (i.e. can be used around curves). I think once I get the next coat on, I'll try it again... The sandpaper I got was "Wetsand" stated sand paper... but it was for general use (found it at home depot, though it did show a car on the back stating you could use it for such a purpose), but all they had was 600... I found the 800 and 1000 at Pep Boys... which I haven't tried yet... I'll go pick up a block and report back later... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Z-TARD Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 Try the Gloss Hunter Green in the rustoleum stops rust paint. That should be quite a bit darker than the Kermit green. Might be a liitle darker than British Racing Green though. Maybe a mix of the two, call it "Kermit Hunter Green" Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kaz Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 Try the Gloss Hunter Green in the rustoleum stops rust paint. That should be quite a bit darker than the Kermit green. Might be a liitle darker than British Racing Green though. Maybe a mix of the two' date=' call it "Kermit Hunter Green" Mike[/quote'] Well, when I checked out the paint samples on their website, they list "Grass Green" which may now be called "Palm Green" instead... because that looks rather close to what my Z hood looks like now... lol... I'll have to check again this weekend and see what I can find... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kaz Posted March 3, 2006 Share Posted March 3, 2006 Here are some shots I took of my attempt so far... first coat I think I had too much mineral spirits in it, and hadn't scuffed the paint enough as in some areas it did not stick... I also wet sanded it wrong after the coat, but definitely scuffed it up for the second coat... second coat is MUCH better color wise and uniform as far as thickness, but it has not yet been wetsanded... the second coat was applied about 24 hours ago, and its been about an average of 60 degrees F in the garage (got up into the 70s today, but has been in the low 50s as well). First coat... note the poor adheasion, and poor uniformity in the coat... I definitely had the "WTF am I doing!?!" moments after this application... Here is how she looks now, after the second coat... I still have enough paint to do another coat or two... but I definitely want to go with a darker green when I finally paint the car. I'm mostly doing the hood as a test. First coat, from an angle... Second coat... from an angle. Definitely "Kermit Green" right?? lol... This shows the POOR coverage I had at the top of the hood after the first coat... =( A lot better after the second coating... This shows some of the bad coverage as well... I did clean the hood with soapy water, but I don't think I scuffed it enough with sand paper, and I didn't clean it with mineral spirits... as I did before the second coat. =) One of the many bits I get to have fun correctly... this is actually more like my 3rd or 4th coat on the car to be honest. I painted two back to back, and also painted another coat a few days ago and the first three I had a lot of trouble getting the paint to apply uniformly and smoothly... I'd have lines from the roller all over and this is one such area... its got a "slight" depression where my finger is pointing... This shot shows the overall condition/smoothness of the paint... at the moment, its not at all... I'm not sure if it was the roller I was using, or that I had too much spirits in teh paint again, now idea, but I had a really bad time with bubbles if I rolled smoothly... in the end I ended up rolling the brush REALLY fast across the hood in various directions using the weight of hte roller itself to get the bubbles out, but that left an almost "crinkle" finish to the paint... but I figured it was easier to deal with than the bubbles... when I really paint the car, I'll make sure to buy enough rollers and pans that I won't have to reuse anything... for this first trial, I only bought one of each (1 pan, 1 roller, 1 foam roll, etc...). Anyway, its looking better... but I'm still not 100% convinced, but I definitely DON'T like this color... lol. Once I wetsand this weekend, I'll post some more shots, and let you all know how it turns out... These pictures HAVE been color corrected in Adobe ImageReady, but for those of you that noticed the paint looking a lot "darker" from the first set of pictures to the second set, it did indeed get darker by a shade or so, but not as dark as I'd like... when my friend came by tonight and saw it, he actually asked if I'd used the same paint or bought another shade... so it does get darker with each coat with a color such as this. The hood on my Z was silver prior... one thing you might als notice is in the first set of pictures I have a bunch of "spots" in the hood under the paint... I took a flapper wheel to all the small "rust" spots I had on the hood... didn't want it spreading under the paint... but this left depressions in the first coat or two of paint... since I knew I'd be wetsanding it thoroughly with 800 grit, I didn't worry too much about it at the time... we'll find out over the weekend if that was a mistake or not. Later, Kaz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MikiK Posted March 3, 2006 Share Posted March 3, 2006 The last pictures of the 3rd or 4th coat is that after wet sanding? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Z-TARD Posted March 3, 2006 Share Posted March 3, 2006 Looks like it could have been applied a bit heavier. The rustoleum paint has really good self leveling properties if applied thick enough. I also used a sprayer to do mine though, which may have helped even it out. If you don't have a compressor, maybe try applying it with an airless electric sprayer. I haven't tried this with the rustoleum paint, but I know they work pretty well with oil based enamels. We painted entire rooms with these when I was stationed on my last ship. Also, you'll save yourself a lot of heartache by filling in any surface imperfections before applying paint. I've heard over and over how good prep work is like 90 percent of having a good paint job, and from my limited experiments so far, this has proven to be true. The small area I painted had a few scratches in it from when I did the bodywork in that area, they showed up right through all 4 coats of paint I put over them too. The only "easy" way to keep that from happening is to smooth everything out before painting. The rustoleum paint seems to cover pretty well over surfaces that have been sanded with about 320 grit or higher. That shade of green is pretty bright, you're right about it being "Kermit" green, Does the Wal Mart or Home Depot in your area carry the Hunter Green stop rust paint? Might be worth getting a small can to check out, it will be several shades darker than the last pic in your post. Keep us posted how it turns out, Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kaz Posted March 3, 2006 Share Posted March 3, 2006 The last pictures of the 3rd or 4th coat is that after wet sanding? No... unsanded... thats only 24 hours old... I have basically laid 4 coats... 2 right on top of each other each time... basically started at one end of the hood and worked to the other, then reapplied all over again an additional coat... this didn't work well on the first run... worked much better on the second run, which was days later... So I really only consider it "two applications/coats" and it has not been wetsanded for the second time yet... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kaz Posted March 3, 2006 Share Posted March 3, 2006 Looks like it could have been applied a bit heavier. The rustoleum paint has really good self leveling properties if applied thick enough. I also used a sprayer to do mine though' date=' which may have helped even it out. If you don't have a compressor, maybe try applying it with an airless electric sprayer. I haven't tried this with the rustoleum paint, but I know they work pretty well with oil based enamels. We painted entire rooms with these when I was stationed on my last ship. Also, you'll save yourself a lot of heartache by filling in any surface imperfections before applying paint. I've heard over and over how good prep work is like 90 percent of having a good paint job, and from my limited experiments so far, this has proven to be true. The small area I painted had a few scratches in it from when I did the bodywork in that area, they showed up right through all 4 coats of paint I put over them too. The only "easy" way to keep that from happening is to smooth everything out before painting. The rustoleum paint seems to cover pretty well over surfaces that have been sanded with about 320 grit or higher. That shade of green is pretty bright, you're right about it being "Kermit" green, Does the Wal Mart or Home Depot in your area carry the Hunter Green stop rust paint? Might be worth getting a small can to check out, it will be several shades darker than the last pic in your post. Keep us posted how it turns out, Mike[/quote'] I got this paint at Home Depot and it was a base mix creation... they do sell Hunter Green right out of the can... which I may try in the end... Like I said before, this is more a "test" as I've never attempted to really paint an entire car before... The hood was the worst off rust spot wise, and I wasn't 100% sure I was going to keep it anyway... so like I said, it was just a test to see how the process worked... I'm still debating about media blasting the entire chassis... so if I really decide to keep the hood, I'll just have it blasted with the rest of the car and reapply the paint when I paint the entire chassis. We'll see... I do have an air compressor, but its only a smaller wheeled version, and its a few years old, so I'm not sure if it could keep up with an air sprayer at the CFM they require... =/ But Costco locally does have a 4 gun sprayer kit for $79.99 (two gravity feeds, two normal) with a lot of accessories alone with it... I've been "considering" buying it, I just wasn't too sure about air spraying... but I might do it in the end anyway. We'll see. Thanks for the suggestions Mike. When you sprayed, what was the mix you used? The cans actually say not to mix with any more than 5% spirits... but all the posts on the Mopar forum kept stating 20%... =/ Thoughts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony240ZT Posted March 3, 2006 Share Posted March 3, 2006 You could probably use a HVLP gun, they mix paint well with less air. Here is a good buy: http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=45001 I think that may be the one that I use. The painting I did came out just about as good as an aerosol can does. Clean up is pretty easy with this paint. I can't imagine using a roller, I wouldn't have the patience to correct the bumps and divots created by something physicly touching the paint. So much sanding required that your layers of paint end up being pretty thin after they are corrected. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Z-TARD Posted March 4, 2006 Share Posted March 4, 2006 20% seems about right, I know I was thinning a lot more than 5% to get a sprayable mix. If the paint on your car is mostly intact and not rusting out from under it, I'd suggest leaving it in place and just painting over it. Taking a car down to bare metal often opens up a whole new can of worms as far as bodywork is concerned, as well as allowing moisture to get a pretty good foothold in the metal before painting. Here's a few alternatives to using a compressor for spraying: http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=91772 http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=47274 Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OlderThanMe Posted March 12, 2006 Share Posted March 12, 2006 y'all are making it look hard... here is what I got...it was like 95% humidity and I had to keep the garage door open and stuff was all getting in the paint... plus I was told that I had to park my car outside that night to give up the garage to the 944 like 2 hours from when I just started the hood...it was still very sticky...I was going at it with a hair-dryer...lol this is after 1 coat on bare metal before sanding or anything... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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