alsil Posted October 26, 2006 Share Posted October 26, 2006 I've seen a few people mention this motor in a couple of threads, but doing a search I didn't find any threads on this specific motor. Anyone know of a 2rz or 3rz swap into a Z? They're a pretty strong motor stock, had a 2rz in my '97 Tacoma and it was decently quick and got 28-30mpg. In a 600-700lb lighter vehicle it would definately be alot faster. Just curious, suprised this ones isn't talked about much, since it would be very easy to get parts since there are so many Tacomas on the road, plus I've seen some Celicas and Tacomas with turbo's on 'em doing 12's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.INSANE Posted October 26, 2006 Share Posted October 26, 2006 Gollum Should know alot about these he talked to me but i dont think the swap has been done Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tannji Posted October 26, 2006 Share Posted October 26, 2006 To my knowledge, no one has done a 2RZ/3RZ swap. I hope to be the first... but funds and time are constraining me. To be honest, I think the thought of a 4 cylinder Toyota truck engine puts a lot off people off, not sexy, not enough displacement, you know? On the negative side, it is an iron block and not as light or sexy looking as the SR20det. It also has a very deep sump that would probably have to be modified, and you have to source older trannies that dont handle 300+ hp very long, or go expensive with Supra-tt trannies. On the plus side, the engine is a beast, amazingly over-engineered, capable of decent hp stock, and insane power proportional to the budget. Paradise Racing is running a Celica or Corolla with over 1000 hp, and Chris Prado runs NOPI or Outlaw with over 1500 hp out of his. Being an in-line 4, you have exhaust and intake on opposite sides of the engine which makes plumbing turbos and IC's less of a head-ache. If you are going stand-alone ECU and need crank-position sensor wheels, it has that already. (36-2) Depending on the year, you have distributors, or DIS. The 3rz is a little torque monster (for a 4-banger) and the 2RZ has less stroke, making it more rev-friendly. I want one in my Z... and I am buying one as soon as I get my current 350 TPI setup running on MegaSquirt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsil Posted October 26, 2006 Author Share Posted October 26, 2006 I haven't heard anything bad about the stock trannys, from what I have seen they are pretty strong. Not to 300+ HP but then again I wouldn't set it up to be more than 200 anyways. Not a big turbo fan myself. it would just just be for reliability and strength. A decent 200hp bulletproof motor like a 2rz in a decently set up car I can enjoy more than one that I'm always working on and trying to make better. I'd probably go for a 2rz just for the sake of ease, costs less $$ to get into and still puts out 153hp stock. A few mods and 170+ would be fine with me. Be faster than a stock L24 in a 240, at any rate. PLUS I wouldn't have to adjust the lash every 12k. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tannji Posted October 26, 2006 Share Posted October 26, 2006 Very good points. It would make an excellent "near-stock" engine. Probably fairly economical as well, as you mentioned. Keep the oil sump in mind though, I believe it is at least 12 inches deep, possibly a little more.... being a tall inline rather than a V, I think it will be a tight fit stock, not to mention the thought of having the sump taking on all speed bumps makes my teeth hurt. LC Engineering has dry sump and wet sump parts, good place to look for options or ideas for your own solutions. I plan on going the dry sump route myself... but fabbing much of it, LC's aluminum parts and kits could double or triple your budget. tannji Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gollum Posted October 26, 2006 Share Posted October 26, 2006 The way I figure it is that I'd rather go with a toyota V6 from the tundra. I'm talking about the V series, the 5VZ in particular. Think about it this way, the block isn't that much heavier, and it's shorter in length. The main thing making it heavier is the heads and extra rotating mass. It really shouldn't be too heavy of a motor even though it's an iron block. Both 4 and 6 cylinder toyota motors in question are designed for tourque and as such aren't high reving motors. I havn't had the chance to do tons of hands on research on either yet, but I havn't checked into the head design of the RZ series at all yet so I can't speak for it, but the 5V seems to have great head potential with good valve design. I don't have specs on the weight of the pistons yet, but it's a short stroke motor so revs really shouldn't be a problem as long as you can get the valvetrain to keep up. Stock limitation on revs will be lack of power from the cams since it's designed for low end tourque as I stated previously. Both engine options are seemingly unheard of, wich has pros and cons. The upside is that they're actually around for a good price since there isn't this insane demand for them (you'll never find a vtec honda at a picknpull unless you catch it in it's first 2 hours at the yard). The downside is that because of it's lack of popularity that there isn't a huge aftermarket readily availble. But these motors are a great option if you're not looking for tons of power. Honestly I think that there are lots of motors out there like the toyota 4 cylinders and V6's that are prime for the taking. Go for it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tannji Posted October 26, 2006 Share Posted October 26, 2006 I have considered Toyota V-6 as well... but the RZ keeps me coming back, and it's aftermarket support has finally arrived, IMO. Perhaps if you are looking for catalogged performance kits, with every part already pre-chosen, or every possible combination already in someones car down the street... then ya... not there yet. (Although LC Engineering is getting pretty close to that, they have been a force in the older 22r series for a long time.) If you dont mind having to think through your upgrade parts, Paradise racing has or can source most of what you would want for a RZ rebuild with mundane or extreme performance in mind. Luis Corujo is a VERY busy man, but will take the time to thoroughly share his knowledge and experience, and he is constantly offering new performance parts and kits, with a heavy preference for the 2RZ/3RZ engine. I will probably drop a few quid in his pocket... I am looking for about 400 hp and a 7500 rpm or so redline, with a beefed up and lightened power-train... but with durability and drivability as the underlying theme. I have the 3.4 V6 in my 4Runner... and if I wernt going RZ, I could easily picture that under the bonnet of the Z as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gollum Posted October 26, 2006 Share Posted October 26, 2006 Yea, the RZ has really started to bloom in recent history. I'm hoping the UZ series is close on it's heels but things seem to be moving slow. Yea there's parts avaiblible, and I personally don't NEED all my parts nicely laid out in catalogs or anything like that. But large aftermarket creates competition and gives you better parts for better prices. Sure you're always gonna spent at least X amount for some stuff, but it's nice you know you have your options. And that 3.4 liter in the 4runner is the exact motor I'm looking into, the 5VZFE. TRD had an optional supercharger + an optional injector & ECU package that adds a 7th injector. Engines with these kits alone are supposed to be around 260hp. Not too shabby for 3.4 warrenty backed liters. If I do the swap my goal in the long run would be about 400hp with a bottom end that could hold to 800hp if I ever wanted to go crazy. From the sound of things it's doable, but the swap is still very 'research' pending. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auxilary Posted October 26, 2006 Share Posted October 26, 2006 al, dude... you started the 5.0. stick with the 5.0 hehe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest REDZ Posted October 27, 2006 Share Posted October 27, 2006 I was lookin into doin a 3rz a while back. this is what i found. The later model 4 port heads are the best. they have bigger valves than the earlier 8 port disign and flow better. Strenght wise they a re almost indestructable though a have heard of some of the standard tacuma guys haveing some issues. There is quite a lot of support for these engine now, paradise racing, BC, LC engineering. They can make masive amounts of power when turbo'd http://www.are.com.au This company is not far from me and my mate is good freinds with the owner so I can tell you for a fact as I've personally seen it put down over 700rwhp. And I beleive its cappable of 10k rpm as well. If a 2.4 is all your really need why don't you get the 2.7 block and put the 2.4 crank in with some LONG rods and some desent low compression heght pistons. Gives you a crazy rod ratio. Thing would rev foreva as long as the springs could keep up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tannji Posted October 27, 2006 Share Posted October 27, 2006 I read the complete ARE site several times over a year ago.... hadnt been back since till now, was fairly disappointed to find they apparently have done no more with that car or have stopped updating the site. I LOVE the plenum he designed, seems to be a good technical piece and looks phenominal on the engine. You should ask your friend to give us an update if he can.... = ) They also have a fairly radical sump design there, but I dont see any further developement on that, either.... tannji Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest REDZ Posted October 27, 2006 Share Posted October 27, 2006 The car has been stitting doin nothin. I don't even think he's even racing it yet. Richard the guy who owns it spend a LOT of time on R&D as you can tell from his web site. Its was sposed to be getting painted and registered but a think work commitments have stopped him. He had to get new valve springs for It caused it had been sittin for so long the old ones went soft. Alsil. Have you considered a Honda K series engine.? A K24 with a type s head and a big turbo would be an awsome street engine. Great torque, huge power, good drivability and economy. I came across some guys the other day that tried pushing some stock K series engine till they broke. K24 made 650 whp and the 20 made 590. they both died of broken rods from a boost spike. Mind you both engine were 100% standard and took over 30 pound reliably. Makes you wonder why everone keeps goin SR20 when theres such better choices around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsil Posted October 27, 2006 Author Share Posted October 27, 2006 al, dude... you started the 5.0. stick with the 5.0 hehe Ha ha yea......funny thing is, I'm so impressed with the LS motor in my truck if I were to put a V8 into a Z it's probably be an LS2 + T56...... RedZ - not into Turbos. Keeping it simple is the name of the game next time I do a car. Last time I threw EVERYTHING at my car at once and had nothing but issues. I'm looking to keep it simple as far as extras, and the most bulletproof drivetrain possible with good power and efficiency......sounds like an LS2 to me!!! Problem is, with a V8 id' still get lilke 15 mpg....heavy right foot..... Really the 2rz is more of something I was curious about. It pushed my 3000+ lb Tacoma pretty damned good, and it even towed a 10ft trailer full of crap from Campbell to Washington with it and STILL got 25mpg. Not bad for a little 2.4L 4 banger! I'm still in the planning stages since I don't have the money yet, so just fishin' for info. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest REDZ Posted October 27, 2006 Share Posted October 27, 2006 LS2 would be an awsome swap. SOOOOOO Illegal here in Oz though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsil Posted December 21, 2006 Author Share Posted December 21, 2006 So Tannji, how far have you got on the 2rz swap? Ran across this thread again and was wondering how it worked out. Might have a chance to start a project next year so I'm still fishing. I could go: 302 / T5 again LS2 / T56 or 2rz / 5 speed. Thing is about this swap, I bet the motor / trans is lighter than even the SBF swap (the SBF + T5 weighs less than the fully dressed L24 ) so suspension wise you'd have to cut a full coil out of the front springs (I had to cut 1/2 a coil for the SBF in the front) just to get it to sit flat. Plus since the motor is shorter it would fit behind the crossmember so the weight would be more centered. Got me thinking, but then I don't have any money at the moment, good thing dreaming is free...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg55_99 Posted December 21, 2006 Share Posted December 21, 2006 Ready to bolt up that Supra Turbo R154: http://board.marlincrawler.com/index.php?topic=28874.0 Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomsCoupe Posted January 19, 2007 Share Posted January 19, 2007 Id like to see some weights and dimensions of the 2rz/3rz. I'g liking this engine a lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsil Posted January 19, 2007 Author Share Posted January 19, 2007 On www.classic-celica.com forums there is a post that has the whole list of Toyota motors, with displacements, output, weight, etc. I don't think there's dims, but there's another post there that has them. One of the members dropped a 2rz into his '78 I think, look under "Projects". I'd post a link but my work filters sites and that's one of them for some odd reason. Because of the deep oil pan, it would have to be pushed as close to the firewall as possible, but I don't see it being taller than an L-series motor, especially with the intake not going over the valve cover. One company makes an intake that comes out the front, kind of like a shorter L28 intake. Also check out http://www.customtacos.com/forum/ Hope that helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavyZ Posted January 20, 2007 Share Posted January 20, 2007 Al, there's a 5.0 swapped 240Z on Craigslist today for $2000. All the expensive stuff has been bought. You should check it out. it may even have your mounts in it... Davy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsil Posted January 21, 2007 Author Share Posted January 21, 2007 Al, there's a 5.0 swapped 240Z on Craigslist today for $2000. All the expensive stuff has been bought. You should check it out. it may even have your mounts in it... Davy Thanks for the heads up, but $2000 is about $2000 more than I have to spend right now so I'm gonna have to pass......my wife's not done with school for 2 more years, so I'm stuck driving around my stupid nice LS-powered '02 Silverado until then But when she's done, IT'S ON!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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