Pop N Wood Posted March 11, 2007 Share Posted March 11, 2007 Got a brake line T to hook a bleed valve into my clutch line. Thought I had everything I needed to double flair some hard lines into the T. Now I notice all three connections on the T have I guess you call it a female taper. So the pointed bleed valve will work great, but how do I connect the double flair hard line? Do I need to get a different T with 2 inverted flair fittings and one non-inverted flair (for lack of a better term)? Man, everything on this swap takes 10 times longer than you think it will. First spend half the day just trying to find the brake fittings I bought months ago, and now this. I honestly think I have spent more time on line trying to buy parts than I have working on the car. Edit::: Maybe I have answered my own question? from this page The bubble flare is used with a male swivel nut, and seals at the bottom of a drilled and tapped hole, with a nice angled bottom. While it can usually be resealed, it has a limited lifetime - there's no good way to get back the deformation that was crushed out for the first seal, short of remaking the flare from scratch. Making such a flare is easy: if you are in possession of a standard 45 degree double flaring tool, the bubble flare is what results after the first half of the operation. Simply stop there, and you have the bubble flare which will seat nicely at the bottom of the hole. If you continue, inverting the form tool and finishing the job, you then have the more familiar double flare used by Girling and the US automotive industry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikelly Posted March 11, 2007 Share Posted March 11, 2007 I'm trying to visualize what you're doing here... Which Clutch master are you using? Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vashonz Posted March 11, 2007 Share Posted March 11, 2007 Why do you need a bleed valve in your brake line? Most people use the bleed vavles on the master cylinder and on the slave cylinder. Or is there somthing I'm missing or is your application not stock? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikelly Posted March 11, 2007 Share Posted March 11, 2007 It would probably be the part where he mentioned it was on his "clutch" line... Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pop N Wood Posted March 12, 2007 Author Share Posted March 12, 2007 No, not stock. I bought a TKO and LS bellhousing from Keisler engineering. They talked me into their hydraulic throwout bearing. You can see it this pic of the trans and bellhousing. They claim it is out of a BMW. It only has a single feed line. So to bleed the system they tell me I need a T right on the outside of the case. They say it will bleed fine. Normally they sell the hydraulic lines and MC with the trans set up. But since I was putting the trans in a Z they weren't sure about the line length etc. So like a dumb ass I tried to save a few bucks and build the stuff myself. When I later realized how difficult it was going to be to get the appropriate metric fittings I called back and tried to get the package pieces that I left off in the first place. But somehow getting the rest of the package was going to cost like $150 more than what they credited me in the first place. Everything should work out fine. But if I had it to do over I wouldn't have done buisness with Keisler. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vashonz Posted March 12, 2007 Share Posted March 12, 2007 All the different Hydraulic standards always confuse me. I would check out what BMW does. Or even get the fittings from a JY(cutting -3 tubing is easy) Then just re-flairing the hardline with the new fittings. Another solution would be to go to a reputabe hydraulics shop. I know a good one around here, but I don't know about Maryland. You might try checking on the thomas register. If you're not set on using a hard line it might be easier to make a braided line. It would probably be the part where he mentioned it was on his "clutch" line... Mike Eh, I was thinking clutch but typing brake. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lbhsbZ Posted March 12, 2007 Share Posted March 12, 2007 I think i understand your problem. The TEE you got uses bubble flare seats (like a little valley at the bottom of the hole), while your lines are flared to screw in to fitting with an inverted flare seat (little mountain at the bottom of the hole). Am I right? if this is the case, there are two possible solutions. #1, go out and buy yourself a flaring tool. Making a flare is a 2 step process....first you have to use the die that fits inside the line to make a bubble, then you use the conical shaped die on the press screw to crush the bubble making your inverted flare. You can make new hardlines using only the first part of the flaring process, and they will work in your new TEE. #2, if you have access to a lathe, you can make some small inserts that press into the holes in the TEE. I have a picture of one at the office I can post tomorrow so you know what I'm talking about. I think it would be easier to remake the lines with the proper flare for the fitting you have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pop N Wood Posted March 12, 2007 Author Share Posted March 12, 2007 I think i understand your problem. The TEE you got uses bubble flare seats (like a little valley at the bottom of the hole), while your lines are flared to screw in to fitting with an inverted flare seat (little mountain at the bottom of the hole). Am I right? if this is the case, there are two possible solutions. #1, go out and buy yourself a flaring tool. Making a flare is a 2 step process....first you have to use the die that fits inside the line to make a bubble, then you use the conical shaped die on the press screw to crush the bubble making your inverted flare. You can make new hardlines using only the first part of the flaring process, and they will work in your new TEE. #2, if you have access to a lathe, you can make some small inserts that press into the holes in the TEE. I have a picture of one at the office I can post tomorrow so you know what I'm talking about. I think it would be easier to remake the lines with the proper flare for the fitting you have. I have the flairing tool and a coil of hard line. I am making the hardware from scratch. Now that I know what a bubble flair is I just wanted verification on how to make one. Thanks. I like the insert idea. This guy had an interesting idea to cut them out of a 240 MC. I wonder if the inserts are available by themselves. Seems like it would be a bitch to machine those with a lathe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4everDATSUN Posted March 14, 2007 Share Posted March 14, 2007 what thread is the bleed valve, and what thread is the tee? ive got a ton of brass fittings here in the store and will be more than willing to help. im assuming your using 3/16 line and double flaring the line using 3/8x24 nuts... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pop N Wood Posted March 14, 2007 Author Share Posted March 14, 2007 what thread is the bleed valve, and what thread is the tee? ive got a ton of brass fittings here in the store and will be more than willing to help. im assuming your using 3/16 line and double flaring the line using 3/8x24 nuts... Thanks for the offer. I bought a bunch of metric fittings so the T and bleed valves are all M10x1, so I think I am set. Just need to get over this stomach virus so I can get some garage time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lbhsbZ Posted March 15, 2007 Share Posted March 15, 2007 I like the insert idea. This guy had an interesting idea to cut them out of a 240 MC. I wonder if the inserts are available by themselves. Seems like it would be a bitch to machine those with a lathe. They're actually quite easy, the cone just needs to be machined at an angle of 91 degrees or less, because the flare on the line is generally 90 degrees or more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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