datsun40146 Posted March 18, 2008 Share Posted March 18, 2008 I have another thread regarding this topic to see what’s going please read it. http://forums.hybridz.org/showthread.php?t=130048 For those who are lazy, I did all the body work and sent the car to paint, it was shot once and there were still dents and things so I had them redo it. They fixed the dents and re-shot, the pictures are the result. I want as many people's opinion on what went wrong, how to fix it, how hard it will be, and cost. I had heard everything from reducer being too hot to, the car not being clean, to the paint not being mixable. If you can't tell from the photos the paint has wrinkled on the hatch and lifted on the fenders. The car has been under base for longer than 24 hours so I know I will have to re-shoot the car, however I'm thinking I can sand down the hatch, re-primer it and shoot it with the rest of the car. My plan it to block/sand the whole car to rough it up, primer the fenders and hatch maybe the whole car and re-shoot it. Any thing wrong there? Hatch lifting fenders lifting/peeling Whole car shots mistake in body work This is a picture of the roof, you guys have NO idea how bad this roof was. I think someone got mad at the car and hit it mult. times and the jumped on it. It took me hours to get it right and about 2 1/2 gallons or glass. Its like sanding on a circle for God's sake. But its a smooth as a baby's butt now. Thats all folks let me have it please excuse the dirt, its been in my garage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Titus_RacerX Posted March 18, 2008 Share Posted March 18, 2008 Water in the paint gun lines? Wrong reducer possibly? I've never seen a pro shop do a job quite that poorly. I hope they will get it right! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datsun40146 Posted March 18, 2008 Author Share Posted March 18, 2008 He doesn't have it anymore; I'm looking for someone to come over for a few bucks and reshoot it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datsun40146 Posted March 18, 2008 Author Share Posted March 18, 2008 Information for the forums and future home painters I know in my case lacquer was not the problem, however any of the other cause could have been. Although I don't think this guy got his reducers mixed up as the effect is limited to a small area on the hatch and much lighter wrinkling on the fender in the area pictured. Lifting Condition: Surface distortion or shriveling, while the topcoat is being applied or while drying. Causes Use of incompatible materials. (Solvents in new topcoat attack old surface which results in a distorted or wrinkled effect.)Insufficient flash time. (Lifting will occur when the paint film is an alkyd enamel and is only partially cured. The solvents from the coat being applied cause localized swelling or partial dissolving which later distorts the final surface.)Improper dry. (When synthetic enamel type undercoats are not thoroughly dry, topcoating with lacquer can result in lifting.)Effect of old finish or previous repair. (Lacquer applied over a fresh air-dry enamel finish will cause lifting.)Improper surface cleaning or preparation. (Use of an enamel type primer or sealer over an original lacquer finish which is to be topcoated with a lacquer will result in lifting due to a sandwich effect.)Wrong thinner or reducer. (The use of lacquer thinners in enamel increases the amount of substrate swelling and distortion which can lead to lifting, particularly when two toning or recoating.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datsun40146 Posted March 18, 2008 Author Share Posted March 18, 2008 A buddy of mine on another forum made a good suggestion. This was his idea. Rough up the car and shoot a cheap clear on it as is to sort of "seal" the old paint from the new. At that point we would rough up and wet sand that layer, shoot new base and clear. What do you guys think? If I got anything wrong happy let me know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TravRMK Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 Re sand and smooth out the whole car, them spray a primer sealer then basecoat and finally the clear. What paint system are you using? I use RM products, and the primer sealer is wet on wet, meaning you spray the primer sealer, let it flash, then the base, let it flash, and finally the clear. All in one setting. What happened, and happened to me when I first started playing with paint, is the solvents in the paint go down before they come out, and if there is no sealer then any uncompatiblities in what is underneath will cause it to wrinkle, and or lift. It will do it worse in areas that were sprayed heavier, and may not do it at all in areas that had lighter coats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TravRMK Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 Oh, and don't seal it with a cheap clear, you might run into the same incompatiblitiy problems with the topcoats. Not to mention future adhesion problems that can arise months or years down the road. Use a primer sealer form the same maker of your paint, and clear. The key is to use all the same brand products. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
palosfv3 Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 Bear with me for a moment. You have put in a lot of time and money to get to this point. Yes you have had some disappointments and the budget is tight but think about how you will feel if it fails again. Following some of the suggestions made here and in the other thread will put you in that position. If your prepared to accept this result , then OK follow through according to those suggesting the quick fixes. Remember that this finish will fail in the near future and you may not even be able to get any new paint material to stick to this failed paint. THIS FINISH SHOULD BE REMOVED COMPLETELY AND STARTED OVER FOR BEST LONG TERM RESULTS. I've been painting cars for almost 40years and have seen this situation many times in the past. Your trying to find out what the the painter did wrong when he applied the finish. While there are many possiblities, It really doesnt matter. Its a bad paint job and needs to be removed. While you listed causes of lifting from some of the painting forums, you didnt list the proper ways to correct the problem . They should be listed as part of the complete package of information. Hope things work out for you. If you need to, drop me a PM or email. I'll be more then happy to provide you the proper info to solve the issue. For those that need to . Flame Away. Please if your going to give imput on how to repair something be sure your giving the correct info. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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