Doc Hawk Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 Did a searchie or five already. Signals and hazards come up all the time, but I didn't find this particular combo. My turn signal switch does nothing. Rebuilt a known good one off a parts car, cleaned and lubed (I've been inside a turn signal swich a few times now... cleaned rockers, lubed, made sure the BB was in the right spot... ugh). My hazard switch turns on all four indicator lights, solid. No flashie. Does this regardless of headlights, key position, or turn signal switch position. Should I swap out the flasher relays, or look somewhere else? Where are those relays on a 72? Is that them in the passenger footwell? If someone has a photo that'd be swell. Thanks for any tips. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S30TRBO Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 I'm not sure on the '72's but on my 1/71 I have two flashers one on the steering column and another on the passenger kick panel. One is for the turn signals and the other is for the flashers. If your hazard switch is bad it will cause the turn signals not to function either. Sounds like you have more troubleshooting to do. Good luck and keep us posted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Hawk Posted November 20, 2008 Author Share Posted November 20, 2008 Update: Swapped the flasher relay under the passenger footwell. Now the hazards operate perfectly. Still no response from the turn signals. Verified that the switch rebuild was good. Found one lead in the signal harness on the hot side that had backed out of the connector. Still no go! Is it multimeter time? Based on other's experience, it sounds like the hazard switch is the likely culprit, even though I pulled it and opened it and it looked clean. Perhaps I should use a multimeter to check the "off" position wires for continuity when the hazard switch is off? What lead to what lead? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S30TRBO Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 Did you check the blinker relay on the steering column? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Hawk Posted November 21, 2008 Author Share Posted November 21, 2008 Thanks for replying; without you I'd be talking to myself, lol. I swapped the flasher unit under the column (which serves the turn signals) with new. As mentioned above, I also swapped the footwell flasher, which serves the hazards, and that fixed the hazards from steady on to blinking. I found Ron Tyler's handy wiring diagram here (thanks Ron, where is that from?), and I think the best place to try and jump some wires is the green to green/yellow behind the hazard switch. Unfortunately that schematic is for a '78, so I am just hoping that the wires are the same color behind the '72 hazard switch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blown77Z Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 I'm having the same problem on my 77. I just installed the hazard switch (cleaned and reworked), which solved that problem, but still no turn signals. I tested every connection combination tonight and they all seemed good. I want to replace the "Turn Signal Flasher Unit" under the steering column to knock that possiblity out. Doc Hawk, where did you find a new flasher unit for under the column??? Thanks in advance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Hawk Posted November 21, 2008 Author Share Posted November 21, 2008 Junkyard, sorry. My parts car, to be exact. But the flasher unit I got to replace the old one is very different from the stock ones. It's only 1/3 as tall! I'll post a pic tomorrow. They look like they are pretty generic; I'd expect to find them at Kragen/Schucks/CarQuest/NAPA/whatever. I am starting to suspect a wiring issue. Tomorrow I am going to multimeter some leads and trace my hot wire back through the car. The green (middle) wire on the back of the turn signal stalk should be hot when the key is ON. If it isn't I'll start tracing it back through the harnesses and hazard switch until I get 12V. This thread should help: http://forums.hybridz.org/showthread.php?t=123434 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PanzerAce Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 Well, seems like you've gotten to where I was/am on my '73. My hazards work fine, the directionals just stay solid. what happens if you have your hazards on and then try to signal a turn? do all four go solid? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Hawk Posted November 21, 2008 Author Share Posted November 21, 2008 You're further than I am; my hazards work fine and my turn signals don't work at all. I'll test the turn signals while the hazards are on. For you, if you are getting a solid indicator with a turn signal, then it sounds like a simple replacement of the flasher unit by the steering column will solve your problem. Try swapping the two units and see if your hazards stop flashing and your turn signals work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blown77Z Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 Now I'm really lost/irritated. I replaced the cloumn flasher unit with a brand new one from Autozone. I spliced the wires from the hazard switch to give me power to the combination switch on the column (middle wire on the switch), and still NO turn signals whatsoever.... The hazards work just fine. Is there another flasher unit somewhere that I missed??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Hawk Posted November 22, 2008 Author Share Posted November 22, 2008 Have you rebuilt your turn signal switch? It's a common failure point. I have not seen a specific writeup... I should probably post one. Here is a writeup, photos to follow. REBUILDING AN S30 TURN SIGNAL SWITCH The turn signal switch is a common point of failure. It contains several tiny parts, and the front face of the switch is open, allowing contaminants to get into the switch itself. Most often, the contact points corrode, causing an open circuit when the turn signal lever is engaged. To refresh your turn signal switch, take off the steering column cover by removing the 6 screws on its underside. Next, separate the two halves of the steering column controls, which are the combination switch (lights, wipers) and the turn signal switch (blinkers and brights). These two halves separate from side to side by removing two screws on the top and bottom of the column, accessed from the outboard (left) side. Once the halves are separated, take a look at your wires. After almost 40 years, most of our Z's have had one or more rounds of hack artists mess with our wiring harnesses. What the manual says may not be what exists on your car. Protect yourself from pain later by using masking tape to label both ends of all wires before you unplug them. You can leave your combination switch attached, so don't worry about those wires. With the switch removed from the car, go to a clean work area. Do not perform this work over carpet, as you run the risk of losing the internal fiddly bits forever. I believe an OEM unit runs about $250 right now, and the wiring harnesses differ from year to year, so this is not worth taking a chance. At the base of the signal arm there is a crescent-shaped brass colored switch housing with three wires leading into the back PC board. Hold the assembly face down, so that the board and wires are facing upward. Gently pry the three retainer tabs up, so that you can withdraw the board. A little BB and a rocker plate will probably fall down into the switch housing - this is why you held it face down. Better in the housing than rolling across the table and into oblivion! Dump them out into a little cup and inspect the switch internals. It probably looks dirty and corroded, or at least heavily oxidized. A little contact cleaner and a wire brush will brighten it right up. Once everything is clean, dab a little dielectric grease in there to help avoid corrosion in the future. To reassemble the switch, place the little BB on top of the spring in the switch housing. Put a dab of the grease in between the forks on the wired board, and place the rocker plate on top of it. The grease will help the plate stay in place until you sandwich into position on top of the BB. Gently lower the back into position on the housing, keep it squeezed shut, and give the arm a few throws and make sure everything is moving smoothly. Shake the assembly and listen for your BB - if you got it wrong, the BB will be rattling around in there. If you are confident you have it right, bend the retaining tabs back into position. Mount it back up and hopefully you have some working turn signals! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PanzerAce Posted November 22, 2008 Share Posted November 22, 2008 You're further than I am; my hazards work fine and my turn signals don't work at all. I'll test the turn signals while the hazards are on. For you, if you are getting a solid indicator with a turn signal, then it sounds like a simple replacement of the flasher unit by the steering column will solve your problem. Try swapping the two units and see if your hazards stop flashing and your turn signals work. And there's where the problem starts, only one flasher unit under the steering column I can HEAR the hazards clicking from somewhere in the passenger footwell area (I think), though how much that'll help I'm not sure yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Hawk Posted November 22, 2008 Author Share Posted November 22, 2008 Your turn signal flasher unit is under the steering column. Your hazard flasher unit is in the passenger footwell near the sidewall, up under the dash. Things I wish the service manual would tell me instead of having to learn it on HybridZ. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PanzerAce Posted November 22, 2008 Share Posted November 22, 2008 well, probably the switch for me then, since I've swapped the flasher unit already. Probably clean that out this winter, and if it still doesn't work, I'll swap the flasher units or something to see if both the old one AND the replacement I got were bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Hawk Posted November 22, 2008 Author Share Posted November 22, 2008 It dangles in plain sight. Swapping them is a 60 second process. Go try it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blown77Z Posted November 22, 2008 Share Posted November 22, 2008 One of the first things I did was rebuild the turn signal switch. I'll look at it again to see if it's sending power from the middle wire to the turn signal wires... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Hawk Posted November 22, 2008 Author Share Posted November 22, 2008 Success! I wiggled the crap out of my newly rebuilt turn signal switch, and eventually started getting some intermittent blinking. More wiggles = full turn signal indicator function! PS: It occurs to me that some people might not realize that the ignition switch must be ON in order for the turn signals to work... didn't happen to me but that could cause huge frustration if someone didn't know that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blown77Z Posted November 22, 2008 Share Posted November 22, 2008 I just tested the turn signal switch. It's got power running into the middle wire on the switch itself, but when I move the switch down or up for the turn signals, the middle wire LOSES power...... Even when I try to jump power across the plug onto the turn signal light prongs themselves does NOT work..... The flasher that I replaced and the new one is good, I tested them both by using them to power the hazards, so they are good. Doc, did you bypass the hazard switch mechanism by splicing the power wire to the wire that runs to the column switch? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blown77Z Posted November 22, 2008 Share Posted November 22, 2008 After more testing the turn signal switch on the column LOSES power to the middle wire when I select either turn signal...... Even jumping power directly from the mddle wire to the turn signal wires gives me NOTHING... /irritated Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Hawk Posted November 23, 2008 Author Share Posted November 23, 2008 Doc, did you bypass the hazard switch mechanism by splicing the power wire to the wire that runs to the column switch? No, I didn't end up having to bypass anything. I did a power trace and my middle wire was hot behind the switch, so I figured it was the switch. I had already rebuilt and examined it twice, so I BFH'ed the switch until it worked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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