260Z + RB25DET S2 motor = badazz 260ZR and some ?'s

[rayaapp2]

Im finally getting around to dealing with my shift boot situation. The inner round transmission shift lever boot, The transmission tunnel rubber shift lever boot, and the center console shift lever boot.

 

 

I took the old shifter lever boot that goes on the transmission tunnel and cut the whole center out. I then cut a plate of aluminum out to match the old steel clamp. I drilled the 4 screw holes out and screwed it down. I marked and removed the plate for a hole just slightly larger in diameter than the round hole the shift lever transmission boot is and check for clearance of the shift lever in all gears. At least now its a small hole I have to cover. I bought a transmission tunnel boot from a early 240sx. I drilled out 4 holes and offset the pattern so that the boot lines up well with the shift lever. The boot is not straight up and down. Since the shift lever sits forward and to the right the boot had to be slide a little forward and the part that normally is the back or short side is facing the right side of the car. At least this is how it is for now.

ISIS Short Throw Shifter

Do not expect a short throw shifter when you order the ISIS unit. Despite its title, its not but 1/8" shorter at top and has a slightly lower thread collar for the shifter ball. So my measurements will be the same for the shift boot either way. The upside to the ISIS shifter is that its weighted as the top part of the lever is threaded on vs the stock shifter being vulcanized together with a rubber bushing. The rubber bushing is probably there to prevent me from bending a shift fork, but I live the weight of this one for sure.

 

 

Seat Belts

I also followed Lumberjacks thread on the 240sx rear seat belts. I have one side installed now. The guy I bought them from on Zilvia sent me a bum right belt. Its permanently locked because the plastic is deteriorated so bad. So Im waiting on a response on that from the seller. I replaced the stock 260Z belts because the inertia locks activate any time you try and pull the seat belt out to latch them. Ive lubed them up and cleaned them out an everything. I figured the old belts needed to be replaced with a simpler design with newer materials anyway. The side I did install seems to work beautifully. I will also get pictures up of this later. Im still working with the plastic cover for the retractor up top.

 

COSMO RACING EVO2 COIL OVERS

I also installed my COSMO RACING EVO2 coil overs in the front this afternoon. Didnt get to the rears yet.

Over all they work. However I have more complaints than anyone should have about a kit designed specifically for a vehicle. I swear COSMO took some measurements and went digging in their parts bin for parts that might work on a Z before they packaged them up and sold them. The coil over housing itself did not clear the insert shock cap. I had to grind the insert cap down. The coil over housing slide over the strut tubes well. The base of the coil over sits just above the original spring perch. I suspect when I get the car on the ground it will sit slightly lower than before, but I was really hoping for more. I guess its time to section the struts. Next bump in the road was the fastening hardware. Allen studs. The kit comes with an assortment of allen studs and o-rings by the way for multiple applications... Anyway the allen studs screw into the coil over housing piece at the top and at the bottom. Because the coil over housing actually fits well all the studs will be to long. I found this out once I installed the shortest ones and started to set the front down and chipped up the spring as the studs rubbed them. Final complaint is the the front bearing cap. There is a bearing up near the isolator at the top of the strut so the struts can spin with the wheels. The bearings will fit if you place the cone side down on the conical hat of the coil overs. One side of the bearing if they are like mine will have a slight cone shape that fits the hat. The complaint is that there is no retainer for the bearing. The bearing is an open type bearing not a sealed type and the fact that its really just kind of floating around up there, makes me nervous. I would not be surprised if the bearing moves and damages the cap. It would have been nice if these came with a weld on collar and the top of the coil over housing was not sealed to ride on the top of the insert cap. When I get around to buying new shocks I will likely cut the caps off of these and weld a collar on to the strut tube. I bought coil overs to be fully adjustable. I got partial adjustably and my ride height is limited. There is no way you are going to slam your Z with these. It will be low, but not uber low. Its definitely low enough though that speed bumps and such will be an inconvenience and your exhaust needs to be tucked well. I just fixed my 3" exhaust and its completely tucked under the frame rails except at the rear end where it needs to drop down to clear the R200 diffy.

Your choice COSMO or Ground Control. If I had the money I would have done the latter of those.

 

 

 

 

Edited July 27, 2011 by rayaapp2

[rayaapp2]

Exhaust Re-Design

I know now why no one spends the money on any of the downpipes out there and why everyone has so many issues with them. Poor quality, out of round(and out of size), thin stainless, warped flanges, and requires grinding to make fit even in a stock application. I used the XS Sport Down pipe to make my new exhaust system.

 

I made it work:

 

 

 

 

 

 

All tack welded up ready for the tig to finish it up.

 

 

Shift boot is ordered btw. Should have it according to them in a few days.

 

 

EDIT: 7/29/11 YAY! It runs again! sounds nice and healthy. Only took me 4 weeks.

 

Will have to wait for a test drive. Waiting for new shocks to arrive and may be installing my rear disc brake conversion in the next week. I checked and all 4 shocks are dead when I installed the Cosmo coil overs. GR2 shocks are killin me. Ive killed 2 sets and they are not even worth the warranty. Tokico Illuminas will be going in there.

Edited July 29, 2011 by rayaapp2

[rayaapp2]

Moss Landing PNP had 2 1988 SS models out there today. They were complete minus a pair of Recaros.

Both rear ends were intact until I got there.

 

I pulled both of them. Called my buddy up and had him come down from Tracy to come get the other one.

I made out good today. My Panda Express lunch fortune cookie said "fortune will shine on you today". It was sure right.

 

I kept the 117K mile unit in this picture and my buddy got the 222K mile one.

So for a moment I had 3 of what 1000 something ever imported.

[rayaapp2]

Gearing up for some bigger tires.

 

-Fronts: 17x9.5" (0 offset / 5.25" backspace 3.5" lip) with 275/40/ZR17 - BFGoodrich g-force T/A KD (extreme performance tires) (11" of total track width each)

-Rears: 17x10.5" (-12 offset / 5.27" backspace 4.5" lip) with 315/35/ZR17 - BFGoodrich g-force T/A KD (extreme performance tires) (12.5" of total track width each)

 

Traction control.

 

I will need fender flares and extended ARP wheel studs.

 

Another issue arises as well. Steering may be impossible at driveway speeds. Im aware of scrub radius issues here as well.

I will likely address the steering issues with this:

Subaru Forester Rack install

 

Parts look like:

1998-2004 Subaru Forester Rack N Pinion

matching outer tie rod ends.

1984-1986 Toyota Celica and others through 1988 Inner tie rod ends

Forester bellow boots

rb power steering pump and reservoir

Some custom lines

Forester power steering cooler unit

part of the forester steering shaft with the U-joint to mate to the stock Z shaft

 

Fender flares are on the list. Im up in the air about the Zforce wide ZG flares and the 280y flares. I like the 280y kit the best, but there is a lot of work involved to install those. Either way the car will have a really aggressive look and solve my traction issues.

 

Back to brakes. After contacting several rotor manufactures Im looking at the same rotors Arizona Zcar uses. Wilwood Disc Brake Rotors 160-2894 Right side example. $42 ea

The Wilwood 4 piston calipers run $150 ea

It sounds like the Wilwoods are a better way to go. I cannot come up with an extra $800 for Arizona zcars setup. Its just not going to happen anytime soon. I believe I can have the adapter plate made to mount these rotors to the 280z hubs I have. It wont be that expensive. It wont be anodized out of the box, but it will work. The brake caliper adapters are not that hard to make either. Its nice to have access to a machine shop though. It appears my only hang ups at the moment other than funds to get it going are the little ends. An adapter is needed for the brake lines from what I can tell. I will also need to figure out what pads to run with this setup and get them priced.

For the rear brakes Im working on installing the 280zx turbo rear calipers still. Again Im not using the standard master cylinder with all the associated proportioning crap. Im running a newer style MC so I will have to figure out brake biasing for myself after my initial install if needed.

All dreams at the moment but so was the RB powered 260Z for many years.

 

Cosmo Racing Coil overs dropped all the way down and Xenon air damn installed.

I will be installing the air dam with a pan like Yorgee's Air Damn Modification

 

 

 

stupid license plate laws ruining a perfectly sexy front end.

 

EDIT: Yes my house is backed up to Jurassic Park with all the Velociraptors, Tyrannosaurus Rex's, and what not... I think a Compy keeps getting into my chicken coop and eating my eggs since I find the shells cracked open and spread out, outside the chicken cage.

Edited August 6, 2011 by rayaapp2

[rayaapp2]

Well the wheels I was trying to get fell through. I will be trying to get something similar though.

 

I spent the day sectioning my front struts. Thats not easy. They are done though. BZ3099 Tokico Illuminas. I had to drill out the isolator hole for the shock to fit. Luckily I am using the coil overs so all I had to do was let coilover down and stick a wrench up on the shock tube(which is slotted for a 5/8" wrench) and tighten down the lock nut. Doing it by hand with a wrench is the preferred method if you dont want to smoke the seal.

Tomorrow Im going to jump on the rears, which Im expecting to be harder because of the drum brakes(front calipers can be removed from the strut without a brake bleed). Im installing a set of BZ3015 in the rear.

 

 

Would you believe thats with 2" of frame rail to ground clearance and room on the coil overs to lay frame... I think its gonna go up 1.5" in the rear and .5" in the front. Bumps are the enemy.

 

 

Customized downpipe:

 

 

Edited August 16, 2011 by rayaapp2

[rayaapp2]

So I went out today to re-program my PFC through my FC datalogit and hit another road block. The FC datalogit wont turn on. The LED will not power up and my netbook will not connect. So after some pretty extensive testing Im still no closer to finding out what has happened. I didnt touch anything over there. I even did a pin check and called apexi to see if they could provide basic testing. They didnt offer much more than plug a commander in and see if it works.

 

Anyone near Monterey Ca got a commander I can use? OR even another datalogit I can try?

 

Im 90% sure the datalogit is the issue. The PFC works perfectly by itself or even with the datalogit plugged in.

 

The LED is intermittent. Sometimes it lights up, but most of the time it does not.

I posted on the yahoo groups with no response. I have also emailed FC datalogit tech and Im waiting for a response.

I did a full pinout yesterday on the ecu live and disconnected for functionality. The ECU has good inputs and outputs. Thats why Im fairly sure the issue lies with the datalogit box.

Edited August 20, 2011 by rayaapp2

[rayaapp2]

Updated Tach Wiring:

 

So last time I posted I was using the GM ignitor unit to modify the tach signal for use with a stock tach.

I have a simpler way now. I found this by accident so I cannot give anyone solid techno-garbin behind this one.

What I did was connect the ECU tach output signal to the tach pickup wire for my 260Z(the single wire tach not the 2 wire induction type). At that same splice point I connected a 3rd wire and ran it over to a resistor. I used a load device(aka a light bulb). For those of you that want to find a resistor the light bulb came from a early 90-96 Q45 door light(bottom of the inside of the doors that light when door opens). You can look that bulb up and get the resistance for it and just use a regular resistor I would think. On the other side of the light bulb(resistor/load) I ran the wire to an ignition 12V source. This has been how I have been running the tach for the better part of 2 years. The bulb is mounted under the dash up against the passenger kick panel so its not an annoyance at night.

[rayaapp2]

Im getting a little irritated with FC Datalogit.

I emailed their tech twice since the 18th, and Ive posted about my issue on the YahooGroups FC Datalogit posts.

I have had ZERO response from either. Whats the point in having a tech email that they dont respond to in any kind of reasonable time line. I realize they probably dont work weekends, but they have had 3 FULL business days to make some kind of response up for me. Its not like they have to answer phone calls(they do not list a phone number).

 

 

Im not about to buy another one with this kind of support. Ill go AEM first.

 

Heres hoping they get around to me before to long!

[rayaapp2]

Still no word from FC Datalogit

 

 

It looks like I need to address the oil pan clearance with the car so low. I scrapped the oil pan drain bolt and scuffed the pan somewhere in the past week.

 

I think Im going to remove the pan and take it and an L series pan to a friend with a tig and see how hard it would be to build a custom high capacity pan. 8 quarts aught to be good. I definately want to shorten the height of the pan by .5-1" maybe closer to 2 inhces. With more capacity in a shallower pan Im hoping I will not run into any oiling issues.

I might tackle some baffle plates while Im in there with trap doors. We will see how hard it will be. I dont want to risk punching a hole in that pan. I was unlucky yesterday as someone knocked a large 5" in diameter rock right in my path on a 2 lane road with oncoming traffic at 50 mph. That might have done it, but I heard and felt it roll around and knock stuff up a bit as I drove over it as I clenched the steering wheel and winced. River rock vs lowered car... car barely won but took a serious jostling. My belly pan came out unscathed, but the exhaust has 2 small dings in it for sure.

 

 

EDIT 9/24 a full weeks since my first inquiry FC Datalogit has finally responded. I hope their next correspondance does not take another week.

Edited August 25, 2011 by rayaapp2

[rayaapp2]

Im half temped to build something like this:

 

 

For the RB. I like the quick spool of the little T28 S2 Turbo, but I really want to go to a top mount GTX35R or GT42R Garrett to make some real power. My goals remain the same. Im looking to make 550hp or LESS. Ive heard rumors of a few guys doing this kind of compounded turbo setup with very good results. Im half tempted to start a thread about it, but I think I will wait until I have a better understanding of the dynamics.

 

I can easily do the math to figure out how to plot my engine onto a turbo map, but there is a dynamic here I do not yet know how to figure out with 2 different sizes. Then there is the setup itself. It appears that some of these setups like in the picture above the larger turbo compressor blows through the small turbo with a bigger turbo. Im open to anyones thoughts on this kind of setup.

 

Mainly Im interested in the math to figure this one out. I only have a loose concept for mapping engines out and plotting them on turbo maps. I ignorant when it comes to determining theoretical spool up. Id love to talk to anyone that has an idea about this sort of thing.

 

Thanks

 

Ray

[rayaapp2]

Well my FC Box is off to the USA distributor of FC Datalogit for basic diagnosis. Hopefully they can find the issue. IF your wondering who the distributor is for FC Datalogit here in the states its Rotary Performance of Texas.

They made the effort to call me after seeing my posts on the yahoo groups forum.

 

I spoke with a few fellows about the twin turbo setup above. Now that I have a better understanding of how it works, Ive decided against it. I will eventually be going with a large single. The smallest one I would run is a GT35R exhaust A/R .82. Im also considering GT40/GT42 hybrids with smaller A/R's like .82, .63, or .48. My personal choice if money was no option would be the Garrett GTX3582R with a .63 or .82 A/R turbine possibly with a T4 flange.

 

Pics from yesterday...

 

Next point of interest:

 

Cooling:

My water pump is on its way out. It wines at idle. This just started happening. I found a source for cheap N1 water pumps and picked up a few. I need to go pick up a new belt and Im considering picking up an N1 oil pump while Im in there, but thats gonna be a different update.

I replaced the thermostat when I replaced the turbo a few months back. I just purchased a Champion Cooling 16" electric fan. Its rated at 15.5amps 2500CFM. I dont really believe it actually hits that flow rating, but it seem to do the job just fine. I also installed an Imperial Electronics fan controller. Its not the best out there, but I think I can make it do the job. I need to comb through the wrecking yards for a dropping resistor. I plan on making the fan a 2spd by installing a second 40amp Bosch relay and the resistor. I havent fully worked out the details yet. For now it comes on full speed ahead. The first thing I noticed is that the water pump stopped wining. That heavy fan and fan clutch must have been adding extra stress to the pump. Its a lot happier for the time being.

 

 

Wheels:

Well the Gold Enkie 92's came back off, got painted and sold em...

Old Black Enkie 92's got a set a of Kumho 225/50R15 mounted. Thats whats currently on the car.

I spent the money from the old gold Enkies on a pair of Rota hyperblack RBR 17x8.5" rims. Now all I need is 2 more and a set of 225/45R17 Kuhmos and Ill be set.... Whats that total wish list amount up to now? LOL

Edited September 15, 2011 by rayaapp2

[rayaapp2]

BD Turbo Cool Down Timer 2

 

 

So heres the deal.

 

In my car all the Ignition wires are tied to a a single 40amp relay that is activated by the old ignition wire that went to the coil.

The power that feeds that relay(ecu side) is fused and wired directly to my alternator/battery bus(I used one from an Infiniti Q45).

If you have relays down like the back of your hand then this should be enough description as to what Ive got installed. If you dont grasp this you should not proceed without help from someone that does.

 

So I have 1 8 gauge wire coming from my power bus to the relay and another coming from my ECU harness where all the ignition wires splice into. For example the Blk/Red, Blk/Wht, and Wht/Blk wires that feed pin 45, ECCS relay, and Fuel pump Relay. So my ECU is stand alone like this and almost completely isolated from the poor 37 year old wiring system in the car. I only have to worry about that 1 ign wire. Anyway what this has done is made it really easy for me to install my turbo timer.

 

We will call my battery side 8gauge wire Blue and my ECU side 8gauge wire Yellow for reference. Yellow is the wire we will be concerned with here. Yellow is the wire that you will be splicing into with the tan wire from the above diagram.

 

Other than that the diagram should be self explanatory.

You may not have to install the anti grind relay in the picture with this setup. The ignition should be off with the key and you will see all your gauges turn off and so should the power for the starter. I connected the relay up anyway, but could be a hassle until you get use to not being able to engage your starter until you depress your clutch pedal. BTW, installing a switch on the clutch pedal in an early Z isnt easy. Be warned. If you do not want to install the antigrind relay, dont install the brown wire or extra ground. That is it.

[5thgenluder]

Did you just turn your stock throttle body on its side? Or is that a Q45?

[David GArcia]

Updated Tach Wiring:

 

So last time I posted I was using the GM ignitor unit to modify the tach signal for use with a stock tach.

I have a simpler way now. I found this by accident so I cannot give anyone solid techno-garbin behind this one.

What I did was connect the ECU tach output signal to the tach pickup wire for my 260Z(the single wire tach not the 2 wire induction type). At that same splice point I connected a 3rd wire and ran it over to a resistor. I used a load device(aka a light bulb). For those of you that want to find a resistor the light bulb came from a early 90-96 Q45 door light(bottom of the inside of the doors that light when door opens). You can look that bulb up and get the resistance for it and just use a regular resistor I would think. On the other side of the light bulb(resistor/load) I ran the wire to an ignition 12V source. This has been how I have been running the tach for the better part of 2 years. The bulb is mounted under the dash up against the passenger kick panel so its not an annoyance at night.

 

I want to try to fit the stock tach to the rb25det can you make a small diagram..maybe it will clear up what you are trying to say. It would help alot.

[rayaapp2]

Did you just turn your stock throttle body on its side? Or is that a Q45?

 

Its a 96 Q45 Throttle body(s2 style TPS) non-traction control version on its side for clearance to the radiator hose and fender well. I could have installed it 180 degrees from where its at but there was no clean way of installing the throttle cable so I hid it underneath and made a bracket to bolt to the stud and bolts for the intake manifold to the head.

 

I want to try to fit the stock tach to the rb25det can you make a small diagram..maybe it will clear up what you are trying to say. It would help alot.

 

My setup will only work if you have a later style tach(a 3 wire setup) not the early one(4 wire).

 

 

Here is a basic schematic. You will have to hunt down the wire colors and resistive values. I do not know the current going through the bulb I have or Id get a resistance value. Maybe one day Ill break out the meter on it.

 

Ray

[rayaapp2]

 

 

Oil Pump snout drive collar

 

 

Just how little surface area drives the oil pump on any RB series engine... not much approx. 2 square mm on each side of the collared area drive the entire pump. This has to be the achilles' heal of the RB. This is stock. GTZ is making me a collar for the new motor below:

 

CXRACING GT35 Turbo Kit

 

 

 

 

 

CXRacing Turbo Kit GT35

 

as it came from CXRacing:

 

 

 

Manifold modified so that turbo clears Z fender!

 

 

 

My piping idea

 

 

Turbo inlet should end up being 3.5"-4" and I need to figure out a proper MAF for this setup.

 

 

And then I was bored and started cutting up front sump oil pans for fun. Doubt they will hold oil without seeping with those welds though.

 

Edited December 18, 2011 by rayaapp2

[wrcbonk]

David, I have a '71 240z with an inductive style tach. I am going the route shown in this link.

 

http://forums.hybridz.org/index.php/topic/37376-getting-your-early-240z-tachometer-working-with-an-msd-6-series-ignition/

 

I may have to play with resistors to get it right. I will let you all know. I have all the stock gauges working (functional, accuracy is still up in the air) except for the tach.

 

Bonk

[wrcbonk]

Ray, I responded to David's interest in tach ideas before looking at the INSANENESS you have going on under the hood. Good lord!!!!! My stocker isn't even on the road yet. Can't wait to see your mods live and in person.

 

 

Bonk

[rayaapp2]

LOL

 

Yes this can definately be described as INSANENESS. Its gonna be a while before its complete yet. Just in the works at the moment pending more funding.

 

I had an incident with a road hump last Sunday that took out my pan and now I have reason to complete my project pan.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I merged the 200zr pan with a front sump pan. I welded it up and checked for leaks I found a small seep and welded that up and then used POR-15 TSP US Standard fuel tank sealer to coat the pan inside and out. That epoxy sealer works great and is designed to work with fuels so it should hold up to oil. My only concern is that fuel tanks do not see 200+ degree temperatures.

 

 

Ray

[rayaapp2]

 

 

and a really bad picture that makes it appear that the pan slopes funny

 

I had to remove the sump pickup before dropping the pan completely, but when I was done modifying it I was able to install the sump pickup tube and then the pan. That was nice and clean(otherwise I could have had a gasket material mess). The pan clears the cross member and the bottom of the trans so its in good shape.

 

I also noticed something interesting. In the morning my oil guage pegs as where before it would push like 80-85 psi on the stock Z gauge. When the car is warmed up the gauge reads 15-20psi vs the old maybe 10psi. So my guess is that I did something right and before the stock 200ZR pan and matching pickup were not adaquate in some way(posibly the height of the pickup tube off the bottom of the pan with only 5 quarts cap.). Its also nice to have 7 quarts of oil.