streeteg Posted November 15, 2009 Share Posted November 15, 2009 Motor- RB25det Trans- rb20det Going from Original Clutch, PP and Flywheel to ACT HD pp and 6 puck clutch. OK so after 2 days, 2 slaves, 2 masters, a new clutch, pressure plate and flywheel- my clutch does not work. The last thing I have to do is put in my spare trans but I wanted to post up before I did so. Heres the deal. This weekend I replaced my clutch, due to the fact that my car because increasingly harder to get in gear when the clutch was depressed. I removed the slave cylinder and replaced it thinking that was probably the culprit, fully bleeding the system and it was not. Now the clutch was pretty much non existant. When the car was on and in neutral, depressing the clutch pedal did not allow the car to go into gear AT ALL. not even reverse. So I figured ok---- its all original stuff-- its probably screwed up so lets order a new clutch. I put everything in-- and still the same problem. We even adjusted the rod on the clutch pedal for more throw. Here are the kickers- New Clutch, PP Flywheel New Master Cylinder New Slave Culinder When you push the clutch, the slave pushed the fork the appropriate distance. The fork/Throwout bearing definately work they were tested before gpogm pm the car. Now--- Even though we 100% checked everything I thought MAYBE we put the clutch disk on backwards.... Doubtful-- but at this point my only hope.. So I drop the trans again last night. (The 2nd time only took an hour compared to the 4 it took originally... +1 for experience) only to find out thats not the case--- and were back to square 1 So where I sit now-- the original trans is on the ground I have a spare trans. The clutch and PP are off. and I am waiting for someone with a tad more experience to mention something I may have missed so that I dont go through all the effort of getting the car back together to have the same issue again... Can anyone help!!????? Thanks in advance- Eric Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woldson Posted November 15, 2009 Share Posted November 15, 2009 Will it go into all gears with the car off? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
streeteg Posted November 15, 2009 Author Share Posted November 15, 2009 yes it will. And when you depress the clutch to release it from gear when the car is off and in gear-- the car does not move as if the clutch isnt functioning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woldson Posted November 15, 2009 Share Posted November 15, 2009 So if you put it in gear with the car off, push in the clutch pedal, and CAREFULLY bump the starter, what happens? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
streeteg Posted November 15, 2009 Author Share Posted November 15, 2009 the car jumps forward Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xnke Posted November 15, 2009 Share Posted November 15, 2009 check the throwout bearing sleeve. It seems like it's too short, something that is common with using a different clutch assembly 240Z clutch needs 240Z throwout sleeve, 280Z clutch needs 280Z throwout sleeve, KA24 240SX clutch needs a KA sleeve, ect. they are different lengths. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
streeteg Posted November 15, 2009 Author Share Posted November 15, 2009 I am using the original throwout sleeve that worked on the car....its an RB20 transmission... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlatBlack Posted November 15, 2009 Share Posted November 15, 2009 Where did you get your master cylinders? I replaced mine, and the MC they sold me was too short, and I had to switch back to the stock rod that comes off the MC and attaches to the clutch pedal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
streeteg Posted November 15, 2009 Author Share Posted November 15, 2009 Here is a quick picture of the bearings that I am using. The one that is on the right came from the trans and was re used. The one on the left came from the spare trans--- AS you can see the height looks to be the same on both---- which is why they didnt work--- hwoever the one on the right looks as if the bearing was pressed too far down--- and it no longer has the reach--- however if you press the clutch in--- it should at least want to go in gear a little bit in my opinion... Anyway check them out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woldson Posted November 15, 2009 Share Posted November 15, 2009 Show a pic of the "ears"/"tab" height. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woldson Posted November 16, 2009 Share Posted November 16, 2009 (edited) i Edited November 16, 2009 by woldson double post Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
streeteg Posted November 16, 2009 Author Share Posted November 16, 2009 ears and tab height? Im not super experienced with the terminology--- can you be more descriptive? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woldson Posted November 16, 2009 Share Posted November 16, 2009 The parturitions below the bearing on the sleeve. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
streeteg Posted November 17, 2009 Author Share Posted November 17, 2009 Sorry for not being technical enough but I still dont know what you are referring to Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rejracer Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 Quit guessing and measure it! Take a straight edge across the bell housing and measure the distance from the throwout bearing surface to the bellhousing surface. Then measure the distance from the fingers on the pressure plate to the mounting surface of the back of the engine. If you have more than a few millimeters, you have the wrong clutch collar. On ACT clutches, they warn you when installing on 240z's that you must get a 280zx clutch collar due to the different position of the pressure plate. This being a KA, I don't know what the length is, but by searching or measuring the clutch collar that your currently have, you can know the difference. Best regards, Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rejracer Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 Another method of measuring is to assemble your old flywheel/clutchdisk/pressure plate and measure from the crank mounting surface to the fingers on the pressureplate. Then measure the new setup in the same manner. The difference between the two will tell you if you need to get a new collar. chances are the new setup is thinner from the crank to pressure plate fingers. Just for clairity the "fingers" are the springs in the pressure plate, the things that the throwout bearing rides on when the clutch is disengaged. Hope that helps. -Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
streeteg Posted November 18, 2009 Author Share Posted November 18, 2009 Quit guessing and measure it! Take a straight edge across the bell housing and measure the distance from the throwout bearing surface to the bellhousing surface. Then measure the distance from the fingers on the pressure plate to the mounting surface of the back of the engine. If you have more than a few millimeters, you have the wrong clutch collar. On ACT clutches, they warn you when installing on 240z's that you must get a 280zx clutch collar due to the different position of the pressure plate. This being a KA, I don't know what the length is, but by searching or measuring the clutch collar that your currently have, you can know the difference. Best regards, Robert I have an RB in mine--- and I found no info of the fact that the collar had to be replaced until now. I believe the KA collar is longer but I will have to measure today. The problem is before the clutch install everything worked! I will follow that process though to find out if the collar is long enough....we will see. Thank you though for the help. -Eric Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
streeteg Posted November 18, 2009 Author Share Posted November 18, 2009 Another method of measuring is to assemble your old flywheel/clutchdisk/pressure plate and measure from the crank mounting surface to the fingers on the pressureplate. Then measure the new setup in the same manner. The difference between the two will tell you if you need to get a new collar. chances are the new setup is thinner from the crank to pressure plate fingers. Just for clairity the "fingers" are the springs in the pressure plate, the things that the throwout bearing rides on when the clutch is disengaged. Hope that helps. -Robert Thanks for the explanation--- I've done clutches before but you have to be a lot more technical when troubleshooting so I am still learning all the terms. As I figure this out and get a different collar--- how detrimental is it if I get a collar thats too long. Can that be catastrophic or does that mean that the pedal will be maxed out before it actually touches the floor? -E Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rejracer Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 If it's too long it will constantly be as if you had the clutch pedal partially pressed in. While this does not sound too bad, a throwout bearing failure is just a matter of time. if its off by quite a bit you clutch would be constantly slipping or no engagement at all. You would notice the latter when installing the trans as you would be pulling the engine/trans together with the bolts as the pressure plate springs would be pushing the trans backwards due to the collar sticking too far forward. Are you sure the clutch fork is properly engaging the tabs on the throwout bearing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
streeteg Posted November 19, 2009 Author Share Posted November 19, 2009 Well I got a longer collar from a SR trans--- so before I put anything in measurements will be taken. I am sure the clutch fork is properly engaging---it actuates on the input shaft when the trans is out and you can see the indents of pressure on the fingers of the PP cause its brand new. MY guess isi its just not pushing it far enough. We will keep your eye out for the trans having to be pulled together with bolts--- but hopefully it gives me the few extra mms i need to get this thing to disengage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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